PLR Panic b2

By Ravidge

  1. Tinker

    aa Tinker

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    Obviously, it needs to be inserted into a giant tapedeck that transmits the opposite team's dear secrets very loudly to the world (with possible beatbop backing).
     
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  2. Ravidge

    aa Ravidge Grand Vizier

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    Turbo bump.

    I started re-theming stage 1 back in early February (2011). And well, I think in total I've opened the vmf 8-9 times since that day. So the work pace hasn't been very fast.

    But, I think this new look is better and it's actually kinda complete so I snapped some screenshots:
    It's a basic compile, so no HDR or vertexlit models, keep that in mind.
    [​IMG]
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    Feel free to point out bad detail decisions, I'm really not good at this stuff.
     
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  3. Fr0Z3nR

    aa Fr0Z3nR Creator of blackholes & memes. Destroyer of forums

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    misaligned floor in pic 2 :p

    The one thing that i notice though is that everything is cream color, maybe find a way to get some color into it?
     
  4. Seba

    aa Seba DR. BIG FUCKER, PHD

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    First off: I love all the arched architecture. Looks really nice.

    The 'no tresspassing' sign in the first pic is in an odd place. IMO ideally it would go on the metal door; but if it's going on the wall, I'd have it around player-head-level. The second pic's detailing bothers me - I think it's because of the indoor dumpsters. Third screenshot: put something on that wooden board, maybe? Four: I'd add an ending to the handrails and move them a bit away from the wooden supports. Five: I'm not sure about that bulldozer behind the fence, the white pipe on the roof, and the two low fans. Six: I think that the recessed areas could be a bit deeper and with supports.
     
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  5. Harribo

    aa Harribo

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    I think the lights in picture 1 looks too close together, i'd get rid of one and center it. The PL track's last cap on that stage not connecting to anything to move it to stage 2 I find really odd, usually the detailing gives the impression that the same cart is moved onto stage 2 but yours ends in the middle of nowhere, perhaps have it sink into the ground like in pl_goldrush. Also the arches in the last picture could use some wood trim imo
     
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  6. Regularjoe

    Regularjoe L1: Registered

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    I am a huge fan of panic, so I am really happy to hear that you are working on it. I'm hoping it can become official someday.

    However, after considering harribo's post something started bothering me.
    If you are trying to activate some kind of secret device, why are you pushing a bomb to it?

    Maybe you could replace the bomb with something more computer-ish. Then getting to the end of the first stage first could win you control of that radio tower (I dunno how you'd represent that). It would be a much cooler ending than having the cart sink into the ground.
     
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  7. Citizen Snips

    Citizen Snips L3: Member

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    Eh; replacing the cart rarely ends well. Hoodoo is kind of glitchy with it, and Frontier has problems with the game detecting when you're actually on it.
     
  8. Ravidge

    aa Ravidge Grand Vizier

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    Switching cart model is literally a 1 keyvalue edit on 1 prop_dynamic.
    So there is no technical issues as such.

    If those maps have problems, they would have the same problems with any model.
     
  9. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    As much as i love the construction pack, the scaffolding smacks the shit out for your FPS. Just 4 of the ones with planks and a couple of the vices reduced an alpha map of mine from 300 to 180 FPS. Try to keep the number of scaffolding props to low numbers in areas.
     
  10. Ravidge

    aa Ravidge Grand Vizier

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    I find this hard to believe. Can someone replicate this phenomenon reliably?
    4 of the scaffold_256.mdl is about the same tricount as 1 hydro dumptruck.

    I'm building with the more optimized modular bars (28tris) + clamps (97tris, lods down to 28). These are just 8 sided cylinder primitives. I just can't imagine how they would be the culprit of any major fps drop like that.
     
  11. Loc_n_lol

    Loc_n_lol L10: Glamorous Member

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    I like the newly added architecture and detail. The 3D skybox could use some love though, even if it's just a line of tree cards.
     
  12. Citizen Snips

    Citizen Snips L3: Member

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    On a completely unrelated note, I think that at Stage 3, there should be a slightly longer delay before the cart starts falling.

