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[WIP] cp_crashcourse

Discussion in 'WIP (Work in Progress)' started by terrorist_hell, Aug 12, 2008.

  1. terrorist_hell

    terrorist_hell L1: Registered

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    Link to FPS Banana

    I'm busy right now on a full revision, but with the same core gameplay in mind. This map took me roughly 24 hours to make (working hours that is), bearing in mind a month of 'educational training' in Hammer. Overall, it was well received the times I've tested it with 24 players.

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  2. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    Hl2 fences? I guess it's not the worst thing you could have taken from hl. Also, your map serisouly needs a skybox.

    You could be a lot more creative with your architexture, it would make your map prettier (fitting the TF2 theme), more optimised and remove the need for those fences everywhere.
     
  3. terrorist_hell

    terrorist_hell L1: Registered

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    It has a 3D skybox, just a very simple one. Everything outside the fences are skybox props and brushes. I like the fences actually, it's makes the area more open instead of (displacement) walls. I think the map fits the TF2 team quite well, keeping in mind the scale of this map. You don't need to like this map, but I do :)
     
  4. doctor killing

    doctor killing L1: Registered

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    there is tf2 fences you should use the hl2 ones dont fit the tf2 theme
     
  5. yellowcake

    yellowcake L1: Registered

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    I don't mind the fences personally. Makes it a bit original. Kinda looks like a prison.
     
  6. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    I'm not saying i don't like it, i'm saying a lot can be done to improve it. Visually. If i didn't like what you had so far, i wouldn't have replied. It would just be nice to see some effert put into building an environment for you map rather than a generic linear mish mash of arena's. Or atleast.. the one arena with spawns on either side.

    What i meant by "could do with a skybox" is.. more than a flat displacement and a hoodoo prop. I can see you have a basic 3d skybox. But if you're going to expose your level to so much open space you need a suitable, quality 3d skybox.

    The fences are ok, but having fences cordoning off your entire map is a very "noob-ish" mapper technique. I don't mean to be offencive, it just is. Atleast you havn't oversized your map like the majority of other "my first map" efferts. If you are going to surround your map with fences then create the impression of an environment where that would fit, rather than just placed there where it quite obviously just looks like something there to keep the player from escaping.

    I'm just saying it would be nice to see this map become more. Since it is very basic in the first place. Though you'd probably want to move onto a more sophisticated mapping project tbh.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2008
  7. terrorist_hell

    terrorist_hell L1: Registered

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    I'll say this for once and for all:

    I have 1 month of experience

    Don't sue for things I can't manage right now. Same as you can't ask from a student programming to 'clear up things' or simply 'write a better code'. You guys are waaaaaay too demaning and probably 95% of you are talking theoretical, just my 2 cents. Anyone can have the best map in his head and criticize others, but actually creating it, that's when people suddenly shut up (or keep on whining).

    I mean, I know it can be better, just like you suggested, but as off now, I don't have the skill to do it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2008
  8. luxatile

    aa luxatile deer

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    There's no reason to get angry over some constructive criticism. Nobody's bashing your map, all the comments here provide useful tips for improvement - and there is definitely room for improvement.

    You've done a good job so far. I mean, actually having a 3D skybox and a very complete-looking map (by which I mean, no visible errors as far as I can see, looking very functional) after one month of Source SDK experience is impressive, so keep it up.
     
  9. Laz

    Laz L7: Fancy Member

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    Most people come here to recieve critiques. Its what makes you a better mapper, we dont force you to do all those things, but we just tell you where you could improve, as we tell each other. You just pick out what you can manage, one step at a time.
    Don't expect everyone to go nuts over your first map. they wont. try and use the comments you get to improve your map.
    If we would think the map is totally crap, and you have no talent as a mapper, we would not take the time and effort to look at your work and provide you with tips.

    nobody ever said this was gonna be easy :)
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 2
  10. terrorist_hell

    terrorist_hell L1: Registered

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    Thanks for the comments, though I think people take things for granted too easily. But yeah, I'm glad I got this far and understand most of it. Optimizing is the hardest part, and you have to keep that in mind while designing your level. I have quite some trouble with creating walls without making them boring and lifeless. That's why I took the easy route with the fences on top of low wooden walls.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2008
  11. Chilly

    Chilly L6: Sharp Member

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    Your spawn building in the 3rd picture looks like it could use a bigger roof. Right now the door seems to go all the way to the top of the building.

