Copperhead

Owlruler

L12: Fabulous Member
Dec 10, 2008
964
275
It's like mirror's edge with red marking all the places you need to go.
 

owly-oop

im birb
aa
Apr 14, 2009
819
1,215
Changed 1-2.

Made walktime further for blu

Now there's a use for that bottom path

cp_copperhead_a50000.jpg

cp_copperhead_a50001.jpg
 

Owlruler

L12: Fabulous Member
Dec 10, 2008
964
275
yay! Arrows!
 

owly-oop

im birb
aa
Apr 14, 2009
819
1,215
a7 released http://forums.tf2maps.net/downloads.php?do=file&id=2520


changes:

1-1 made it a hut instead of a platform.

1-2 made it easier for blu (hopefully) and less spammy (hopefully)

3-1 added room for full hp kit and added ledge under the stairs, dunno how to explain this

3-2 made it bigger, couple of rooms with ammo in it, hopefully less spammy and easier for spies.

2-2 added wall to prevent spawncamping even more
 

Shadow Tyrant

L69: Deviant Member
Aug 7, 2009
69
3
I thought it was good. I'm not sure what else to say, really. Didn't notice anything particularly wrong. I like the way you use dev textures to mark important places in the map.


Hm, just remembered the final point...Was a bit of a spamfest. Maybe clear that up a bit. Also, that door on the vent is a bit odd. I walked up to it expecting it to be closed, but then it opened and I spontaneously asploded from grenades.
 
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MrAlBobo

L13: Stunning Member
Feb 20, 2008
1,059
219
Felt like giving some feedback :p

1.jpg


It has annoyed me that this point seems pretty much indefensible, there are two long open paths leading to a point with a very open building around it. The bridge path especially seems to be "too" effective, I mean its by far the quickest way to the cp, and it doesn't seem to have any real drawbacks. The teams have equal height, the sightlines are just as bad/good? for both teams. Perhaps angling this bridge to favor red a bit more and narrowing it would help lessen the effectiveness of it.

2.jpg


The entire area in and around the red "circle" seems to be pretty much unused space, it can't really be used for defense as its so open any defense put up there will just be destroyed very quickly. Id say to either remove it completely or give the teams some kind of good reason to go there, such as placing some kind of defensible building, will a path leading to the cp, though if you do that you might want to consider losing one of the other paths. That brings me to the path right to the left of the screenshot, its basically a straight, wide, barren path and that pretty removes more effectiveness for attack or defense.

3.jpg


To continue with the path from the last picture, I think one of the more effective ways to make it more interesting would be to add a narrow balcony/ bridge for red that crosses over this path. Other options might be to narrow it a bit, or actually turn it into something like a tunnel, it might even work to replace the rock in picture 2 with some kind of structure to break up the openness. Then, one rather simple thing to do to make the point more difficult would be to just rotate it 180 degrees and lower it to the next floor, perhaps even lose that ramp and a chunk of the upper area to slide it closer to blues spawn. This also gives you the option of building up some more effective layout around the current back of the point and make better use of it.

4.jpg

5.jpg


This path seems kinda useless right now, I mean, currently its a long walk that leads to a dead end, with maybe an oppurtunity to attack someone from above. I think throwing some windows up there looking towards the last point would be highly effective at giving the area some purpose.

6.jpg


I can honestly tell you that I never followed any of the red paths, every single time I took the path on the far right, simply because its a shorter walk, give you more of a height advantage and its infrequently used by the red team. The blue area is what I think should be completely removed, provided you decide to add the windows I suggested earlier. Your goal here should be to get red using the top path alot more, as its a very powerful position to be in while out in the open.

7.jpg


It just seems to me that it is incredibly easy to get behind the red team using this path, they barely see you and that only if they are looking right out that one opening to the point. Something I would actually like to see is this path being well defendable...will experiment with sentry positions the next time I play. One thing that I didn't like though was that the grey "hut" on the far right of this pic is in a position where a surprise sentry/ heavy/ pyro / spy would be fun, but because it has two entrances that will not work.

8.jpg


Perhaps to stop people getting behind red too easily you might consider leaving that door open all the time, or even removing it completely and replacing it leading into the point. I am reluctant on that one because it makes the point more vulnerable.

9.jpg


I haven't played this point enough to give good solid feedback, but it think it might help to have a rock or other large object in the blue circle. Or perhaps better add one of those small metal screens to the point to give it a small degree of cover.

10.jpg


Its hard to notice that this is actually a path and not just an empty room (as there seem to be alot of...though they usually have ammo and health). So...I think it would be useful to either add an arrow to alert people its a path, or just extend the ramp a bit further so people can see it before entering the room.

