Spillway

[ChronoTriggerFan]

What I mostly have a problem with, is how you enter the building. You have to push right in front of their spawn just to get in, which makes defending it impossible in all 3 times I've played the map.

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

You mean attacking, Chrono? In my experience the last has been very fun with small player counts and scaled up horribly, making the experience of 12v12 very hard for the offense short of a scout rush.

 

[x14u2cx]

other than the tears in the two images i cant see many problems, a little more health and water somewhere is needed to put yourself out other than that i love the changes made so far.

just found out the first pics problem is hard to see, the farthest door has some invisable texture or something within that nature that allows you to see the skybox.

 

[Lockhart]

Enjoyed the map especially between points 2 & 3. The team controlling the middle has too large an advantage, I suggest making a platform in place of the center's stairs, or moving the mid-spawn back a bit, possibly just beyond point 2.

Oh, and don't forget that minor rock clip you have in the center by the stairs, point 3. Very small. It's like a pixel in one of the screenshots.

 

[Remix]

Demo from last night if you want to watch it. The map seems much improved over the previous version. I know you don't think you got any feedback, but I think we gave you a couple of things to fix for the next version, like the new door location at lower along with spawn being slightly relocated.

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?jan2hze4myn

Source TV demos are also extremely useful for seeing how each individual class plays on the map.

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

Impromptu playtest bump!!

Suggested changelist for a8, which will not all be included (I'm looking for some feedback on these ideas):

- Raising the height of the ground in the yard so as to increase interaction between the top and bottom level (hopefully preventing stalemates on 2nd)
- Moving the new one-way door from its current position to the aesthetic spillway floodgate doors
- Reworking the staircase room and the white tunnel so that they both exit at the same place, but the defense must use a one-way door to access it (to prevent spawn-camping) + remove the lower one-way door
- Add additional platforms at middle by moving the forward spawn that's embedded in the wall right now out from the wall, creating a roof and clarifying the direction for people exiting that spawn to head
- Rework the initial spawns so that players will exit on the top level with the option of dropping to go right, effectively shortening the walk to all CPs by a second or so and correctly routing players on the shortest path
- Do something to last that would provide "easier access," as in, making it more obvious for players that there a plethora of entrances

-FoXy

 

[Waif]

Enjoyed playing it.
I like the use of hieght advanatge and general layout.

However I think you need to do some evaluation on the use of side passages. Many of them seem unused / un-needed and too spacious. Maybe just narrow them down and make them more direct etc..

Some weird texture bug thing I experienced:

http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/1722155/cp_spillway_a70001.jpg

http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/1722155/cp_spillway_a70000.jpg

 

[bbot]

The lightmap controls lighting on the brush face, with the lightmap scale controlling the granularily of the lightmap. The lower the scale, the smaller each lightmap pixel is, and the finer and more realistic the lighting is, but with a performance cost.

The dev wiki article has a fairly good comparison image.

Also: moar health packs plz kthx.

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

Testing bump! I know quite a few of you have played 'er since a7 came out a couple weeks ago, and I'm looking for any and all concerns before I finalize a8 this weekend. Final changes, to be made:

- Simplify staircase from hole area to the tunnel by having it empty directly onto the 2nd CP
- Change the 2nd forward respawns @ the middle CP to create more cover in that corner of the space, prevent spam over the rocks
- Initial (main) Spawns moved forward & up into the glass window room of the warehouse, all of the useless space to the left removed
- Cave ceiling added to 2nd, with many new details like skylights & increased lighting on the lower route to make it more attractive
- Detail greatly improved, including a lot of new greenery, new overlays, and more decorative ground water
- Bug & clipping fixes

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

yay a8!

http://forums.tf2maps.net/downloads.php?do=file&id=2568

- Simplified staircase from hole area to the tunnel by having it empty directly onto the 2nd CP
- Changed the 2nd forward respawns @ the middle CP to create more cover in that corner of the space, prevent spam over the rocks; added billboards to middle
- Initial (main) Spawns moved forward & up into the glass window room of the warehouse, all of the useless space to the left removed
- Cave ceiling added to 2nd, with many new details like skylights & increased lighting on the lower route to make it more attractive
- Detail greatly improved, including a lot of new greenery, new overlays, and more decorative ground water
- Changes to health & ammo: sm->med ammo in yard, med->sm in hole, med->small at last, moved health/ammo by last spawns, sm->med at long tunnel
- Bug & clipping fixes

screenshots: http://img35.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=cpspillwaya80003.jpg

 

[kankle_king]

Sorry I haven't been able to look at this for a while, am gonna fly trough right now and see if I can test.

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

Gameday bump!

Thoughts, Concerns, Opinions, Reactions, Anecdotes, Excuses? Anyone?

 

[Ravidge]

Gameday bump!

Thoughts, Concerns, Opinions, Reactions, Anecdotes, Excuses? Anyone?

