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pl_halfacre

Discussion in 'WIP (Work in Progress)' started by YM, Sep 21, 2008.

  1. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    Rockets do often have some kind of exahust pit just below them, this one just happens to be filled with nuclear waste.
    I know its a little strange but then pretty much all the launch locations in TF2 don't make logical sense, I mean how the hell did they get a saturn V sized rocket into the middle of dustbowl?? build it in situ?? I think not, or how about those huge rooms in well, no one would launch a rocket of that size in that nice clean room it would just ruin the room, not to mention the structural integrety of the building. And in goldrush, theres a track leading right up to a pit of neatly stacked nuclear waste, they certainly didn't tip the barrels in so how did they do it? theres no door into there..
    How about in turbine, those containers in the middle room, how did they get there, there aren't any doors bigg enough to take one of those and a lorry, and theres no crane or anything. Gravel pit - who would build tunnels that end half way up a cliff?? even if they aren't part of your complex you'd still make sure they ended at ground level or make a ramp up to them.

    I'm just trying to make it clear that there are a lot of unrealistic things in TF2 that aren't just because of its cartoony style and they you need to take things with a pinch of salt.
     
  2. zpqrei

    aa zpqrei Theme Changer Extraordinaire

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  3. Mr. Happy

    Mr. Happy L6: Sharp Member

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    [​IMG]

    Does this guy really look like he's thinking when he builds these places?
     
  4. flubber

    flubber L4: Comfortable Member

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    Well this guy have a problem with the a2, the red spawn is way too far from the beginning of the map 20 seconds to go from spawn door to cart in scout ! It's 5 more than badwater for exemple, and it's a sentry in T1 instead of T2.
     
  5. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    Whilst I could be pedantic and explain a few of those with a few, if only circumstantial arguements, i wont. I get you.

    I just thought you couldn't decide between toxic barrel pit or rocket launch site so you used both. I was just gonna suggest either/or so your map seems less "schisophrenic" with concepts.

    I meant my statement to be more a conflict of idea's rather than "oh you'd never see that irl, so why have you got it here?".
     
  6. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    Yeah I see where you're coming from, however going on past experience (hoodoo) I've learn't that payload endings don't work so well without the lovely pit of death thing, and since I was determined to get a rocket in there the two ended up together. I could justify it more but it really isn't worth it is it.
     
  7. shdw.puppet

    shdw.puppet L2: Junior Member

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    wow... my entry, while coming along great, is no where near that kind of quality, the displacement cliffs are just...wow. I continue to be impressed the quality of your work. I clearly have a lot of work to put into this...
     
  8. Chilly

    Chilly L6: Sharp Member

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    I think it'd be funny if a map didn't have an explosion or pit of death, but rather just a little flag that popped up with a "SUCCESS" text/image on it. Something really corny that's the complete opposite of what people expect. A Super Mario Brothers flag with fireworks would also be fun. ;)
     
  9. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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  10. Spike

    Spike L10: Glamorous Member

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    Cool :O
     
  11. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    I just loaded up _a2 and had a go, on my first attempt I managed to get teleporter entrances and exits up a dispencer and a level 1 sentry before the gates opened with my sentry halfway to level 2.
    On take two I ditched the teleports and had a level 3 sentry and a dispenser up way before the gates rose, ten seconds or so before.
    On my third attempt I managed to get both teleports up, a dispenser and a level 2 sentry up all before the gates opened.

    I'll admit I did just stick my SG on top of the ammopack in the small building and knowing the locations of all the ammopacks helps a lot but I really didn't stuggle to get a decent sentry up. I know that in the heat of the moment you've got other engies and other stupid classes taking ammo before start up so its not always this easy.

    All that said, I do get where you're coming from with it being too long from red spawn to the battlefront, even if I mamaged to get to the cart as a soldier in the 'waiting for players' time.

    Here is the route I took to build my level 2 sentry before the timer started:
    [​IMG]

    On this overhead, can someone please draw on where you thing sentries work well, should work well and where ammo packs should go.
    [​IMG]
     
  12. flubber

    flubber L4: Comfortable Member

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    Wel tonight we should test the map with a full server, you're welcome if you're available (you should expect a heatmaps) tomorrow. I'll give more feedback after the test.