    Most of the time, when I've played with the uninitiated, they don't realize that the cart is falling until it's teetering off the edge, and I have to shout "GET TO THE CART GO GO GO" at the beginning of the round. Maybe an additional second or two would give people enough time to mosey over to the cart before it starts slipping away.

    There's also the fact that I always play Spy on Stage 3, chilling at the top of the hill and backstabbing anyone who approaches with the other cart, so I depend on my teammates to push ours, and if they have no idea what to do, then we're kind of screwed.
     
  13. tyler

    aa tyler

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    That is a problem with new players and not with the map, same as learning any other map
     
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  14. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    Let me be a little more accurate about what i used: I used a total of 4 catwalk pieces, 10 medium poles, 4 small poles, 12 clamps and 8 bases. Using only the 4 catwalk pieces to test performances drops it dropped to 260 FPS; including everything else my FPS dropped to 180. The map in question is essentially alpha and of no significant other detail and already optimised.

    I was really disappointed.
     
  15. Fr0Z3nR

    aa Fr0Z3nR Creator of blackholes & memes. Destroyer of forums

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    I used more than that in backlot and after I was done optimizing I don't think I had issues with FPS. At least I was never told of issues.


    The fact that you are dropping from 300 to 180 is notable, but I don't know how relevant it would be when most people run vsync'd at 60ish.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2011
  16. PMAvers

    PMAvers L6: Sharp Member

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    Part of me wonders how it'd work if the bomb would stop rolling back at the "base" point, but instead the enemy team could slowly push the bomb from there off the edge. Would stop any "oh shi-" accidental losses/raging at the map, and make them focus on the enemy team being pricks for pushing it.
     
  17. Sergis

    aa Sergis L666: ])oo]v[

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    300, 260, 180 is still a very high framerate. what is your regular framerate? would adding 4 props that are not scaffolding not had such effect?

    i believe quickly dropping high framerate is a poor indicator of prop computational expensiveness. roughly speaking, rendering extra 20 polygons when only 20 other polygons are rendered(bare alpha) is obviously doubling the render amount, while adding the same 20 polygons when 2000 other polygons are rendered(detailed map) will have much less dramatic effect.

    if i look into skybox ingame so that only skytexture is rendered, i get 300 fps. zooming back so that 9 or so displacements are visible drops me to 200 simply because the engine actually has to render something now. looking at more and more complex scenes, the fps drop slows down ( unfortunatelly never stopping :D )

    a few scaffoldings quickly dropping framerate of a bare alpha should not be a problem. however, if they drop the framerate as significantly in already detailed maps, then they are a problem.
     
  18. Ravidge

    aa Ravidge Grand Vizier

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    I experimented a bit and I can't make it happen on my end. This is the test map I built: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1281220/fps_test0003.jpg

    And here are my results:
    Empty: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1281220/fps_test0000.jpg 0 tris - 295 +/-5 fps
    Scaffolding: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1281220/fps_test0001.jpg 16302 tris - 287 +/-5 fps
    Hydro props: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1281220/fps_test0002.jpg 11952 tris - 287 +/-5 fps

    I'm not out to get you grazr, but this is the first time I hear something like this about the models, and I would like to know if it's true, and if it's something I could fix.
     
  19. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    TF2 runs at a constant 300 FPS for me on all maps. I run a GTX 460, which is more than what most people run, so when my FPS dips i consider the fact that the affects are potentially much more severe for the average player. That's all my concern is; that ontop of the fact i wanted to add more detail to the area as it was only the first version of the beta of the map and featured no other detail in the immediate area other than 4 containers which had been there since A1 and for each of the previous 3 bridge designs that featured near equal amounts of detail.

    If you're not having issues Ravidge then don't pay me any mind. I know you're not out to get me, I just thought i'd warn you as my experiences with the scaffolding has largely been negative in regards to performance. My map with moderate use of the scaffolding suffered significant FPS drops and more specifically - by looking at the bridge, looking away returned the FPS to reasonable levels; and the map without the scaffolding had no such issues so i assumed it was related to said props.

    I'll route around for the related bsp's in the morning (with and without the scaffolding) and send them your way. I never pubicly released them because of said performance issues, hopefully i still have a compile of the un-used bridge design.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2011
  20. Melvin D Engineere

    Melvin D Engineere L4: Comfortable Member

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