TF2 blog clarifying idle punishment

[YM]

Incoming!
September 2, 2009 - Erik Johnson

Over the next few days we'll be removing all TF2 items that were earned using external idling applications. We're going to adopt a zero tolerance policy for external applications used to manipulate the persistent item system. Due to us not having a policy in place prior to today, this time we're only removing the items earned through cheating the system. Going forward, if we find users using external applications, we'll remove all of their items. If you're interested, only about 4.5% of the players in TF2's community will be affected by this cleansing process.

Meanwhile, everyone who took the moral high road will soon be finding a new hat in their inventory. We've also significantly increased the chance of finding any of the existing hats.

We realize there is a high level of demand for items, and we're still working on systems to allow you to find them in new ways (via Trading, and crafting duplicates into desired items). However, we need to draw the line at running external applications.

http://www.teamfortress.com/post.php?id=2787

 

[Micnax]

Meanwhile, everyone who took the moral high road will soon be finding a new hat in their inventory. We've also significantly increased the chance of finding any of the existing hats.

 

[Rasputin]

"Meanwhile, everyone who took the moral high road will soon be finding a new hat in their inventory. We've also significantly increased the chance of finding any of the existing hats."

Yes!

 

[NovaSilisko]

But what about peopled like nine who idled so they could see the drop rates? Or me who idled so they could test out their hat replacement models?

 

[evanonline]

That's pretty cool.

But I bet I'm going to be a little grumpy with how self-absorbed halo-wearing players will be, and how everyone who didn't use the idler will take every measure to beat this fact into the internet's collective face for the next two weeks.

I'm curious to see how they're going to be able to remove existing items. How is there any difference between items gained through the idler and normal items? I'm somewhat confused. I can understand cutting off the flow, but...

And now, about that achievement_idle...

EDIT: I think they're unbalancing the numbers a bit though--just because only 4.5% percent of players had items from the idler doesn't mean that 4.5% of players used the idler altogether--I'm sure plenty had auto-delete set on who never got a hat. 10000+ players using the idler certainly doesn't seem like it could be such a small percentage. Especially considering that that statistic is likely 4.5% of TF2 owners, not players.

 

[Terr]

That blog post was informative, to-the-point, and I'm not left with any nagging unanswered questions.

WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH THE REAL VALVE TEAM!?

 

[Sgt.Sausage]

Well half of this site is in that 4.5 percent.

 

[Ankh]

I wonder how far back this deletion goes
A lot of my unlocks are from the idler, but only because I got higher level ones and then deleted my old ones, and this was only as long as they were giving out random levels.
I have still used the idler but deleted every item that I've earned since because they were all duplicates.

I'll certainly not complain if I don't get one of these non-cheating hats (it's a fair cop I guess) but I strongly disagree that not idling is taking the "moral high road" because as I've said before idling is a VICTIMLESS CRIME. So my first reaction is still one of extreme frustration because even though I have been idling, it has not at all benefited me - ie I haven't gotten anything I haven't already earned via milestones. It's like playing using god mode, but the ai is so dumb that you can kill them without taking a single hit, is it really cheating if your advantage is only an illusion? - Indeed I know many people in the same situation who still have yet to earn hats. It seems a bit unfair to punish us when what little advantage we had has done nothing for us (albiet not for lack of trying, so I guess you could argue the intention). But the difference there is I'm not making excuses for the intention. I fully intended to exploit the hell out of the system for fun and profit, and this will only force me to idle in game until the system is complete.

Well, in any case my items go back a while so I'll at least be a good metric to see how far this goes. No deletions yet though, but I'll keep you guys posted.

 

[PL-7764]

everyone who took the moral high road will soon be finding a new hat in their inventory. We've also significantly increased the chance of finding any of the existing hats.

To quote a very heavy friend of all of us:

"I am very happy!!"

