Faultline

[MangyCarface]

Jeez mangy, I'm thinking right now your philosophy with the engi is "Screw sentries, he's a slower scout without double jump and a ton more pistol ammo!". Pretty much any philosophy involving sentries involves them being hard as hell to build and maintain. Not that I think the idea is bad, I like it, but I'm just noting trends .

Sentries stack better than any other class or class combo in the game, they slow down gameplay, divert a potential offensive player into a (most often) purely defensive one, and require the littlest amount of skill. So yeah, engy deserves a hard time, but that's neither here nor there in relation to this map.

 

[grazr]

I'm wondering what happened to all your other maps. You seem to start off really well with them, a lot of potential, then just drop them and start other projects.

 

[Icarus]

I'm wondering what happened to all your other maps. You seem to start off really well with them, a lot of potential, then just drop them and start other projects.

All my maps start out experimental. If I don't like how my new game mechanics are working out, I ditch it. If it's successful, it gets detailed and released as a beta, and I never leave maps in beta.

I've yet to design a map for a traditional game mode

 

[Waif]

From the name and intial earth quake idea I instantly pictured map features, such as bridges that would break apart when a tremor struck

The ground could break open revealing a new tunnel path or a roof could cave in shutting off another.
Just some cool possibilities.

Dynamic play FTW

 

[Sel]

I got around to playing it today, and I stand by what I predicted. It's more gimmicky and annoying, rather than creating a fun new form of gameplay.

Also we stalemated on the second stage for the longest time, despite having ridiculously stacked teams (in our favour).

 

[Icarus]

A3, the tremor will blow up all engineer buildings, and occur twice as often. In order to make this not OP for snipers, there will also be thick fog. But, You should be able to avoid it by jumping up and down for 5 seconds.

Too bad sentries can't jump

 

[DaBeatzProject]

My suggestion was: more ammo and health. I hope you keep that in mind. The map played really well! Can't wait to see a next version.

 

[YM]

I find the second stage is extremely lacking. as the team that lost the middle it feels like a defense only area and that middle warehouse bit just sucks. It doesn't encourage flow through it at all, large open spaces that tunnel through a few small gaps into large spaces again dont really go well with encouraging people to go though, they'd rather hole up just before the pinch (which is exactly what the attacking team do - stopping the defending team having much chance of re-capping)

Tremours areOK as they are, if they are ever to damage engie buildings: only the major one should and it should only do <50% damage to the weakest type of building.

 

[Sgt.Sausage]

I find the second stage is extremely lacking. as the team that lost the middle it feels like a defense only area and that middle warehouse bit just sucks. It doesn't encourage flow through it at all, large open spaces that tunnel through a few small gaps into large spaces again dont really go well with encouraging people to go though, they'd rather hole up just before the pinch (which is exactly what the attacking team do - stopping the defending team having much chance of re-capping)

Tremours areOK as they are, if they are ever to damage engie buildings: only the major one should and it should only do <50% damage to the weakest type of building.

I like that idea, so if a sentry is at full health it would not explode, but the attacks could finish it off. But if the sentry was at low half health or less because the engineer died or something, if it exploded that would be more fair i think.

 

[YM]

Played again today, since its such a linear progression, the 2nd and 3rd stages should definitely favour the attackers however at its current state its often going to sudden death. Which isn't how it should end

I feel that either the non-end points should be non-linear or should get progressively advantageous for the attackers based on their distance from the central round.

 

[YM]

Played again today, since its such a linear progression, the 2nd and 3rd stages should definitely favour the attackers however at its current state its often going to sudden death. Which isn't how it should end

I feel that either the non-end points should be non-linear or should get progressively advantageous for the attackers based on their distance from the central round.

 

[evanonline]

Even if it doesn't end up working out, I appreciate when mappers experiment with neat new concepts like this.

I hope you stick through this all the way even if the tremor concept doesn't end up working out--simply because I like TC maps.

 

[Icarus]

Seriously though, the tremor mechanic was just an experiment. I had fun with it, but the novelty wore off after a few rounds.

Chances are, I'm just going to have it shake screens violently with no other effects. The stalemate problem, on the other hand will take some work. Ideally, TC rounds should take ~5 minutes, and only stalemate if both teams are actively turtling.

My thoughts are, it is due to how close it is to the defending spawn room. Any other time you see a CP so close to the spawn room, the capture time is generally really fast (<6 seconds), but hydro has it at 10. Most of the time, I see all the effort spent on taking out the sentries, then slowly struggling to capture the CP in a desperate battle. Because the spawn is so close, and the capture times are so long, defenders often respawn in time to prevent the capture.

There are two solutions I would like to attempt:
A) Make the CP areas more open with poor sentry locations. Metal and Health will also be placed further away from the CPs.
B) Shorten the capture times.

I am not too comfortable with this B, as I can understand the reasons valve made it so long. Frequently, 10 seconds is just barely enough to stop a sneak cap by a spy, or a scout. It prevents premature or "unfair" captures.

It is very much possible that the problems B would cause is a result of A, since a heavily sentried CP requires a larger portion of your team to leave the base.

BTW, I'm planning a total redo-of Stage 2's mid. It was utterly uninspired, and was based more around hydro's style of connectors. I wanted to see how it would play in contrast to the new style of mid I designed for stage 1.

 

[lana]

Move the spawn?

 

[Icarus]

to where? It's not like 5CP maps where you travel over playable area; Moving it into unused space is just a lame alternative to extending spawn times.

 

[owly-oop]

do it

 

[StoneFrog]

Icarus, you have some very interesting architectural styles going on here, at least from the things I've seen that aren't just dev blocks. As an avid fan of Territorial Control maps, I urge you to stick with this.

One thing I love about Team Fortress Classic is the maps are far more dynamic than TF2's. You have Demomen blasting open side passages, or laser grids blocking side routes being disabled, et cetera. Sure, some of this can be done in TF2, but many mappers seem too timid and prefer to play things safe by emulating Valve's rather static level flows.

The tremor idea would be a refreshing experience and a good way to keep players on their toes. Looking forward to seeing more progress with this one!

 

[tehn]

I support this map due to it brings a whole new game play experience. I know I wouldn't have the balls to start TC in my current stage. Hopefully soon I will play this map.

I think valve would be proud

 

[Dr. Spud]

One thing I love about Team Fortress Classic is the maps are far more dynamic than TF2's. You have Demomen blasting open side passages, or laser grids blocking side routes being disabled, et cetera. Sure, some of this can be done in TF2, but many mappers seem too timid and prefer to play things safe by emulating Valve's rather static level flows.

TF2 maps are also more fun than TFC maps.

Not to slight faultline of course, but just saying.

 

[Icarus]

I've completely revamped Stage 2

The warehouse now has two separated halves, with two entrances on for each team, each side. The only direct route between these two halves is a hole in the middle, which, as you should be able to see, is very risky. It's possible for all classes to accomplish.

I should be able to test the next build tomorrow evening.