Vbot/motd usage

YM

LVL100 YM
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Dec 5, 2007
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Why are non-staff members allowed to change the motd?

I saw MOTD/Vbot go at 6 past the hour, 7 past and 16 past, that's 3 times in 10 minutes

Making fun of members should never be par for the course, and as senior staff you shouldn't be advocating it.

"wrong kind of fun"? Can we get this straight "post on your own account" isn't "stop posting dogs" nor is it "stop having fun" it's "keep the fun where the fun should be, and keep the serious where the serious should be"
 

Jethro

MUSty Complainer
Nov 2, 2009
287
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Why are non-staff members allowed to change the motd?

I saw MOTD/Vbot go at 6 past the hour, 7 past and 16 past, that's 3 times in 10 minutes

One of the MOTDs you saw was infact Crowbar changing his name to mess around. The other was Zahndah checking to see what the MOTD was, and then the regular hour-mark MOTD.
 

Ida

deer
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Jan 6, 2008
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"keep the fun where the fun should be, and keep the serious where the serious should be"
Where has it been decreed that the MOTD must, or even should, be serious?

Unless I've missed something, I think it comes down to your opinion versus the majority on that topic.
 

YM

LVL100 YM
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Dec 5, 2007
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That's the discussion this thread was made for @umbratile. And going by posts and ratings, 6 people have agreed with the sentiment that vbot should be for serious things rather than jokes. (~12 if you include people who agreed with Psy's suggestion to separate motd and dotd)

Around 7-8 people have posted/rated the opposite view that motd should stay for jokes.

So going by this thread it's actually a relatively even split, definitely not me vs the majority
 

Ida

deer
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Jan 6, 2008
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Fine, I guess that's a pretty even split when you count it out like that.

So, let's discuss, if you'd like. I want to know, why do you think it's important that the MOTD be used for only serious messages? Is there any genuine harm in humorous use? I'm having a lot of trouble seeing it and I don't recall seeing any explanations of it in this thread.

(not referring to the "NO DOGS" message, which I agree should be removed if the butt of the joke dislikes it)
 

YM

LVL100 YM
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Dec 5, 2007
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Good MOTD usage has been for threads of interest like the 72hr discussion then date voting.
Policy changes, rule reminders, featured map/downloads etc. That'd all be good for MOTD stuff.

All of the server/imp related vbot stuff is great. The server mapchanges being posted automatically is good since it signalboosts imp that are losing players, and the !maps !add commands are good since they require a user to trigger them.

Any automated, unprompted humour/silly/off topic things would be a bad use.
If the bot is to have any humour/sillies that the bot has should at very least require a user input, and preferably be on a separate account so it can be blocked separately. We really don't need a bot to automate humour and jokes. Personally I don't really like the the /hi command, but it's at least only activated by a user prompt. (Are people really that desperate for attention that they need an automated bot to say hello to them??)
 
Sep 7, 2012
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While I can't speak for YM, my personal opinion is that any "Official" TF2Maps.net endorsed posting or activity should be on topic and on the serious side of the humour spectrum.

This is because TF2Maps.net is the public face of level design for TF2, and a point of referral for both newcomers to the hobby, and industry-level people who might be interested in things that are going on in the community. This could include hiring staff from game developers, Valve employees looking to pick up a map or two for an update, or even academics in the field of computing or game design. Maintaining an on-topic public image aids the site's credibility and the credibility of its users as well. I've often added a disclaimer to people I've referred to the Steam chat: "If you ask nicely you will probably get some good replies to your question, but there might be some enthusiastic creative writing going on by other users." Now, most people will be able to tell the difference between the site itself and public users, but something like the MOTD makes the situation a little more ambiguous.

I enjoy a good meme as much as the next person, but I can find those on many sites online. Personally, I don't mind jokes and bad puns by site staff or on site literature as long as they are TF2 or mapping-related. Maintaining a "useful information to jokes" ratio per message might be a good idea.
 

Yrr

An Actual Deer
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Sep 20, 2015
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This is why Steam chats need IRC-style topics. So we can just put dogs into that, instead of having a bot say it every hour or so.
This is actually what I suggested the MOTD feature for, altho I am used to far less serious chats
 

Ida

deer
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Jan 6, 2008
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@nightwatch makes good points about the outward face of the site, but I don't know how much of it truly applies here. For having replied as much to the thread as I have, maybe I shouldn't speak about making a chicken out of a feather, but I feel like the talk of maintaining a public face is best saved for greater issues, and for spaces that are... well, more public (the forums).

I think we've got to remember that the chat is nothing but an ongoing conversation between people, a lot of whom know each other well/are friends. For the eight years I've been a regular it's never been a primary resource for anybody nor has it been much of a face for the site, and the addition of the bot has not made it so. Yes, people ask and answer mapping question, but the tone has always been light and casual and we almost never delve into deep discussions the likes of which can be found on the site.

Do you honestly think we're gonna put off any potential newcomers/professional visitors by putting a dog pic in the MOTD? Surely this is only a display of our internal culture, the way a company has a company culture, etc. If the MOTD linked to something excessively weird, obscene, or annoying, I'd be completely on board with you, but I don't think something as innocent as what it's been used for conflicts with any desire to keep "official" messages decent.
 

Jethro

MUSty Complainer
Nov 2, 2009
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It's a very big difference between say, this picture of a dog being posted in the very very informal group chat and the picture of a dog being posted as a site wide announcement.

I mean, if we want to talk about putting people off, I don't think jokey MOTDs is going to be what puts people off. You could easily argue that most conversations that occur can easily put people off. I'll just mention "hentai" and leave it at that.
 

Yrr

An Actual Deer
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Sep 20, 2015
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I honestly don't see much difference between it and "slow news days" where newspapers and media cover light-hearted stuff while nothing important is going on, but ultimately its just whatever the staff decide to use it for since they're the only ones who can use it.
 

YM

LVL100 YM
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Dec 5, 2007
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but ultimately its just whatever the staff decide to use it for since they're the only ones who can use it.
Yet according to swordfish, non-staff can set the MOTD message, so it seems really open to abuse :s
 

Idolon

they/them
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Feb 7, 2008
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While I think there's an argument to be made that the MOTD is part of the community's outward image, I'd argue that it's both an accurate and positive image.

As far as a dog picture being posted every hour being spam/annoying, sure, I guess. I don't find it that annoying myself since it takes up just as much room as Idolon is now playing Team Fortress 2. Click here to join, but I think the people who disagree have been adamant enough that it's a problem that it's probably a problem.
 

Fantaboi

Gone and one day forgotten
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Mar 11, 2013
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Yet according to swordfish, non-staff can set the MOTD message, so it seems really open to abuse :s

This is not the case.
 

iiboharz

eternally tired
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Nov 5, 2014
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I'm of the opinion the MOTD should be displayed ONCE an hour, on the hour. If no important info is needed in the MOTD, I don't really care what its contents are. Users who type the !motd command should get it PM'd to them.