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Ezekel
L11: Posh Member
- Dec 16, 2008
- 818
- 246
i know i'm being picky but i don't think carboard boxes usually get piled outside in such an environment due to their low resistance to the elements (rain disintegrates them, wind blows them about).
so unless they're being dumped as trash they'd be put somewhere sheltered. but it doesn't really look like those ones arebeing dumped as trash in the last pics.
so unless they're being dumped as trash they'd be put somewhere sheltered. but it doesn't really look like those ones arebeing dumped as trash in the last pics.
Godslayer57
aa
- Sep 1, 2009
- 573
- 323
Anyone notice that rexy hasn't got hidden dogbread on his todo list?
Also Crates 'could' work better than cardboard boxes.
Also Crates 'could' work better than cardboard boxes.
The last thing I want to do is cause something that would suspend your disbelief beyond an amount to make you to realize you were playing a video game. So I thought a long time about what I should do about this, and how to resolve the matter.
So I decided to test the durability of these cardboard boxes by placing them in water for an extended period of time. Check it out:
They've been soaking for almost an hour now, and so far, they haven't disintegrated yet. In fact, I don't think they've absorbed any water at all! I'll check back in half an hour or more just to make sure, but my thoughts are that they probably won't fall apart, because they're models, and not really made of cardboard. Thank heaven for that!
(TL,DR: I had fun testing the durability of the cardboard boxes).
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See, their thinking too into it, they are assuming that people have left those boxes there for a while. But, if 2 companies started fighting right in front of you, then your going to toss whatever you had in hands down and run.
The boxes make sense to me.
The boxes make sense to me.
You know that one of them will be saying "Guys? Guys? You're just leaving this stuff here? It's always me who does the tidying up isnt it?"
Then they will get killed in the fighting and their friend will go all teary whenever he sees how messy the place is.
Then they will get killed in the fighting and their friend will go all teary whenever he sees how messy the place is.
You need to either clip or join many of your sloping displacements. Even the smallest looking bump from slope to slope where they don't align would cause you to catch; and much of those split seconds were spent taking a rocket or scattergun buckshot to the face.
Secondly there are massive sightlines right down the centre of main paths making snipers very powerful. It's almost always beneficial to take the tunnels except when there are pyro's that keep you stuck inside if they find you in them.
The first stage CP 1 suffers from spy's dominating the center path when snipers aren't picking you off from pixel size gaps between 2 rocks, using the ledges and rocks to flank and observe attackers and picking off stray people incredibly easily. Is all they have to do is jump down onto you. Normally you could consider this normal gameplay but the ease of access to these locations for spies is too great.
As for defending, there's no much space on the ledge overlooking the central path to CP 1. You're literally hugging the wall behind you and it actually feels like you're bumping your head on the rocks that jut out.
Secondly there are massive sightlines right down the centre of main paths making snipers very powerful. It's almost always beneficial to take the tunnels except when there are pyro's that keep you stuck inside if they find you in them.
The first stage CP 1 suffers from spy's dominating the center path when snipers aren't picking you off from pixel size gaps between 2 rocks, using the ledges and rocks to flank and observe attackers and picking off stray people incredibly easily. Is all they have to do is jump down onto you. Normally you could consider this normal gameplay but the ease of access to these locations for spies is too great.
As for defending, there's no much space on the ledge overlooking the central path to CP 1. You're literally hugging the wall behind you and it actually feels like you're bumping your head on the rocks that jut out.
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I asked you in chat a little earlier, grazr, what kinds of things you would suggest to alleviate some of the concerns you have about the gameplay--frankly, apart from minor layout revisions, I don't have time for major changes before the contest deadline. This is a little disappointing, considering this layout has been the same for a few months...this is the kind of information I would have liked to have a long, long time ago.
In other news, more detail information going on, and todo items being finished up. Check here for the list, and below for some images.
In other news, more detail information going on, and todo items being finished up. Check here for the list, and below for some images.
Ezekel
L11: Posh Member
- Dec 16, 2008
- 818
- 246
in versions i've played (not played a version of zig in a good month or so), the only issue i've really had gameplay wise is the forward exit for blue getting pyro camped. it was mentioned by others as well, so i think you're already aware of that, so it's probably not an issue anymore.