    The fences really don't bother me, but the railing in the 3rd picture does. It doesn't look like it fits. I think having fences separate the areas will make it very hard to optimize, but it looks like a small map so I'm not sure that matters all that much.

    Do you have an overhead picture of the whole map so we understand how it's supposed to play? I know I could download it, but being a server admin that on average adds 3 new maps each week, I frankly won't download a map unless I understand the gameplay. :)

    A better 3D skybox would definitely help, but I've seen most mappers have the best luck with this when they do it last. This map really does look like a prison, so perhaps leaving an open field around the prison, then another fence and guard towers, and then some buildings/trees/displacements/etc would be an interesting choice.

    Once you're to the point you really want to wrap up the map, I'd suggest additional details like pipes/electrical fixtures on the walls, some light posts and other details outside, and some decals/overlays.

    You're doing a decent job so far, so don't get offended when people suggest changes. Some suggestions will be awful and others will be helpful, so try being less "personal" with your map and try figuring out which suggestions would really help it be better.
     
  12. terrorist_hell

    terrorist_hell L1: Registered

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    I don't see any door reaching the top of the building. What do you mean exactly?

    Oh, and it wasn't the intention to build a prison, nor does it look like one in my opinion. It was just a way to keep a small area relatively open and fresh, yet closed in another point of view. It doesn't really have a setting, and getting a setting right requires quite a bit of thinking and skill. I don't wanna do 50/50, it has to be perfect to my own taste. I tried drainpipes and electrical stuff, but it was too busy, therefore I removed all of that stuff. The quick action overrules this aspect.

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    Last edited: Aug 13, 2008
  13. stubby

    stubby L1: Registered

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    well um. most prisons have A crapload of barbed wire fence.
    get rid of the tf2 models. they do not fit the theme.
    make the map more detailed.

    stop whining about how your in experienced.

    also. spend more time on your map before showing other people.

    it gives you a bad rep.
     
  14. Chilly

    Chilly L6: Sharp Member

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    Well that's hostile. I do agree that you shouldn't keep talking about being inexperienced though. It's not that it's a bad thing, it's just that it doesn't matter. Really experienced mappers get the same amount of feedback as new mappers on these forums, so there's really no need to repeat it.

    As for the prison thing, it's definitely the barbed wire and small space that's giving that feel. If you don't want it to look like a prison you'll need to switch the barbed wire for something else and/or open the map up considerably.

    So this is a single CP map? I'd suggest looking at koth_garbage_day and consider using the logic/entities from that, since King of the Hill will play a little more fun than just a single CP. It's the same thing except you have to hold it for a certain amount of time and the time carries over.

    From your overhead I see where the confusion on the spawn door comes from. You have 2 walls with a door in between. I believe there's a battlements sign on the wall. The door/walls look wrong somehow, since the door goes to the top of the walls. The BLU side looks a little better for some reason, but I think you might want to try alternatives for those areas.
     
  15. terrorist_hell

    terrorist_hell L1: Registered

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    I still don't know what you're talking about :) It looks fine to me. 2 spawndoors for each team and one on top of the ledge. KOTH sounds interesting.

    I'd rather finish some "less good" maps and get attention and feedback from the community, rather than polishing a single map to perfection and spending a lifetime doing it. I could expand it, put stuff in it, etc. and never be done actually because my mind keeps pouring with ideas. That's a bad thing in a certain way, you have to finish the map somehow. That's what happend with cp_crashcourse in my case, it's done. Not perfect in any way, but I'm proud of it :) Like I said, it's a showoff of what I'm capable of what I can do today, not what I could be doing 2 years from now. Even a perfect map isn't gonna guarantee a 100% succes, so why bother (relatively spoken ofcourse)?
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2008