TF2 blog clarifying idle punishment

[JoshuaC]

Cooler thing about this update is I'm no longer getting any sort of weapon or hat drops at all.. I've restarted steam and got no flag or halo and items are dropping for everyone else but me.

 

[Demo-Sama]

This is a very messy matter, my friend (limesimme) fake idl'd and I felt like he should actually played the game instead of using a third party program.
In the end it all sort of worked out, I get a Halo for being (as we decided to call it; Dope-free) non-idling while himself got nothing but duplicate unlockweapons.
Also I find it sad that people that did idle think they aswell are entitled for such prosperity for not idling, and medics that declines you healing if you stayed "clean".

The mess that Valve created by making this item of purity will haunt the game for some time, untill the next exploit comes around and those who stay pure to the game will be awarded once again.

But then again, I love hats.

 

[Ankh]

If I can repeat myself: Fake idling is a more efficient method of real idling. He could have done this playing the game, but chose not to because this was a better way. In theory it was a good decision, until now of course.

Do you think I care about the halo hat? My most played class is spy, it would ruin me even more than this whole debacle has because it shows up when cloaked, I care that my items were deleted, despite the TF2 forums' stickies saying they will be restored, that's small consolation to them adding such injury and such insult to such frustration - it doesn't change the fact this was a stupid move. To put it bluntly, it's the principle of the matter.

Now I personally won't decline you healing if you didn't idle, I still recognise this is a team game even if I resent the fortune of half of my team. I'll decline healing you because the TF2 Team's overzealousness has removed all my medic items and put me at a severe disadvantage causing me to not play medic (my second most played class) until I get my items back.

Can you at least see why people might be frustrated by them encouraging the fans to think of it in moralistic terms now?

 

[jpr]

I knew not idling would pay off

 

[Engineer]

damn, why did i even trie to idle

 

[psikobare]

dammit, and i just started idling when i saw a friend of mine having a hat this way

now i've been caught, no hat for me, no angel ring, and they took away....one ubersaw...
and i still have 3 left http://www.tf2items.com/profiles/76561197980760002


most surprinsing thing is that it doesn't only apply to nort americans this time...

 

[krik3t]

What I realy love about this are idlers blaming Valve for their own fault. Steam forum is now full of it

 

[Demo-Sama]

What I realy love about this are idlers blaming Valve for their own fault. Steam forum is now full of it

True and they are starting to show alot of hate against people that got the halo :facepalm:

 

[eerieone]

Punishment (taking away hats) and Humiliation (Showing that you are not one of the pure ones)
is not the way to go if there was no official rule present at the time of the idling.....
a warning should have been enough, don´t use a sledge-hammer to crack a nut...

 

[Psy]

So who's up for some achievement_idle?

 

[Engineer]

So who's up for some achievement_idle?

I am, i am!!!

 

[Ankh]

I went and made my own idle map because I figure they'd be onto that one
took five minutes and works just as well (ie, a lot of me dying and getting nothing)

Krik3t: it kind of is Valve's fault - we didn't take away our own weapons, we didn't implement a hated and incomplete drop system, and we didn't, as eerieone said "try to smash a nut with a sledgehammer" and more importantly, we didn't break any rules.

 

[Terr]

we didn't implement a hated and incomplete drop system

Let's examine this one, shall we?

Before, you didn't get anything from sheer time spent playing. Afterwards, you get something that's purely optional by idling. There are two ways this works, and neither is pro-idler.

Option A: Valve didn't do anything to compel you to get hats, in which case you suffer no harm from the new system because it's 100% possible to delete every item without looking at it with negligible cost to your attention span or time.

Option B: Valve is acting like a game designer and manipulating people (via "keep up with the neighbors" and "collect them all") to get hats. However, in that case, idling obviously causes harm to the people who follow the rules, because the social bar for an impressive-hat or number-of-hats is inflated outside their reach.

and more importantly, we didn't break any rules.

Valve is not the US government, and has no constitutional decree against ex-post-facto laws.

Valve's stance was made clear the last time people were using third-party tools to exploit the system for distributing items. This is the second time now, folks. I was pissed the first time for many of the same reasons: They didn't communicate their policy to anybody.

However, whether or not you like how Valve handles these things--which will surely emerge again--anybody saying this was unexpected is either ignorant of history or started to believe their own pro-idling propaganda.


