surge of "gimmick" maps?

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by DJive, May 16, 2008.

  1. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    This isn't a "hate" thread, so please lets not let it get to that.

    While browsing through FPSB i noticed the newest "trend" seems to be that all new mappers and the "my-first-maps" seem to all be gimmick maps.

    ie, football or other sports, small dm box maps with nothing but full hp and ammo kits, etc

    It just seems weird that a "my-first-map" would be focusing more on gimmicks then an actual tf2 style or gameplay map
     
  2. Lord Ned

    Lord Ned L7: Fancy Member

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    I remeber way back in the days when a "First Map" had more then 100 brushes, had some triggers, lighting, something interactive, ai and a weapon.

    Now they are just blocks. It's like making microchips and going to computers. :/
     
  3. TotalMark

    TotalMark L6: Sharp Member

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    The motivation a lot of the time to map for a game is to try a new concept.

    With the official game system being as limited as it is, people just get a little bored mapping a CP or CTF map, so maps such as these are born.

    Sometimes they end up being a "fun" map and the gimmick beats out the sometimes crappy texturing, lack of props or brushwork. People are more likely to map gimmicky for this game because they see it as cartoonish, and "fun".
     
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  4. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    ^ that was a pretty good answer Total.
     
  5. Foreverkul

    Foreverkul L4: Comfortable Member

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    You saw my pinball map, is that gimmicky? :(
     
  6. MangyCarface

    aa MangyCarface Mapper

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    Yeah mate, it is
    Remember it's not a "bad" thing, but if it's a "pinball" map then pinball is the gimmick
     
  7. Snipergen

    Snipergen L13: Stunning Member

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    I see a map as a gimmick map if it has a breakable wall in it. Why? It sucks for gameplay, you don't want to be shooting a wall, you want to shoot other players!

    Players should fight other players not the map

    and DJive you've said it yourself.. its fpsbanana :p
     
  8. AWESOME-O

    AWESOME-O L10: Glamorous Member

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    breakable walls sometimes can be use full, like making an alternative route, but being able for engies or other classes to defend it. It sometimes give a good fun.
     
  9. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    No, breakable walls just aren't cool, don't look good and are best left to the next Gears of war game.

    Breakable walls and glass are something you expect to find in a poor quality CS:S map not in TF2
     
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  10. Chicky

    Chicky L1: Registered

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    So you guys aren't fan of Warpath then?

    I don't mind different maps personally. They're typically not maps I'm going to put on rotation on my server either though. But every now and then, we like to do mapnights where we play stuff that is out of the norm. I'll admit we have the bestinclass map on our server but we have yet to play it on our server. It would be too much of a change from the norm for our regulars to join and see a map where it takes 500billion years to meet the enemy. That doesnt' mean we have all trolled over to another server and played though.

    We have played the rugby and football maps though. Most people like them - as a change of pace. More than anything, I think people enjoy it because everyone is having a good time - regardless of skill.
     
  11. Jive Turkey

    Jive Turkey L3: Member

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    I like the breakable wall in cp_warpath. There is no such thing as "never" in creative endeavors.
     
  12. Snipergen

    Snipergen L13: Stunning Member

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    Stalemate every time and it looks like tfc? No thanks :sneaky2:

    I got mates that declare it as best map ever though
     
  13. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    yeah warpath just isnt fun and it definatly isnt pretty(i didn't even know there was a breakable wall)

    The person making it should put their energy into making it a good map rather than making 20 different versions of it. I mean come on, why would we want a sandy version a grassy version, a snowy version, each of those but at night.........why? there is no point!
     
  14. TheDarkerSideofYourShadow

    TheDarkerSideofYourShadow L10: Glamorous Member

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    Not only are there multiple versions, there are multiple authors. The server I'm on has cp_warpath_final, but I've come across several others, and I think someone who post here has just a warpath map, though now its been updated.
     
  15. Chicky

    Chicky L1: Registered

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    The only one I've played was in CAL and it didn't look bad at all. The wall was a tad annoying, but really - not that big of a deal. It adds a whole other level of competition because you have to decide if you want your wall broken or if you don't. Sure, it makes it easier to get to the middle if you can come from below, but at the same time, it makes it easier for them to get to your second point. Plus, once you've opened their wall, it basically means that anyone who didn't know about the tunnel does now.

    I can think of a handful of other maps with breakables (rock2b1, openfire) and for the most part, they don't detract from game play. There's a difference between having to shoot 500 stickies at a wall to break it and having to shoot 8 and know that once it's open, there's no closing it.
     
  16. rt3407v06p909

    rt3407v06p909 L1: Registered

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    I certainly wouldn't discourage a new mapper from making their first attempt. Everyone has to start somewhere. There is absolutely no reason to say "That map sucks".

    Saying "that map sucks" without actually finding the author and telling them why, constructively, is just plan lazy. It's super easy to throw stones at someone at a distance. Try it when they're up close and personal. Oh, not so easy? Gee, that's funny. Maybe you shouldn't have thrown stones in the first place, eh?

    Constructive criticism has the word constructive in it.

    For those unfamiliar with the concept, constructive criticism means providing feedback of what is good & bad about the map without ripping the mapper a new "superfluous behind", to quote the Engineer.

    And to those that want a public community made up of only people that share your point of view: Get ready for disappointment, cause it ain't gonna happen.

    Or put another way... If what you're looking for out of tf2maps.net is a place where you find everyone agrees with your opinion and does things your way only, perhaps it would be better to make the site private? That way no-one will offend the "chosen few" with their crazy square-peg ideas.

    Why did I post this? Because as of late, this site (and the chat, and the game days) has started to have a whiff of elitist ego. Leave it at the door, I say. If we're not all friends here, and the general public is not welcome, then this should be an invite-only private site.

    I was absolutely embarrassed at the comments during the last game day, for all the maps (yes, ALL THE MAPS). It was like listening to school children poke fun at a disabled person. Just horrific! Won't be doing that again any time soon. Why would I want to listen to people that have absolutely NOTHING positive to say? Where's the fun in that? I hate to sound like a broken record here, but it's a game! Remember, fun?
     
  17. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    @rt3407v06p909;

    In this topic we are not saying anything sucks, its an open discussion as to why gimmick maps seems to be the new choice for all budding map makers.
     
  18. rt3407v06p909

    rt3407v06p909 L1: Registered

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    IMO, because for at least one person, that gimmick map is fun. Why does there need to be any other reason?
     
  19. MrAlBobo

    MrAlBobo L13: Stunning Member

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    even if its kind of off topic, he does bring up some very good points
     
  20. Hawk

    Hawk L7: Fancy Member

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    When it comes down to it, to make a good TF2 map that follows the conventions of the game is hard. When you realize all the balancing you have to do with all the classes, plus sentries and other stuff, it takes a real pro to make a map that works like Valve intended the game to be. I think some of the gimmick maps out there are really just a way of avoiding that challenge.

    Now and then something cool comes out of it though, and I think it's important for people to push the envelope of what the game's constraints allow. However, when a map comes along that's just your typical CP, CTF, or Attack/Defend map, and it is actually balanced and fun, then that's something I really respect.