Yay horribly long post.
 

frothy

L2: Junior Member
Mar 3, 2009
87
21
Yeah stage three was tough on blu, but I enjoyed this map a lot. Stage 3, Point 1 was probably my favorite because it was so unique.

EDIT: I'll add a bit more. I only got to play on the attacking team and I played as soldier for this map. In the first stage, it did seem like the first point was capped rather quickly. The only problem I had on the second point was that I was able to just launch rockets from a distance on the left hand side without fear of dieing.

The second stage had a great layout. Especially the second point. No problems from me on that stage.

Then there was stage three. As I said, I love the first point. Great design, very fun to attack. But then the round seemed to lean more tword red's favor with hallways going every which way and corners hiding sentries. Unfortunately, as I mentioned, I only got to attack so I'm not really positive on how this could be improved. Maybe it was just the teams. Time will tell on this one.
 
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Ravidge

Grand Vizier
aa
May 14, 2008
1,544
2,818
Stage 1 cap 2.
SS-2009.09.24-03.16.27.jpg


Box #1:
The distance between spawn and point is really short and there are barely no options for defence. It's a restrictive area and sentry spots are too predictable.

Box #2:
Extremely busy place, there's a ton of height variation and paths, but it's almost impossible to have a proper battle here. From what I've seen Red can manage to control this area for the first few rushes if lucky, but once lost it's impossible to take it back.
There just isn't enough space to: have a rocket duel, to flex your grenade arching skills, Setup sentries, build ubers and so on. Red is confined in the capture building and can't do much about it.


You should add more interesting hotspots that are not capture points!
For example in dustbowl, you have the sidetunnels in stage 1-2. The metalroof by the setupgates in 2-1. The red spawn shortcut tunnel in stage 3-1...
I think the map could be a lot more fun if you could manage to spread people out, because an all out deathmatch on the cap is not always the way to go. (sometimes it is :p)
 

MrAlBobo

L13: Stunning Member
Feb 20, 2008
1,059
219
11.jpg


I really dislike this little grey hut and its two entrances, someone on red should be able to hide in there and kill blue when they walk by, I would really like to see that front path/ entrance taken out.

12.jpg


Im just curious, has a successful defense ever been made here? Even for a little while? It seems so open that red team will be steadily drove back by blues faster spawns. If not then maybe draw that rounded grey thing in the middle out a bit further to slightly divide the open area into 2 chunks.

13.jpg


Has anyone ever been ballsy enough to try and defend from this little thing? It seems highly pointless, maybe buff the heath and ammo for some added incentive.

15.jpg


So...one of these needs to be closed off, this gives 3 large entrances to the point...so no sentry is safe. I recommend the one leading outside.

16.jpg


That little grey wall makes me sad, it ruined my epic sentry pushing people off the side :p

17.jpg


Today when we played blue had this area dominated, and considering how close this is to the point...it may be a problem. Basically I think red needs a way to get into this area that doesn't require them to go uphill into an open area. Bleh, turns out I didn't get a screenshot of what I wanted too, so ill try to explain it. The side entrance for blue to the cp, I think the tunnel aspect of it should be extended about 16-32 more units, this will allow for a better placed sentry...bah, I can't explain this without a screenshot. Ill update this shortly

UPDATE:

14.jpg


First you need to bask in my epic writing with a mouse.
Now...here are some of the ideas I had, 1st, turn that ramp into a solid block and extend a narrow walkway over the path. Currently a walkway extended as it is would not line up, id suggest just moving that wall forward a bit so that it lines up perfectly. A problem I am seeing with this is that the board might not be high enough, if thats the case you should raise the entire thing 16-32 units, this even goes so far as to create a bit of a height advantage for red. Now I am not telling you to raise everything, just the objects in the immediate area. Add a small ramp on the right side to make the transition easier, but do not add one on the other side, force blue to jump to use it. What this does it is give red a nice little sentry spot, guarded from blues side path that can shoot the point, though on the other hand its pretty much fodder to a large chunk of classes coming down the other path if the red team is inattentive. Provided you do this, red now either has to go around or cross the path to get up there, so you may want to consider adding a ramp pointing inward, to get up, this also uses up alot of that large empty space that annoyed me. Two other things I would suggest are extending that wall a bit further to prevent blue from using this too easily, and maybe adding another exit to the side path, mainly to give red another path to push back.

18.jpg


As a trial thing, I would like to see this ramp entirely removed, so that the only way up here is around the back.

My screenshots will fill the page!

Oh and only people doing dustbowl style maps will get this level of feedback from me :p
 
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FreeLance_FoX

L6: Sharp Member
Sep 6, 2008
353
173
One idea I just had: perhaps on 2-2, move the CP from its current position on the lowest elevation and put it above the drop, then put a stairway up from the lower area. That would now engage the entire CP area as useful for both offense and defense, while actually making the point a bit more defensible while capping for BLU.