==================

As an aside, the "Otherwise I'd use more electricity" argument really pisses me off. The real question isn't the merits of idling with the tool and idling without it: It's whether you are trying to circumvent an exploit an item distribution system at all.

 

[Micnax]

And so, it began

 

[Cameron:D]

Wow, I lost so much.... All my dupes.
And my KGB (I deleted original for higher level)

 

[Terr]

Solution: Change name, rejoin without halo, play normally... Until they uber/kritz you and then you taunt. (Sure, both of you are harming your team, but...)

 

[Ankh]

Let's examine this one, shall we?

Before, you didn't get anything from sheer time spent playing. Afterwards, you get something that's purely optional by idling. There are two ways this works, and neither is pro-idler.

Option A: Valve didn't do anything to compel you to get hats, in which case you suffer no harm from the new system because it's 100% possible to delete every item without looking at it with negligible cost to your attention span or time.

Option B: Valve is acting like a game designer and manipulating people (via "keep up with the neighbors" and "collect them all") to get hats. However, in that case, idling obviously causes harm to the people who follow the rules, because the social bar for an impressive-hat or number-of-hats is inflated outside their reach.


==================

As an aside, the "Otherwise I'd use more electricity" argument really pisses me off. The real question isn't the merits of idling with the tool and idling without it: It's whether you are trying to circumvent an exploit an item distribution system at all.

I don't WANT to have to spend ungodly hours playing to have a chance of getting stuff, that's the exact reason I Idle so telling me that I can do that now is hardly a good argument.
Anywho:
Option A: Valve puts a great deal of effort in order to advertise the hats with blog posts, hidden pages and a few days of shots of people with the different hats, as well as doing community requests. That seems to me that they want me and others to want the hats. I fail to see how having the option of deleting things (with ease!) is a reason why...anything. What's your point there?

Option B: I think the official drop rate that Drunken F00l posted was 1/80 every 4 hours and 17 minutes. Do you have any idea how infintismal that is? Are you saying that this bar was ever within anyone's reach beyond a few people getting extremely lucky with the item drop system? (law of large number probabilities - it was bound to happen at any percentage, I know that). You're talking to someone with Still no hats so saying that me idling was detrimental to the system is kind of insulting. Oh, not to mention that a system based on random chance means that idling is the only way you can increase your chance of "keeping up with the neighbours" as you acknowledge the might intend assuming, like myself you still play TF2 normally in addition so yeah, B is kind of in favour of idling. Even then the amount your chances are affected is NEGLIGIBLE.

Say nothing of the fact that this has absolutely nothing to do with the drop system being hated (it is) or incomplete (it is), so I have no idea what your point here is or if you're actually arguing with me, or merely making me into a straw man idler which your next point seems to support.

First: I have NEVER said anything about electricity - I am talking about bandwidth and the fact that I'd rather not spend heaps of it on TF2 if I'm not using it for actually playing the game.

Second: that is EXACTLY what this is about - people who idle without the tool, sucking up bandwidth and server space are REWARDED, where people like myself who did things more efficiently, in such a way that no others were inconvenienced are unfairly punished by an arbitrary rule enforcement. I don't give a damn what you think of me idling in the first place - I didn't ask your opinion on my motives and if I was idling in game I wouldn't be making this argument because there'd be no point in me discussing it. My intentions are not at all a question - I WAS TRYING TO EXPLOIT THE SYSTEM, WHOLEHEARTEDLY AND I'D DO IT AGAIN, because as I've said I think the system is AWFUL and I don't want to have to enslave myself to it without any say whatsoever. Random = equally fair = equally UNfair. The RESULTS are the question. My idling RESULTED in no harm to anyone but myself, I contest that verdict. That is my argument and point of frustration, not that "oh I didn't know this would happen" (which I didn't because no warning was given, but I digress) or "but I was saving electricity" or anything like that.

Bottom line: Don't put words in my mouth if you're going to argue with me because I know damn well what I'm arguing and I won't argue for anyone but me.

-------
EDIT: I'm on the fence about that HaH thing, I value winning more than I value petty grudges - I'd rather take it out on people I SHOULD be killing rather than people I should be helping

Terr: It says in the manifesto that taking the halo off will do fine, you don't have to be a jerk about it

 

[Psy]

Hats are only ruining the community.

 

[The Political Gamer]

http://www.filefront.com/14454371/thecoolkidzhalo.rar/

 

[Micnax]

http://www.filefront.com/14454371/thecoolkidzhalo.rar/

HA!

I want someone to make a dunce hat.