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Discussion in 'Site Discussion' started by Flame, Jun 30, 2010.

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  1. Shmitz

    aa Shmitz Old Hat

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    It's not. I see him display polite, respectful behavior on a regular basis.
     
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  2. Rexy

    aa Rexy The Kwisatz Haderach

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    Absolutely, but there's no reason to be rude about it. There's no reason you can't speak your mind and be polite and respectful about it. There's a difference between constructive and destructive criticism.
     
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  3. nik

    nik L12: Fabulous Member

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    Yes, it is true that:
    • Flame can be somewhat offensive
    • He is very good at TF2
    • He is somewhat intimidating

    It's also true that:
    • A moderator should never have the first and last qualities from the above list
    • If Flame were to become staff, he would need to change his attitude and method of communication
    • If Flame were to become staff, I would forsee more stuff getting done


    I dunno, just my 2 cents.
     
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  4. Flame

    aa Flame

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    rexy please excuse me while i point you in the direction of the nearest exit for this thread. top right, the one with the X.
     
  5. Rexy

    aa Rexy The Kwisatz Haderach

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    Last edited: Jun 30, 2010
  6. owly-oop

    aa owly-oop im birb

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    first actual flame war in this thread
     
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  7. Rexy

    aa Rexy The Kwisatz Haderach

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    Stop trolling.
     
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  8. The Political Gamer

    aa The Political Gamer

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    Alright I am going to put my foot down and hopefully address some of the er "problems."

    #1: Flame unbalances tests

    Alright this has /some/ truth to it. Flame after all is a comp player and is a dam good one at that. However he is not the only "unbalancing" player on the server. So let me list off the "pro" TF2Maps players:

    Ravidge: Fucking crazy good sniper
    Rexy: Also a dam good sniper
    Snacks: Pub-stomping Heavy
    Psy: Another dam good heavy
    Supertoaster: "Original" team unbalancer
    Flame: Too pro for proness
    Nineaxis: Pro as hell medic
    TMP: Pro pyro (When his internet is working)
    Moose: Fuck you Moose stop killing me
    Beatz: He crockets my face. :<

    All I am trying to say here is that Flame is good at TF2 and bitching about it is not going to change it. However, it will make him less likely to give you feedback... oh look point 2!

    #2: Flame does not give enough/bad feedback

    This also is bullshit. Look at Coldfront, Wildfire, Fusion, and all the other maps flame gave feedback on. Yeah those maps sucked didn't they? Hell even Assembly would have gone further down the shit slope if flame had not slapped me across the face. Yes I know that it stings with anyone starts yelling "This map blows move onto the next one" However, I take some comfort in knowing that its someone who knows what they are talking about. And then we are on point 3, his "rage."

    #3: Flame is a jerk

    Flame has an ego, thats just who he is. Yes its annoying to some when he yells something like "Get raped!" or what not but thats why TF2 has the mute function. Flame is like that asshole teacher you had in high-school. The one that was a jerk but knows what they are talking about and kicks you in the ass every day because they really care about you.

    In closing Flame is a rare treat; he not only is a comp player who can get things done but he also loves customs and gives some badass feedback. So should he be a mod? I could care less really, thats up to drp to figure out when he posts the good old help wanted sign the door. Until then this is all and will continue to be just a monkey shit fest.
     
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  9. Ravidge

    aa Ravidge Grand Vizier

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    As I said in my earlier reply, I have not caught flame being specifically rude to anyone.

    How people takes his blunt criticism is up to the individual. It's possible they see it as destructive, but that is not Flame's problem.
    Being able to handle all form of critique is something you have to learn when doing any kind of artistic work, including mapping.
     
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  10. Pc_Madness

    Pc_Madness L4: Comfortable Member

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    All the scramble methods aren't working on the server. (well, the EU at least, not sure about the new one)
     
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  11. lana

    aa lana Currently On: ?????

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    ( ´_ゝ`) フーン

    Why can't we all just get along?
     
  12. Gerbil

    aa Gerbil

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    This. Basically.