    Well this is really a quick dram T for TP exit, arrow pointing direction of the sentry.
    In fact there's not a lot of spot where sentry can be posed and resist, i mean you need more "isolated" spot where only a uber (demo, heavy, pyro, whatever). Otherwise anywhere on this part sentry can be taken down by a isolated player, where destroying a sentry should be a teamwork. A team which cannot work together to destroy a defense doesn't deserve to win (it's my own TF2 opinion).

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2008
  13. shdw.puppet

    shdw.puppet L2: Junior Member

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    Im no pro engi, but I think that it might take a total of two sentry guns to keep a solid defense, with each watching the others blind spot. This map is not designed for an engi to really do much of anything. Its got a lot of spots I would demo from, it looks great for that...
     
  14. Chilly

    Chilly L6: Sharp Member

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    Is there a download link for this I'm missing? I see comments about distances and things like that, which are hard to tell without playing on the map.

    I've love to try giving recommendations about sentry locations, but it's hard to do with an overhead shot by itself, since you can't see all of the different angles. Flubber's locations look decent enough (there's only 2 I disagree with and only 1 teleporter area he missed), but I think it'll be easier to give recommendations about minor improvements once I'm able to run around on it a bit.

    I think it's going to be hard making really good sentry locations in that first area because of the vertical openness of the area. It's similar to Badwater's first area... all of the sentry locations suck until you get far enough along to get some protection from high rocks, buildings, and overhangs. Otherwise a good demo will just toss a few stickies over.
     
  15. MangyCarface

    aa MangyCarface Mapper

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    Played it the other night. Tell you right now, from point 1 to point 2 is way too long, wayyy too long. It's hard enough to get it around the first corner, let alone the 2nd and 3rd turns. Move point 1 up to right around the first corner.
     
  16. flubber

    flubber L4: Comfortable Member

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    Got to agree with Mangy for the first corner between 1-2 threee sentry cover the whole area if a good pyro or demo is protecting them, may need a secondary shortcuts (taht will help defense to set up as well :) )
    After 2 is taken, it s a long straight way to th end without more heights difference or big turn it makes it a little boring. (maybe due to dev mode for now)
    There's a lot of cliff that will make make an inge happy but it's unreachable :'(.
    Resupply in final red spawn are broken.

    Will play it again tonight for more feedback.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2008
  17. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    I've reworked the back area and turned it into the more built up area I had at first envisaged rather than the natural wasteland it kinda became, this has allowed for better placement of respawnrooms, I've now got two at the back instead of just one, which (unfortunately) means red now have four different spawnrooms (although I might combine the last two since they share a wall)
    I've also moved the first point round the corner so that its now halfwa up that long hill, I think this should work better if I rework the adjacent building slightly so that sentries are slightly better off in there.
    I'll try and get it finished up by tonight so I can get another testable version out.
     
  18. flubber

    flubber L4: Comfortable Member

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  19. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    Due to the new situation where players would be running for miles and miles I've added in a new blue forward spawn which should cut 15 seconds off their run distance, that section should now be far more balanced.
    I've also added some of those signs that pop out of the ground like in badwater.
    I'd add pics of both but I've not installed photoshop yet...doh!

    Was there anything else that people have noticed recently?

    Edit: oh, I've alsofixed the problem where people would leave the spawnroom and turn around to find a locked door, it wasn't actually locked, you just didn't walk far enough away.. its all fixed now hopefully, a stupid oversight on my part caused that.
    I also think I've adjusted the respawn wave times to shift the balance of the first leg of track
     
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2008
  20. TheDarkerSideofYourShadow

    TheDarkerSideofYourShadow L10: Glamorous Member

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    The door was the the bothersome problem I noticed.

    The other major issue I had was the lack of cover in this map, particularly for SG places. For example, along that long uphill at the first point, there are several places I can see where an SG would be nice, but it is possible to outrange them (unless you have 3-4 engies to cover all entrances). Basically, you need to hope Chilly gives you an sg map again :)

    And in general, the map, to me, felt very open. Particularly the first area, where you can almost get a sight line across the whole area. More cover in general, I guess.

    Specific, detail type things:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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