1. Theme still feels kinda bland. I think you're aiming for hydro-ish, but there is too little structure to make it interesting. We'll see what you come up with for beta though.
2. Sentryguns on the roof...
3. It's still a good map
4. It was hard to fight in the area between 2nd -> mid.
5. All my favorite sniperlines had been 'fixed'.
6. I was playing blindfolded.

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

Bwahahaha Ravidge that made me rofl. >:3

The theme... oh the theme. I purposely avoided having too much of the indoor-Hydro/industrial because that's been done before, e.g. Vector, Eureka, Hydroelectric. So far I'm the only one who's tried to recreate the Hydro cave areas on this scale and I think that's where the charm lies. Now, it may turn out that it's still too visually bland, but that can be fixed with lighting and detail areas and 3D skybox.

The plan, for now, is to release maybe one more alpha to address some small layout issues, mainly the location of the initial spawn and the routes to last. From there I'm going to displace... or at least someone will. I'm seriously considering bringing in someone else who's very very good at displacements to help me out. Then it'll be detailing time. :3

As far as sentries on the roof: I hate that this is even an issue, but it's happened twice in my tf2m tests and brought the test to a SCREECHING halt both times. I got basically no opinions on the map today other than "Zomg, map sucks since sentry farms are good here." While that may be true, it doesn't address the issue at hand, that somehow the map makes people want to do such a useless thing. It takes an engineer a good 2 minutes to get a base up there, and in that time their team probably lost the fight and middle and 2nd because they were down a player (or two...).

Solutions: A) Nobuild the roof. I'd really hate to do this. B) Raise the roof enough that engineers can't reach it. This would hurt the balance for the rest of the classes, I feel. C) Ignore it, knowing full well that Engineers can still grief this way. I'm tending to lean towards option A, since it's just annoying more than it is effective. Today the problem was that BLU actually had 4 engineers in all overlooking spots... which, on a 12 person team, means that BLU also had no chance whatsoever to push out, and we had a lovely stalemate.

Things I need feedback on
1: The balancing of the paths at last: are they all equally useful? how can they be made to flow better?
2: The initial spawn: any ideas on where to move it to?
3: Spawntimes: do they need to change?

-FoXy

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

Proposed changelist for a9:

1: Reworking of flow around last: Pull the tunnel exit further towards the last CP, have the bridge across the gap/ramp move from where it is now from this tunnel exit to a direct path to the CP (via a doorway). Remove the walkway around the outside of the pillar between the last CP building & 2nd, and use that space to open the main pathway up more.
2: Increase thickness of ceiling @ 2nd/4th in order to decrease the perceived size of the area.
3: Raise the light levels @ 2nd/4th.
4: Fix the clipping on the hills at middle AT ALL COSTS. Try to open up some of the narrow pathways around the CP.
5: Move the health at last CP (in front of the window) out of the open and into a corner.
6: Change the location of the initial spawn to be in the rear of the current building, spawning facing towards the CP, with the option to either go left (up) or down (right).

Does anyone still think that the floor at yard or hole is too low? This is the LAST chance for that to be changed, I'm not going to throw that in later like it's nothing, because it WILL be a pain in the ass.

 

[ScorpioUprising]

Reccomendation for the roof: Raising it doesn't seem like such a good option. Try putting a prop or a little fence right near where the engineers are dispensering up, blocking the telporter exits. That way, rjs and stickies get you up there fine, but engineers can't get up there. Roof should def be offlimits for engies, and the four or so peeps you see getting up there is likely to be a rather common occurence i'm guessing, especially since it appears easier to do than gravelpit.

 

[absurdistof]

Could the billboards be more accessible? I tried to get up there as a FaN scout and I was far away at best. Seems the only way is to rocket jump on the hoodoo's, then again to the billboard, or dual sticky jump.

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

The billboard could certainly be lowered a bit, yes. I don't think it holds much use for scouts to begin with, though. The easiest way to get there is to either rocket or sticky jump out of the water, which will propel you very much higher than normal. :3 Most people don't exactly know that, but I'm sure they will figure it out after trial & error. Also, can't a single rocket from below get up? >_>

As for the roof... bleargh. I've been told to avoid nobuilding it at all costs. Frankly it doesn't bother me as a sentry spot other than it takes FOREVER to get a base going, therefore almost always causing the team whose engineer(s) decide to build there to lose. I'm not going to do a thing about it for now, but if it happens at my next tf2m test (the only place it's happened so far), I'll probably put a small railing around that side of the building.

In a9, the floor of the yard and the lower area of the hole has been raised by 64 UNITS!!! Yes! It's been a pain in the rear, but it didn't take too long. I'm worried that my ceilings in certain areas may be a bit low now, but that will come with testing. Also, my beautiful floodgates look smooshed. >_>

-FoXy

expect a9 next weekend at the latest

 

[captainAngry]

 

[FreeLance_FoX]

a9 will be coming tomorrow, I SWEAR!

My hammer crashed at 12:30 (now) and I gave out, so I'll go in and finish it tomorrow. I just need to plug some strange new leaks, fix the doors I mirrored, and add spec-cams (which I keep putting off >_>).

Stay tuned!