KotH Basalt rc2

By S.W.A.T.Y

  1. S.W.A.T.Y

    S.W.A.T.Y Banned

    Messages:
    315
    Positive Ratings:
    115
    I finally got some time to release RC1. This version has the huge changes that I have made to the map.
    First, it has a whole second floor above the point which makes this a unique KOTH map and a bunch of other stuff.
    Updated first post with new pics/info.


    Download
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?p=135484#post135484


    Change Log from B2 to RC1

    -Retextured mid building.
    -Improved fps via occoluders.
    -Lowered the middle building.
    -Added more cover around the cap point.
    -Added more lights around the cap point.
    -Added a whole second floor above the cap point.
    -Fixed a lot of player clipping problems.
    -Made the spawns bigger.
    -Added a ton more detail to the map.
    -Added stairs when taking the right route.
    -Fixed the ramp going up to the point being too steep.
    -Added another health cabinet in the spawn.
    -Fixed some problems with some props with no collision.
    -Added a small ammo pack above the cap point.
    -More detail to the spawns.
    -Fixed a problem with the skybox.
    -Made the hallway to the right when you spawn bigger.
    -Fixed a problem with the cap point where it could be capped standing outside.
    -Fixed a problem getting stuck to get to the point.
    -Retextured the roofs on some of the buildings.
    -Made the ramp to the point higher.
    -Fixed a problem with the doors being open by the other team.
    -Fixed a problem with the displacements in some places.
    -Added small ammo packs under the bridge.
    -Fixed some ugly shadows in some areas.
    -Added ambient sound.
    -Removed one of the exit spawn doors to simplify it.
    -Shorten the distance of both of the exit spawn doors.
     
  2. TMP

    aa TMP Abuser of Site Rules

    Messages:
    948
    Positive Ratings:
    554
    People thought you should just let soldiers/demos get there for your previous comment.

    I like the way it looks. I should get around to playing this. It's a very nice look. The building having open walls is pretty cool, plus it looks neutral. I just figured the guys building it had to run away because blu and red began fighting, or something like that or whatnot.
     
  3. lana

    aa lana Currently On: ?????

    Messages:
    3,077
    Positive Ratings:
    1,389
    Well, soldiers have rockets and demomen have sticky bombs and they can jump on them and they can fly up.
     
  4. McNuggetFiend

    McNuggetFiend L3: Member

    Messages:
    149
    Positive Ratings:
    50
    But there are seven other classes in the game :/
     
  5. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

    Messages:
    5,437
    Positive Ratings:
    3,780
    You know there is a reason there are no ramps to B's roof in gravelpit. The same reasoning applies here.
     
  6. The Political Gamer

    aa The Political Gamer

    Messages:
    4,468
    Positive Ratings:
    1,706
    Why are the bases the same texture repeated? I mean thats stuff you would have in alphas. I thought by the time you reach rc there is a bit more verity in the texturing.

    EDIT:
    [​IMG]

    It looks like you just used the same props and just flipped them.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2010
  7. S.W.A.T.Y

    S.W.A.T.Y Banned

    Messages:
    315
    Positive Ratings:
    115
    nah, thats a retarded idea to take out the ramps, ramps staying.
     
  8. McNuggetFiend

    McNuggetFiend L3: Member

    Messages:
    149
    Positive Ratings:
    50
    I also, am not a fan of said lack of ramp. :/
     
  9. S.W.A.T.Y

    S.W.A.T.Y Banned

    Messages:
    315
    Positive Ratings:
    115
    Entered the map for testing on Saturday 6 U.S. Server
     
  10. ScorpioUprising

    aa ScorpioUprising

    Messages:
    402
    Positive Ratings:
    379
    Is it because you want defense to have even MORE incentive to hold and defend B? Cuz, I mean, that seems like a pretty bad idea to me.
     
  11. McNuggetFiend

    McNuggetFiend L3: Member

    Messages:
    149
    Positive Ratings:
    50
    I said I'm not a fan but of course it makes sense to not have everyone access the top of B. But in the context of this map, I think the other classes should have access to the upper level. Back to Basalt.
     
  12. lana

    aa lana Currently On: ?????

    Messages:
    3,077
    Positive Ratings:
    1,389
    The hill already has a height advantage. As the height of a player increases, so does his advantage. Therefore, you're making a difficult to secure position even more difficult to secure.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  13. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

    Messages:
    5,437
    Positive Ratings:
    3,780
    Have you researched into any existing maps and how the points are class balanced, at all? The point of KOTH is to not have the capability to directly defend the point; but the areas around it.