I considered the idler once but decided against it because I wanted to try to keep my gameplay mostly legit. Granted I did get persuaded to try an achievement server a time or two, but I tried to clear my play stats afterwards 'cuz I felt so bad for soiling my clean slate. (It didn't work because TF2 is bad at tracking my input commands like that, so now I just live with a record of 52 headshots as Demoman and 470 kills as Spy. The important thing to me is I know my own true skill level and acknowledge the weird stats as fake.)

I'mma go boot up TF2 and join in on the hat party! :thumbup:

Sorry to all those who used the idler for experimentation purposes only though. That's a bummer. Maybe those people can appeal to Valve about it? Who knows, maybe Robin would have some mercy... then again, how does he really know who to trust? Meh, I'm trying to make it sound better but probably failing so I'll stop talking now ...

EDIT: No hats yet. Either it'll just take a while (personally I expect this is it and I'm overreacting ) or I screwed myself out of one because of one time when I saw an idler server under the "Friends" server tab and tried to connect (gave me an error saying to use the idler and didn't let me in - would this still make a difference?).

 

[Terr]

I strongly disagree that not idling is taking the "moral high road" because as I've said before idling is a VICTIMLESS CRIME.

Well, it devalues legitimately-gained hats... And with the presence/expectation of a trading system the impact becomes much more significant.

 

[uma plata]

I never considered cheating the system in any way, never saw the point. This goes back to farming for medic weapons. Glad I made that decision

I haven't received 1 hat until today. Wonder what I'll get?

/leaves work early

 

[Dance]

Looks stupid.

Btw, at average only 10,000 people idled... so only 222,222 people play TF2?

 

[Ankh]

Well, it devalues legitimately-gained hats... And with the presence/expectation of a trading system the impact becomes much more significant.

And I don't really count "random drops" as legitimately earning a hat - if they were a reward item, rather than a luck item, then I may agree it would be devaluing them, but as it stands, a few more people having them as opposed to around 1% who each seem to have many hats will barely devalue them at all.
And if we had a trading/crafting system, that may be a legitimate impact and I might actually consider it to have ramifications, but the thing is we don't have one and so any impact it would have is moot.

 

[Jack Riguel]

I wonder if valve's 4.5% represents anyone who ever "bought" the game, meaning that anyone who got it in the Orange Box or Valve Pack but never used it would be effected as well... that being said, the average 12,000 people that used the idler will most likely be affected, including myself.

I'll get ticked off though if they remove my hats, especially since all four were actually earned in game.

 

[Terr]

Btw, at average only 10,000 people idled... so only 222,222 people play TF2?

Firstly, it's possible they are only going after the severe offenders.
Secondly, that's people affected, so it only means people who idled and got some number of hats out of it.

I'll get ticked off though if they remove my hats, especially since all four were actually earned in game.

Unless Valve can identify specific hats being from the idler (and hey, maybe they can) then the only remotely sane way of dealing with it is statistically. If half your time was idling, lose half your hats.

 

[Dance]

So if you didn't get any hats, you're OK? My friend idles. -.-'

 

[Shmitz]

That's pretty cool.

But I bet I'm going to be a little grumpy with how self-absorbed halo-wearing players will be

Maybe rather than assuming they're self-absorbed, consider that it might actually just be because it's the first hat they've gotten? You know, because they didn't idle.

 

[Terr]

Maybe rather than assuming they're self-absorbed, consider that it might actually just be because it's the first hat they've gotten? You know, because they didn't idle.

Unless I get spectacularly lucky soon, it'll be my first hat.

 

[Jack Riguel]

From Drunken_F00l :

Hey,

I've gone ahead and shut down the idler. Valve has made it clear that they don't appreciate it and will police the players pretty hard in regards to items. I don't want players getting further punishment because of a service I run, so the idler is dead.

The good news is they've agreed to help me work on tf2items.com and give me a "public blessing" of some sort. More details later.

Well at least he's getting credit for that system. :/

EDIT: Linky

 

[Icarus]

Check out Robin's new avatar