WiP in WiP, post your screenshots!
- Thread starter Arhurt
- Start date
RataDeOrdenador
L5: Dapper Member
- Oct 12, 2015
- 230
- 105
( Thanks to E-Arkham for the props)
Dam,that could be so perfect for my MvM map. In my opinion looks way better than the central building on Suijin.. :X
JeanPaul
L6: Sharp Member
- Aug 5, 2010
- 300
- 288
Striped Upwards for Halloween Reskin
I started like 2 hours ago.
I'm aiming to finish this by this year's mid September and it will be my first map.
I gave myself LONG time so that I can actually finish it or even add additional gameplay like the one in Helltower.
Ok, I got a small update(maybe rather big) on this one.
As I was taking parts down, editing geometry and adding props, I noticed how convoluted the way Valve makes a map is.
It is really hard to edit since
1. 90% of the geometry is a one big func_detail. Good for optimizing with some help from hints and area portal but it causes my hammer to crash whenever I accidently click it twice.
2. The walls are double-layered. The inside layer is a world brush and the outside layer is a func_detail. Thanks to this I have to edit twice as much. (or that's how it feels like)
3. Brushes are quite messy. In terms of optimizing, it shouldn't be any problem because it is also func_detail. But it becomes pain in my ass when I try to move one simple brush 8 hammer units right because it then interferes with another brush, which also interferes again.
HOWEVER, I am not giving this project up.
I am making the whole thing from scratch.
It should help me because then, I will have complete control over everything.
It will be quite a journey
Valve (hopefully) doesn't actually map like this, it's just a byproduct of decompiling.
ммα | ∂αиỉєℓ
L2: Junior Member
- Feb 10, 2015
- 65
- 31
Kinda got inspired by Asd417 and his upward project, and I decided to do one of my own. It's going to be a halloween version of 2Fort. Still on the fence about calling it BooFort or SpookFort. Besides a reskin i'm also working on some gameplay changes to spice this old map up a bit. Taken some ideas from TFC just to see how they turn out in TF2.
Malachite Man
L6: Sharp Member
- Oct 16, 2015
- 383
- 238
ммα | ∂αиỉєℓ I was actually thinking of making a Halloween version of 2fort where 2fort has been over runed by a cult but am interested to see what you make .
Glad to hear!
Also, if you are balancing 2fort, I suffest taking a look at this
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=910041
Someone fixed a bit so it might help you
ммα | ∂αиỉєℓ
L2: Junior Member
- Feb 10, 2015
- 65
- 31
The easiest fixes for 2fort would be to close off the extra resupply room in the basement — which only exists to benefit turtles — and move the top of the spiral to emerge in on the ground floor instead of the hayloft, so as not to funnel players past the enemy spawn. It's a good start.
How about the flag room? IMO, there should be one more sneaky entrance.
That still isnt a good fix. The reason 2fort has problems is because you have to get past a area just outside of the enemy spawnroom twice!
The main spawn exit can reach all primary paths in only 512HU. 1 sentry can overlook both entrances to the intel room. This is a bottleneck that is simply hazardous and the way to fix it is by being able to flank past them. And this is especialy noticed because the respawntime is faster than it takes players to reach the intel and walk back. So you have to face the same enemies twice.
For that both the main and basement spawn should be removed so you are only left with the battlements spawn, or the 1 way exit. This instantly prevents the main enemy entrance from being reached fast (the outside area on the right of the main spawn). But this still will not fix the '1 sentry can overlook both'. It only makes the walk longer to reach it (by only like 2 seconds when creating a direct path, or by about 10-15 seconds when not having one). However, as there is no infinite ammo supply there, getting your nest on that exact spot can be made harder. And to at least provide ammo during calm moments you can place a large ammo pack at the bottom.
Note that even in such case the sentry nest can be a major hazard, put when combat goes on for longer where the engy has a hard time to reach metal you are more likely to overtake them. This is shown on multiple valve maps where for example the gravelpit roof is many times camped by sentries and dispensers. You can create that same situation. And ofcourse, underskilled players cant take it out, but for good players it at least doesnt get into a frustration point. And once taken out, engineers cant take a direct path to that area. they already need to get past the battlements (risky) or take the same detour as attackers would take themselve. Once the area is lost you suddenly become at the disadvantage there.