    There are no health or ammo kits on the point area(s) because it over powers the immediate defence of it. The point of KoTH in particular is for the control point to switch teams several times before the match ends (this is why we have the team based count downs and the capability to recap, unlike arena). This allows for a failed assault attempt to recover and easily mount counter attacks that have a generally large chance for success (depending on enemy team cohesion). This wont happen if you encourage turtling tactics (and directly on the point no less). The team that wins the initial push will get a sentry in the rafters and "skirmish" the losing team with assault classes for 3 minutes if they had any sense to abuse this otherwise "intended" advantage.

    I've tried to make logical alternative layout suggestions for you, S.W.A.T.Y., whilst the majority of people slag off your work and/or attitude to most of your acquired feedback. I've tried to be more mature than most about it by commenting on your map, and ignoring the drama that unfolds in each and every one of you map threads. You don't even have to take my feedback, but calling advice (from anyone) "retarded" is one way to deter any future feedback for any of your existing or future works; which your map in question quite clearly needs.

    I'm hounded on STEAM constantly, and PM'd on the forums to provide feedback for peoples maps. So when i choose to provide feedback you should choose to listen. And less smart ass mouthing off to said feedback.

    Then maybe people will start to take you a little more seriously around here.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 9
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2010
  14. S.W.A.T.Y

    S.W.A.T.Y Banned

    Messages:
    315
    Positive Ratings:
    115
    is this the part where im suppose to care ?
     
  15. The Political Gamer

    aa The Political Gamer

    Messages:
    4,468
    Positive Ratings:
    1,706
    Well it looks like you do care! Case in point:
    Why would you put it up for gameday if you really don't care?
     
  16. Void

    aa Void Local Man Unable To Map, Sources Say

    Messages:
    1,835
    Positive Ratings:
    2,887
    Alright. Lets kick some ass and take some names.

    [​IMG]

    1. Those lights aren't emitting light, and in this case can not be defended as a stylistic choice. You need those to emit light.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    2. Incredi-dark. Just because it looks good to you doesn't mean it works well in gameplay. In darkness it's hard to identify player's team colors, along with sentries.

    [​IMG]

    3. Sightlines. He who controls the cap controls the top of the cap building. He who controls the top of the cap building controls this sightline.

    [​IMG]

    4. Skycards don't play well here. Either match them with the fog or match the fog with them.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    5. Align your wood, buddy. You have lots of wood and even more misaligned wood textures. Which doesn't make sense, but you get the idea - align your textures. Alt-right-click is your friend.

    [​IMG]

    6. More unaligned textures. This isn't an isolated incident, either. It's on quite a few of your Badlands displacements.

    [​IMG]

    7. Think like an engineer for a second. No, not the sentry-building hardhat. A real engineer. Does this look structurally efficient? Would someone really put random metal ramps in a wooden building? The fact that it's a game does not rule out structural efficiency.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    8. Ctrl-C. Ctrl-V. There's more to detailing then just a retexture. Switch things up a bit. Oh, and in that second picture? Due to the darkness, I didn't see that Demoman until a few seconds after taking that screenshot.

    Think about it. Try to, atleast.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  17. Crash

    aa Crash func_nerd

    Messages:
    3,230
    Positive Ratings:
    5,128
    Caring if people take you "seriously" as a mapper and trying to have your map tested for gameplay purposes are pretty different things.

    But I'd say people seem to take him pretty seriously, considering they take the time to post in his thread and offer advice to make his map better.

    edit: From what I played, it wasn't bad. I like the decision to not have any health or ammo on the point though. Makes the already powerful defensive tower a little less powerful. I'd look into possibly a few other tweaks to balance it out.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2010
  18. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

    Messages:
    4,769
    Positive Ratings:
    5,550
    Honestly I found the control point all around un-fun whether attacking or defending. It's rather cramped. Trying to move around on the top floor is a little annoying because of all the holes you can fall through.

    The most significant issue I found though, was the skeleton structure itself. When you are up there moving around it is very hard to see people outside on the ground because of the constant relative motion of the beams across your vision. It makes it harder to see a small player moving around on the static background.
     
  19. Mr.Blob

    Mr.Blob L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

    Messages:
    573
    Positive Ratings:
    249
    From what I noticed today when playing it, massive sniper lines. and also too dark on the blue side. - Outside of spawn is a very large sniper line -> narow "path" which is dominated by snipers. - Just a thought
     
  20. honeymustard

    honeymustard L9: Fashionable Member

    Messages:
    698
    Positive Ratings:
    287
    From testing it, I would suggest moving the spawn room into the center, to encourage people to use both the right and the left exits. At the moment, 90% of people go left because it's right there. But the right route (which leads to the sniper deck) is hardly ever used, which means I was finding a lot of opposing team members (mostly heavies) just camping the right buildings and our sniper deck.