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CP Takeback a16

Take back what was stolen from your team, and take their land while your at it.

  1. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

    Messages:
    32
    Positive Ratings:
    4
    Takeback - Take back what was stolen from your team, and take their land while your at it.

    In a previous encounter; Red has driven Blu back into a useless Garage. A plan to Take Back the whole cement mill from Red, and while they're at it, they will take Red's iron mine, and shipment center as revenge.


    This map is currently in Alpha, and is mostly textured, it has been tested with bots, has been optimised, and is finally ready to be tested! Good Luck Have Fun.

     
  2. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    Positive Ratings:
    4
    Changed Control Point 1 entrance
    added new flank routes
    Changed blue spawn height
    changed a few soundscapes
    removed shutter doors
    fixed displacements
    edited 3D Skybox
    Adjusted Place Space Skybox
    Added a window between Control Point 1 room, and Control Point 1 Entrance

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  3. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    4
    Fixed sightline
    new path in cave
    new entrance to shed
    details added
    details removed
    widened Red Spawns
    added new path to control point 1 upstairs
    adjusted sound scapes
    moved props infront of blue spawn
    rotated spawn door on blue forward spawn
    changed sky box
    KYLE THE SECURITY COW
    fake Joshua Tree Shadows
    fake Cactus
    more Spy Tech
    removal of Dev Texture (WE ARE STILL IN ALPHA)
    adjusted lights in cave

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  4. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    Numberus Bug fixes
    New Windows
    changed outside upstairs path to new hallway
    added clipping to stop camping in a single corner on point 2
    added no build zone to the Capture Point 1, and 2
    added one way door to cave next to capture point 2

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  5. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    32
    Positive Ratings:
    4
    Added, and packed 1 custom texture (Try to Find it)
    Optimizations
    fixed one way door opening from wrong side
    skybox change
    changed tower outside Red Spawn
    added staircase outside Red spawn
    Changed Sniper_fence1.mdl to a chain link fence

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  6. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    Positive Ratings:
    4
    Closed Door across from first point
    Prop Fading
    roof to center building
    new door way into First Point
    new Red Forward Spawn (will adjust later, Just a place holder)
    Added Displacements
    If anyone ACTUALLY Reads these. say Jonny Boy in the Feed back please.

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  7. Wilson

    aa Wilson Boomer by Sleep

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    Positive Ratings:
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    I have noticed that this map has had a big disconnect between the changes being made and the feedback in the system, what has been said in the demos and how the map generally plays. I decided to do one better than leave a phrase in the changelog in the system and make a big post explaining what I think are major fundamental flaws that this map has, because people are only going to start reacting more and more negatively when they have to repeatedly play a map that core issues are never truly addressed. It has genuinely felt like that the skybox has seen more changes than the rest of the map if you look past textures and detailing being added.


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Let's start with the major areas of this map, all of them are essentially large boxes that have been filled with props and occasional buildings to break the sightlines, which result in large, flat and boring gameplay spaces that only really offer anything handful of nine classes in this game. Most of the height is very high and very absolute, there is little variation. If you look at the official layouts, they very rarely are fit into a specific shape and you can see that everything was built piece by piece, not filling a predetermined area. All the wide open flat space makes it hard to hold areas and the routing feel very spread out. Speaking of routing being spread out, there are a lot of hallways and long series of rooms on this map that don't really serve any purpose other than spreads the players out far and wide.

    [​IMG]

    Look at all these routes that more or less lead you to same area, all starting out in such spread out manner. More routes does not equal better gameplay, generally if you want there to be a lot of routes, there needs to be a bottleneck somewhere. Choke from which most if not all options start from so that attacking team is grouped up, offensive engineers have an area to set up in and acts as a barrier to prevent the defensive team from wandering too far out from the area they are supposed to hold once they lose control of the said area. This map doesn't really have any of that, which results in a chaotic and confusing flow where trying to hold an area feels next to impossible because people just get scattered everywhere.

    In some cases the routes are their own entire area, far away from the "main" routes, making them either useless and liability because teams once again get spread out too much. Case and point, this entire area after A:

    [​IMG]

    Looking past these major issues, this map has a habit of giving blue very powerful high ground and areas for almost totally free with only play for red being putting all their eggs in one basket and holding that specific area. Case and point, these two areas below.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    These areas give players in them almost complete overview of the points, the holding positions and the defensive entrances to the point, both of these areas also have multiple routes to them for the attacking team and no real route for defenders that don't require you to wander into blue areas to access. This totally negates the gameplay around the points and makes it all about controlling these specific areas, something this powerful should be earned through a fight. There is no reason, for example, the balcony on A point couldn't be like this.

    [​IMG]

    This would let the defenders easily rotate between the two heights without having to leave the point they are supposed to defend and make the gameplay feel much more natural.