I never really noticed snipers abusing long sightlines myself, although thinking about it once the setup gates are open, blue are a little exposed as they approach the gates from the spawn area but only from red players that are at certain angles, and the red players don't have any health/ammo nearby to keep them there, so it's probably not an issue to be concerned over.
(just saying that maybe the sniper issue isn't as bad as it seems, perhaps it was player-related more than map related?)
detailing wise, looking strong.
personal preference: i'm not too keen on all the lil black spots you've got on the rock textures, but i'm guessing that's just me as i've never heard anyone else say anything about them.
other than that, you need more cardboard-box filled bodies of water inside of cave systems. XD
i may have just had bad luck to miss the tests of the other stages. how are those coming along? will they be in the contest entry or are you going to settle with a single stage map for the contest and add the other 2 stages later on when you have the time?
I never really noticed snipers abusing long sightlines myself, although thinking about it once the setup gates are open, blue are a little exposed as they approach the gates from the spawn area but only from red players that are at certain angles, and the red players don't have any health/ammo nearby to keep them there, so it's probably not an issue to be concerned over.
(just saying that maybe the sniper issue isn't as bad as it seems, perhaps it was player-related more than map related?)
detailing wise, looking strong.
personal preference: i'm not too keen on all the lil black spots you've got on the rock textures, but i'm guessing that's just me as i've never heard anyone else say anything about them.
other than that, you need more cardboard-box filled bodies of water inside of cave systems. XD
i may have just had bad luck to miss the tests of the other stages. how are those coming along? will they be in the contest entry or are you going to settle with a single stage map for the contest and add the other 2 stages later on when you have the time?
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There are no other stages at the moment that have been tested. A layout for stage 2 is only about half done, and I abandoned it until after the contest. I decided it was more important to me to complete one entire stage, fully detailed--which meant having to focus on the creation of new materials to complete the theme-set.
Another reason I decided to focus on one stage is because I understand my layout skills are really not as good as other skills. This meant that I really wanted to have one stage and test it rigorously, and I feel my testing has paid off--however my opinions on play balance really mean little. It's up to the opinions of the players on whole.
However, I do want to emphasize that this is the first stage of a 3 stage map, and the win ratio should be higher for blu than red. I'm pointing this out to try to dispel the misconception of imbalance as much as I possibly can. But what else can you do? Other than link to win ratios of the current versions, not too much. But here they are (keep your eye on # of rounds):
http://feedback.tf2maps.net/map/cp_zig_stage_a_16/
http://feedback.tf2maps.net/map/cp_zig_stage_a_15/
http://feedback.tf2maps.net/map/cp_zig_stage_a_14/
http://feedback.tf2maps.net/map/cp_zig_stage_a_13a/
Also, I'll leave you with this picture:
Another reason I decided to focus on one stage is because I understand my layout skills are really not as good as other skills. This meant that I really wanted to have one stage and test it rigorously, and I feel my testing has paid off--however my opinions on play balance really mean little. It's up to the opinions of the players on whole.
However, I do want to emphasize that this is the first stage of a 3 stage map, and the win ratio should be higher for blu than red. I'm pointing this out to try to dispel the misconception of imbalance as much as I possibly can. But what else can you do? Other than link to win ratios of the current versions, not too much. But here they are (keep your eye on # of rounds):
http://feedback.tf2maps.net/map/cp_zig_stage_a_16/
http://feedback.tf2maps.net/map/cp_zig_stage_a_15/
http://feedback.tf2maps.net/map/cp_zig_stage_a_14/
http://feedback.tf2maps.net/map/cp_zig_stage_a_13a/
Also, I'll leave you with this picture:
Thanks for that Eyce, it's actually a place where 2 displacements intersect, one of the few places in the map where this happens. I've gone ahead and masked it with some rocks.
Some work on skybox cards! (also, large images ahead)
Some work on skybox cards! (also, large images ahead)
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Goombac
L4: Comfortable Member
- Mar 27, 2010
- 172
- 84
Dayum, not that it didn't look good before, but man those trees really bring the environment together. Really feels like you're in a mine lost in the middle of a forest.