The center of 2fort, even though its a sniper fest, isnt that bad. A decent player can quite easily find ways to get past it, especialy since even in a 3v3 sniper battle, they distract each other enough. But to be able to get out of the water will still be a welcome addition to prevent the long sewer path from becoming a pain. But those slopes in those videos are just ugly and feel completely out of place. For that widening the water section and having the slopes go in a L shape could already work nicely. or maybe just have the ctf_turbine approach of slopes. Never force players to take a sharp U turn on slopes, it forces them to look at the path more than at the combat that is going and this isnt a good thing and only anoys players when they die.
I like how you clearly literally stopped reading my post right where you cut off my quote.
I didnt, but since your statement (at least to me) was incorrect on what the problem was i didnt comment on that. But anyway, since i comment on that part again lets give my feedback on why i think you were incorrect there:
Even a spawn for turtles doesnt directly have to give a bad influence, it based on why it exists and where. In a CTF map you want to be able to get enough metal near the intel, on 2fort both upstairs spawns are too far away from that (2x going through the spiral isnt realy what you can call fast. in most ctf/cp/pl maps the walk for metal only a third of that length). Im comparing to maps that have proven to work even though they are in some cases turtle friendly.
A large ammo pack could provide the metal, but it would seriously hinder those that want to build 3 sentries as group of 3. They should still be able to do so, this is a part of teamwork aswel. In 2fort that extra locker is the fastest way to gain metal unhindered. And it is far away enough and at a place where a nest near that locker doesnt work (just below a staircase allows for some easy spam).
Stating turtling is bad in any situation is incorrect. Most A/D type maps force the red team to turtle. For a linear map this can still be the same because turtling can be the only way to defend against a team that is clearly stronger, it might in some cases give you the chance to defend. And this teamwork should still be rewarded. Against better players your nest in 2fort will still die because they can communicate to get 3 medics and 2 demoman ready to invade the area.
2fort only has the worst possible turtling because of that first barrier of a respawn room you already have to face. Thats where the problem starts, not at the bottom. Doublecross even shows a similar situation, except that map has at least some flanking options allowing you to completely avoid the sentry nest near the respawn rooms. In 2fort there isnt such option, there is 1 place only 128HU from the door where a sentry can look at all paths leading to the intel.
And yes, moving the tunnel can be a good thing on that. I will not argue on that (and thats why i didnt put that in the quote), but the lower respawn room is realy there for a reason.
Even a spawn for turtles doesnt directly have to give a bad influence, it based on why it exists and where. In a CTF map you want to be able to get enough metal near the intel, on 2fort both upstairs spawns are too far away from that (2x going through the spiral isnt realy what you can call fast. in most ctf/cp/pl maps the walk for metal only a third of that length). Im comparing to maps that have proven to work even though they are in some cases turtle friendly.
A large ammo pack could provide the metal, but it would seriously hinder those that want to build 3 sentries as group of 3. They should still be able to do so, this is a part of teamwork aswel. In 2fort that extra locker is the fastest way to gain metal unhindered. And it is far away enough and at a place where a nest near that locker doesnt work (just below a staircase allows for some easy spam).
Stating turtling is bad in any situation is incorrect. Most A/D type maps force the red team to turtle. For a linear map this can still be the same because turtling can be the only way to defend against a team that is clearly stronger, it might in some cases give you the chance to defend. And this teamwork should still be rewarded. Against better players your nest in 2fort will still die because they can communicate to get 3 medics and 2 demoman ready to invade the area.
2fort only has the worst possible turtling because of that first barrier of a respawn room you already have to face. Thats where the problem starts, not at the bottom. Doublecross even shows a similar situation, except that map has at least some flanking options allowing you to completely avoid the sentry nest near the respawn rooms. In 2fort there isnt such option, there is 1 place only 128HU from the door where a sentry can look at all paths leading to the intel.
And yes, moving the tunnel can be a good thing on that. I will not argue on that (and thats why i didnt put that in the quote), but the lower respawn room is realy there for a reason.
I suddenly got the mapping fever again. I made this in 2 days and is going to be called something like koth_eldorado. It is probably a bit generic, but i am proud of it so far.
