Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Arhurt, Aug 28, 2008.
It ain't no nuh-uh notta nope nopity nope Slenda Fortreason!
Working on detailing Danktown. Thanks to Dr Lambda for doing most of the work. <_< >_>
Holy my ass, that is purty!
Seeing Sawmill's theme is always good, Sawmill is one of my favorite maps for TF2.
I spent roughly 7 hours on the CS:GO Hammer editor today. Churned out a full A1.
Counter-Terrorist Spawn View
Terrorist Spawn View
Here's an album of more shots and angles.
I know this isn't TF2, ah well. I have never mapped for counter strike before. I was trying to make a deathmatch but I had to fight with it every step of the way. Decided on simply making it elimination for now. It's small right now, I plan to expand it a little so there's maybe 2-3 seconds of more walk time for terrorists.
If you want to try it out with bots or some friends you can download it from this link. (If it doesn't load click this). The name of the map is a pending one, razzletaz. Just unzip the .zip into your "steam/steamapps/common/Counter-Strike Global Offensive/csgo/maps" folder.
I love feedback and I already have a few idea's to make this better. Now's the time to change layout.
These are more than just a retexture!
Red rocket in blu base?
I'm thinking about changing it to the Swamp theme, because when was the last time the Swamp pack got in a map?
Six pictures incoming!
Working on something different while I try to compose my thoughts around my cp_steel-style map. This is inspired by pl_genesis (hey hey!) and pl_cashworks, and focuses on vertical gameplay and interesting playspaces.
I have just been kinda moping about as I wait until my next 12-10 shift and then sleeping when i get home until 10am, starting the cycle again. No idea how I pumped this out, give your opinions on the points, mid is shit and i know it.
The last point, the most original point in this map, completely from the depths of my sleep deprived mind. There is a flank route behind the camera.
Last to Second connector. It's pretty fun to fight in, and gives each team an advantage when pushing.
Shot of the exit from the connector. The exit to the far right is the exit from the last picture. The black box is a jump pad.
Another shot of the spire. This point is a heavily modified version of the only original part of cp_grassroots.
Another point completely from my mind, and i think it suffers for it this time, it plays horribly. I may need some other peoples opinion on good mid design though, since I am obviously not a god at it. This is the only point i am thinking about scrapping completely.
also here, have this, help me out, if only a little. http://strawpoll.me/4509645
Rather than just voting i rather say the reasons on why i think a midcp is good or bad. And for that i will use a few examples.
There should be plenty of variety in heights. Idealy even have combat being mixed between a few of those. However, certain areas should remain clear of other ones. Fastlane although it has some diffirent heights is still mainly flat and is dull because of that. Yucon although still somewhat flat has 2 heights being blended, although you cant dodge combat it adds enough height variety to still remain decent. Foundry again is quite flat, but this one instead of being fully flat made the capture area itself slightly higher. this little diffirence matters alot. And with the higher varieties on the side it still is very good. Granary again does the same except everything is higher. While at the same time cp_well keeps it kinda flat
The control point should have some defensive positions. You never want to be fully inside the view of the enemy, you want to lure them out to the control point aswel. A part which badlands does kinda well and this makes it an excelent competetive map. For pubs however it can work counter productive to those that dont want to. However, in a limited way allowing them to do so remains good. And badlands again did this well with those side windows.
Avoid certain classes from dominating the area. It shouldnt matter if they have 2 or 4 of the same class. Too much snipers isnt fun, too much engineers isnt fun, too much heavies isnt fun, too much demoman isnt fun. By designing the area to have powerfull flanks that allow the group to be killed as group you can make the extra 2 classes somewhat useless at that point. This makes counters effective and easy enough to perform. For sentries this means resticting the nest locations similar to how you would for snipers.
Any stacking of players shouldnt matter beyond a certain point. 4 heavies have a major dps, but if you can spam nades to them out of their reach they still die fast. Or if you can get behind them backstab/backburn/whatever becomes a good tactic.
If you have decent engineer spots, ensure it never goes above 2. All other places should be very easily destroyed to focus them to the 2 spots.
A control point should be somewhat sniper free. Once a player feels he is chanceless to defend himself on a point he no longer will try. If a sniper can cover the point they should be within a decent range of being attacked. Even if its not by the player capping but by someone flanking.
Never have the point in a pit just to overcome this. It will result in the opposite effect (its why cp_gorge last point is that hard to take out - red uses the method you used to overtake them back to you, except they have the spawn time in their advantage). If the pit doesnt feature this issue it is fine (granary).
The area around the control point should be hard to camp. This isnt mainly for those that are attacking, but for those that are defending. You dont want a bad team to be able to hold the middle. cp_well is a quite big offender on this since sentries are very powerfull there. Badlands has a very strong sentry spot watching the control point which on less good teams is broken aswel. On good teams however the spots arent powerfull and easily flanked. Balancing that is vital. More important, it should be a logical counter. You dont want them to take some sort of out of the way path just to flank it (dustbowl realy shows its negative effects on that). You want a direct path (the path under the bridge - which allows nade spam to happen outside the sentry range). Yukon despite being open also is easy to take over, especialy because of the way it is open it makes defending harder as decent spots are very limited. and limited number of spots means you only need a few methods to take out a nest.
Keep the flank area of the point hard to defend. Alot of cover is needed or they will just place a sentry there aswel and you are back to the start. Badlands has the hoodoo's for that, which on the top level dont protect, but on the bottom area makes sentrys far less effective.
Dont blindly listen to players, more important is to know which class they are and to find out why they go there. You can have a very strong area for a pyro. but if its at a higher ground on a detour they wont take it. Your point might be perfectly balanced to a pyro, but as its on an unlogical way it doesnt play well. Observing issues in a way that feels natural for a class is more important. Players often give very biased information, your task is to filter that out before you try to fix it. It can just be the area in front of the cp where the cp itself is excelent.
Never have anything that anoys an attacking team into capturing. At the same time never block a defender. Freight and well both show a major flaw there as the trains are capable of stopping an attack or blocking them long enough to make the effort wasted. pl_frontier with its train shows a way which is accepted. The train might block 1 path, but it has a clear reason why it does so and NEVER stops any class from defending at key points. However, that is also done because the cart moves.
Trainsawlaser for example shows a very good mechanic as it brings the hazard after a capture (the train with saws). It doesnt harm the capture itself, but it is able to counter those trying to stop them, or take it over instantly after the capture. As its however a short event it doesnt matter. Its heavily noticed, but it isnt harming. It might be a joke map, but its a worthy to mention system.
Be creative. Your point might be less decent, if its iconic for your map then you did well. Process might be dull, but its solid and well recognised. And this makes it a good mid point even though taking it back is a bit harder.
Got you covered:
And you did all of this using Danktown as a base? Wow.
Any explanation for how the crate ended up half-sunk into solid earth?
God damnit that crate is genius, I need to do something like that for backwoods
Excuse me but do you know where the sew tool is
Yes ma'am, take the 3rd prop_static left until you see the logic_relay. When you see that, turn right. When you see a brush covered in nodraw, you're there.
Is that Recluse? neato
I followed you instructions, but I seem to have run into an issue.
Separate names with a comma.