I need help with my map

[N0VA]

As of now i am working on Koth_progresso, a koth map as that is reccomended to start with.
Now i wanted to keep things simple as you should learn to crawl before you run,

But now i am a bit stuck on what i should do now on my map, i would say its still in extreme pre-alpha and i likely wont get it in alpha before late DEC or Early JAN. Now dont go whining in the comments that it sucks.

Ive been working on this map for barely a month and i do other things too besides just working on this, now i have this little "Concept" sketch made (i hope its not too messy) to show you what im planning and what is done right now, i basicly need some suggestions/tips telling me what i should do now. or what i should start thinking about, Please keep it polite, i know that critisism is needed to succeed but im very new with making maps and i dont want to be demotivated.
Please understand.
Finally: if you need additional screenshots or info, feel free to tell me of course!
Thanks in advance!
~Leon

(Image not showing up? use this link: http://i.imgur.com/32zx78F.jpg )

 

[Necrσ]

First of all its usually not a good idea to make a box and then fill it with buildings and props as it usually leads to fairly flat and open maps, but I would recommend starting by filling in that orange area with whatever you plan to put there, and then mirroring the map and putting in spawnrooms and health packs to make the map playable. Once you have a playable map it becomes easier to see what needs to be changed and you can get proper feedback from other players.
Hope this helped

 

[killohurtz]

To further explain the "box map" pitfall: it's a rather common but dangerous newbie mindset because it effectively puts a damper on your creativity. When you build the boundaries first, you're forcing yourself to follow their shape, since changing the huge, single-brush walls and floor is a pain in the ass. That's how we get uninteresting maps that are too flat and have bad sightlines.

So, how do we fix this? The key is to think in reverse of what you're currently doing - instead of building a box and filling it in, create the play areas first, then put walls around it when you're done. Start with a small area of the map that you might have already thought out - like a CP area or spawn yard - and build outwards from that, a little bit at a time. Throw in buildings, slopes, high ground, and bridges as you go. The resulting layout will be much more interesting when it's not restricted to a pre-made box (and arguably more fun to make, too)!

The other thing I want to talk about is scaling. It helps tremendously to memorize the usual measurements for things so that your scaling doesn't get out of hand while you build. Some good ones to remember:

• Small door: 128 x 128
• Wide door: 192 x 128
• Ceiling height: 192 minimum (256 is good for roomy combat space)
• Comfortable ledge height for combat: 64 - 128
• Maximum ledge height: 256 (fall damage starts at 270)
  • Most wall textures start tiling at 256, so it's best to stick to this
• Comfortable hallway width: 256 minimum

Generally, you should build the basic structures of your map (not including wall widths, of course) on the 64-unit grid to help keep your brushwork clean. I also recommend placing prop_static player models generously, as they can help you visualize scale relative to a player, and won't compile into the map due to being the wrong prop type.

 

[corpsgrinder360]

To nerf the sniper sight line i would put like a decorative building like a shed or just some rocks something that looks nice but doesn't take too much from the area the sniper covers too much range is bad but too little is worse try for something about maybe 2/3 the length of 2fort sniper battlements or something

 

[N0VA]

Thank you for your replies, having a box indeed gave me some rather icky stuff,
I have decided to restart from scratch and keep Progresso as a map on wich i "experiment" with certain elements, (i dont like just throwing it away)
The reason why i had it in a box is because i wanted 0 leaks so i could instantly play test the map, maby i was a bit too hasty with that.

Agian thank you for your replies, i will start my new map: Koth_Reiniciar (Reiniciar is spanish for "Restart")

 

[Etasus]

The reason why i had it in a box is because i wanted 0 leaks so i could instantly play test the map, maby i was a bit too hasty with that.

if ever i want to playtest my map, i will often just drag a massive block around the area i want to playtest, and hallowing it out... it works, and keeps leaks from happening, while also allowing me to keep the walkways with no walls in tact. its really helpful, and quick...

 

[Crowbar]

...and a wrong thing to do for any release map, even alpha.

 

[sooshey]

if ever i want to playtest my map, i will often just drag a massive block around the area i want to playtest, and hallowing it out... it works, and keeps leaks from happening, while also allowing me to keep the walkways with no walls in tact. its really helpful, and quick...

The cordon tool is what you're looking for here.
Toggle the cordon on and drag the corners around the area you want to test. It'll make a hollow box of skybox brushes for you when you compile. Crowbar is right, but it's not the end of the world to have a big box-skybox while you're still learning the ropes of hammer. However it does take a toll on your map's performance and should really be avoided if possible.

 

[Dr. Orange]

If you need to compile it quickly to run around and see if it works or is up to scale, the cordon tool is absolutely amazing at that. I think that might also be part of the reason newbies make their map a box, it's easy to just slap on a skybox and compile. You should still of course create the approperiate walls and ceilings for all of your playspaces before even releasing the first alpha version of your map, but for your first pre-alpha compile where you just have to check that everything works, the cordon tool is a useful feature.

EDIT: Got ninja'd about the same advice. Oh, well...

 

[Etasus]

...and a wrong thing to do for any release map, even alpha.

i immediately delete the skybox to get back to work. once it hits A1, I never uses the box after that... so... its not that bad if its only for testing pre alpha...