[GUIDE] Balance, layout and your A/D map.

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
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Mar 4, 2008
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Minor and major are terms that relate to the space available for players to exit, not how much they are used. This relates to the amount of damage a player recieves through concentrated spam, and the ground space available for said exit to exist. This was discussed later in the article by defining the main route as the shortest and most dangerous path to the objective. The exit size can be considered unrelated to a player's choice of path, a choice that is dictated by the scenario's topographical design and players class. The door size is a matter of map balance. What you are considering is the terminology of "primary and secondary" to determine a doors significance, this would have the correct context. A designation that relates to player use and importance rather than it's physical appearence and balance. Which is what you seem to be talking about, and not what i have discussed here.

Having few small exits increases the defencive capabilities of Red and prevents the map from progressing due to concentrated fire and subsequent spawn camping (IE bad, IE the exact gameplay mechanic Valve chose to remove from TFC>TF2 by omitting grenades and increasing the number of spawn exits in the port). Making one exit larger is one way of preventing the concentrated fire effect, as is including an additional smaller exit somewhere else. This is what we call balance by choosing between them, and was the basic discussion you seemed to mis-interpret. we can mix up numerous combinations of -many minor-, -few majors-, or -few minors and a major- exit. As long as there is that choice a map will progress beyond this part smoothly. What i have discussed is the freedom of Blu to exit their spawn and how this is achieved through varying designs, whilst considering how too many exits dilute player population and too few saturates them.

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Secondly i am aware that in the second image you mention the exit is visually "2 minor exits" how ever they exit at the same place and pointing out this seperation is rather pedantic, because: Choosing which of the two exits you exit from means little in the way of tactical choice. Both are vulnerable from the same sniper 'alley', the same sentry nests, the same ambushes and the same counter attacks, and exit on the same ground from the same wall (with the exception of a counter attack aimed at flanking the one way door). This is what constitutes a combined exit.

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Thirdly, you didn't seem to assimilate the disclaimer. This is a template, not a comprehensive tutorial on how to build your A/D map. The discussion was generalised to prevent people copying existing maps and increase the variety of approaches to this template. There was no need to create a stage by stage analysis, only for taking key points. I did however originally start off with a stage by stage analysis, and you can see perhaps discussions i have omitted from the coloured arrows i have not expanded on in the related annotations. Such discussions were ultimately either irrelavent or reitterations and later culled for focus.
 
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MrAlBobo

L13: Stunning Member
Feb 20, 2008
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Secondly i am aware that in the second image you mention the exit is visually "2 minor exits" how ever they exit at the same place and pointing out this seperation is rather pedantic, because: Choosing which of the two exits you exit from means little in the way of tactical choice. Both are vulnerable from the same sniper 'alley', the same sentry nests, the same ambushes and the same counter attacks, and exit on the same ground from the same wall (with the exception of a counter attack aimed at flanking the one way door). This is what constitutes a combined exit.

Just as an add on, while the 2 paths do exit in virtually the same place, I wouldn't call them the same due to them not immediately reconnecting on the other side. Like, you have a heavy standing in the right exit you could still conceivably use the left exit and entirely avoid the same heavy. ie there are positions where one exit would be more targeted then the other, rendering them different.

However if your goal in that pic was just to cover the area actually depicted, (as I thought in the first place) and the hallways are not included in that equation, then referring to it as one exit should be perfectly fine.
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
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Mar 4, 2008
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Ok, i added in a section on progressive difficulty.

I also went through and took some screenshots without the nodraw, but in a lot of occasions this meant seeing into other areas of the map, over or around displacements and other nodraw walls, which was quite disorientating. Some were ok and i'll sneak those 3-4 images in to hopefully reduce the intrusive yellow nodraw issue.

Did i miss anything else?
 

Garner

L4: Comfortable Member
Aug 16, 2009
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amazing :D
thank you :)
 

Sgt Frag

L14: Epic Member
May 20, 2008
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Pretty good analysis overall but I think the sizes you mentioned are lsightly misleading.

Looks like you gave the overall size of dustbowl in it's entirety (?). Maybe not all A/D maps will be in a big square.

Might be a bit more useful if you compare the actual fighting areas. For example the outside hallway where blu has that nook before the last corner to the last point is about 128 units wide and I think it was 1024 long.
Most spots (combat areas) I measured when I was looking at it for my map were between 512 and 1024 long and 128 to 256 wide.


I think cap points were 2048 units apart, no matter how the spaces between them are divided, they are all pretty much the same distance apart with the first caps being closer to blu spawn than that and the second points being almost right outside of red spawn.

Overall I think Dustbowl is a very well balanced and fun to play map, so IMO it's a very good one to look at when defining spaces in your map.
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
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Mar 4, 2008
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Looks like you gave the overall size of dustbowl in it's entirety (?). Maybe not all A/D maps will be in a big square.

Well, those measurements are the individual CP "arena's" irrespective of internal details like minor structures. I had to leave out some extra bits as some areas were slightly "L" shaped, so i concentrated on the main CP fight area (between round gates to the far wall). The smaller buildings wern't necessery to measure as as i said, it's not a comprehensive analysis of dustbowl, it's about general rule of thumb for A/D layouts.

What one can hopefully take from that data is that they read that Dustbowl's area's are generally between 1500 and 2500 units in length/width and throw down a couple of these area's and release a map layout in the knowledge that most of the distance requirements for decent and complimentary gameplay mechanics are met. Without the need for potentially excessive trial and error development.

the outside hallway where blu has that nook before the last corner to the last point is about 128 units wide and I think it was 1024 long.

This doesn't include the ledge space, which is important. Dustbowl already suffers from a lack of space in some areas more than others, and this is one of those spaces. No lengthy corridor that is intended to be a main route of attack should ever be 128 units wide. There's a reason why Badwater is the favoured A/D map, and that's because of the extra breathing space available to players. Remember, Dustbowl is still a port from an older game with differing gameplay mechanics, some additions made have been made to the layout to improve gameplay but it is still not a flawless design.

edit: Now that you mention it, and before i upload the fresh overheads without nodraw interference, it might be more useful to include overlays displaying area sizes that illustrate that? Rather than just a list of data.

I'll see what i can come up with to make this more understandable.
 
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Sgt Frag

L14: Epic Member
May 20, 2008
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Yeah, I understand it's hard to explain every little detail. Some of that mappers just have to decide for/experiment with themselves.

Just thought I'd point out some approximations of what I found. While maybe a bit bottlenecky at that last area I think Dustbowl plays preety well overall. I never played TFC either, so I'm not really up on which maps were ports.

But still, pretty helpful tut overall.
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
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Mar 4, 2008
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Updated some of the images for improved visual understanding, and corrected the odd grammatical error. I hope the change in resolution isn't too off putting. Hm. Might just update all the images so they're the same size.

Watch your step here.

Tinker is quite right. Dustbowl is relatively cramped and thus very sentry friendly. If you want to make a map referencing/inspired by Dustbowl, i would recommend widening/generally increasing lines of site by perhaps even just 256 units, if not 512. But the main issue with this map is the building/structure placement interrupting lines of site to sentries regardless of overall area size. IE 1-2, 2-2, 3-1, 3-2.

edit: included sentry sight distance in OP (1100 hammer units).
 
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grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
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Updated a couple more of the images for increased legibility and relavence.
Added a paragraph on "methods of area divides".
Added a word on alpha textures such as glass or chicken wire not blocking vis.
 
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