    I'm also pretty neutral about the whole 'issue'. Flame, your feedback is very good. There's no denying that. But a lot of people here don't see that because sometimes your feedback is very blunt. I know that some people take constructive criticism too seriously but sometime the critic is also in the wrong. I've seen you multiple times on servers simply saying the map sucks and that we should change it, but I've rarely actually seen/heard you tell the mapper specifically what to improve (this includes posting feedback on the map threads after the testing is over). My point it that while your feedback is usually useful, the way you say it and the way your voice gets swallowed by the endless rambling of other players (myself included) on the server makes it a bit hard for people to notice your feedback or acknowledge it. The feedback you give through PM's or on steam chat is probably great. Maybe you can take it outside the inbox (outbox?) and post it on the map thread without the user asking. Like grazr and other people I forgot.

    As for the playtests. Flame generally doesn't unbalance them any more than Ravidge, Snacks, Blobb or any other good players do. People usually tend to focus on the top players and forget that team stacking takes a team. Usually team stacking happens when people of a lower skill level join a team with good players instead of the other team. I admit I do this sometimes, because nobody likes losing. Maybe if we 'build' the teams a bit more evenly the tests can turn out to be balanced and fun for everyone. I'll try from now on. Of course, this could all be avoided if the damn scramble plugin worked.


    It's 5:16 AM and I'm tired so forgive me for any idiocy in this post.
     
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  13. Rexy

    aa Rexy The Kwisatz Haderach

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    If you've gone through an academic college level degree where you face artistic criticism every day of your life, like I did, you would know the difference between when someone is giving good criticism and when someone is not. And it gets even worse in graduate school. If any of you think for a minute that the kind of criticism you're receiving from Flame isn't destructive, you haven't really understood criticism.
     
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  14. The Political Gamer

    aa The Political Gamer

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    Made a few edits and since this thread is going so dam fast I am just going to repost the hole thing
     
  15. Shmitz

    aa Shmitz Old Hat

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    Hi. I've gone through an academic college level degree where I face artistic criticism every day of my life, and I'm calling bullshit on you right here, right now. Spend four years in an art program and you learn that "constructive" refers to the content of the criticism, not its delivery. If you can't see the forest for the trees, that's your problem, and you're going to suffer as an artist because you miss valid points.
     
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  16. Rexy

    aa Rexy The Kwisatz Haderach

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    I knew you'd chime in on this. But I disagree. The 'constructive' can also be the delivery as well as the content. I'm sorry you had to call bullshit, I know you'll disagree with me regardless. You and I have already done this dance.
     
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  17. owly-oop

    aa owly-oop im birb

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    9:27 PM - Rexy: Super, I'm sorry dude
    9:27 PM - Rexy: it's really hard to keep you on my friends list when you act the way you do
    9:27 PM - Rexy: no hard feelings man
    9:27 PM - Rexy: see you around


    Honestly? Do you really get that emotionally hurt because of an argument? I try to be friends with everyone, only hate people based on personal experiences and not because someone wants me too.

    Everything makes sense now. You overreact too much rexy and you hold grudges too long. You're stretching the truth of what flame really does and who he is because you have a grudge against him.

    You don't understand the concept of arguments apparently. People disagree with eachother, but that doesn't mean both sides have to hate eachother in every aspect.

    But now I'm glad you removed me, I do not need soccer moms on my friends list. You have a huge "Feel sympathetic for me" sign on you and try to create situations just so people will.


    Flame and mod being in the same sentence would never have been an issue if you didn't overreact. I attempted to take you seriously in this issue until you started acting like a baby
     
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  18. Rexy

    aa Rexy The Kwisatz Haderach

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    Super, that's why I said: no hard feelings. I mean it, I'm sorry man. I hope you'll forgive me.
     
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  19. Shmitz

    aa Shmitz Old Hat

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    Your grudgemongering is too pathetic to call a dance, unless you consider facepalming a dance move.
     
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  20. ANova

    ANova L7: Fancy Member

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