    I know this post pretty much implies that you need to massively rework large chunks, even entire segments of the map, but I don't think this map is salvageable in it's current state without some massive reworks to it's most base components. If it is any consolation, the first half of the map has some potential to work without having to totally rebuild every single thing but I would personally just redo the second half and take the previous iteration as a learning experience for the future. A lot of B right now is built on a house of cards, a wide variety of patchwork fixes to sightlines, scaling etc., that is going to eventually come tumbling down when the push comes to shove.

    - Jonny Boy
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2021
  8. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

    Messages:
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    Positive Ratings:
    4
    I appreciate this. genuinely. not only did you provide some really decent material, you finally opened my eyes to what is wrong.
    Right now, I am not worried about building Hight, that's something for beta and I start detailing properly.
    I am working on A8, making some changes that where shown here. One of my biggest frustrations with this map; is the lack of useful feedback. most of the time, and you can look on the feedback page, is mostly just nitpicks, and not genuine feed back. Yes there is some here, and there; but it was not enough to make a major difference. So again. Thank you.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  9. Wilson

    aa Wilson Boomer by Sleep

    Messages:
    1,360
    Positive Ratings:
    1,171
    I am not sure what I am supposed to be looking at here because the feedback pages for every version of Takeback look like pretty standard feedback pages to me, a lot of valid feedback about the same things multiple times, people wondering why nothing is changing and people touching upon the very same issues my post talks about. I don't see how all this feedback (Latest version got 41 annotations, that is a lot) is somehow not useful or genuine.

    I hope you are not expecting people to just write paragraphs upon paragraphs into the system, detailing exactly how to change and fix the issues on the map. That is not feedback, that is other people making the map for you instead of you making the map yourself. Not to mention, players are going to be busy actually playing your map, they are not going to often stop playing to write something extremely detailed. You shouldn't expect feedback to give you exact solutions to problems barring some exceptions, instead you should ask yourself why people are saying these things, why do they feel the way they do about the map. Ask why players or certain classes are not having fun. You should watch demos and ask why something is playing the way it is, watch how certain players are trying to play the map and ask why, etc. Feedback and player experiences are a guiding post, not an absolute set of instructions on how to improve the map.

    Attacking feedback you get and people leaving the feedback will get you nowhere, it will only discourage people from leaving any at all and is honestly a pretty dick thing to do overall. If you still want people to go more in depth or give you specific suggestions, you could just ask people who have played the map on discord. If someone who has played the map is online and sees the message, they are usually more than happy to give you their thoughts on things.
     
  10. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    Positive Ratings:
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    Moved red forward spawn
    added vertical detail hight
    added more signage
    adjusted staircase on point
    added more med and ammo packs around the map
    added detail to final set up room thing
    added new flank rout to back of Red spawn on final point
    changed some stuff around on final point
    changed textures
    removed rocks
    to many changes to note down

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  11. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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  12. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

    Messages:
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    Positive Ratings:
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  13. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    32
    Positive Ratings:
    4
    Replaced rocks with shed
    added fence to block capping snipers from camping red forward spawn
    adjusted cave
    moved some fences around
    made the hall between blue forward, and Capture point A wider
    added lights close to the floor in barn past red spawn
    added a light under shed by final capture point
    adjusted prop locations
    adjusted prop fading

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  14. nesman

    aa nesman oh god how did this get here

    Messages:
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    338
    [​IMG]

    I'm going to be real with you as much as I can be. The respawn times are too long.
     
  15. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    32
    Positive Ratings:
    4
    Yeah, I didn’t know how to
    properly change the time, so I had the logic set to 10 and 20, and not 5 and 10 like it should have been.
     
  16. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

    Messages:
    32
    Positive Ratings:
    4
    Removed upper cave entrance
    turned first cave into a hall
    Updated 3D skybox
    Updated 2D skybox
    Fixed Respawn Times
    adjusted clips
    shortened the
    added a no entry door that closes on red forward spawn when blue caps
    adjusted sun angles

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  17. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

    Messages:
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  18. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

    Messages:
    32
    Positive Ratings:
    4
    Adjusted Cave wall
    changed blu forward spawn door
    Moved Blue Forward spawn
    adjusted wooden bridge
    Adjusted skybox brushes
    adjusted textures
    Removed and Replaced the large shed in Blu starting area.
    Added Custom props (Credits go to all the prop makers.)

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  19. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    32
    Positive Ratings:
    4
    New Path to split a sniper sightline
    Cliff adjustment
    texture adjustments
    moved props
    moved wall
    moved rocks
    adjusted Red Shed
    spawn room adjustments

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  20. Sir Perry

    Sir Perry L1: Registered

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    32
    Positive Ratings:
    4
    added new hall between cap and first hall
    added kill trigger in Red Spawn that turns on after point is capped
    added new flank path into yellow hall
    added new door outside blue forward spawn
    added new ramp to cliff
    adjusted bridge from the barn to cliff
    major changes to last cap
    changed boxes from stairs
    moved props around
    added more props around
    adjusted fade distance

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