Lets talk politics

[Seba]

Some North Carolinian politician's campaign advisers are being sued by Morgan Freeman because they used a voice actor who sounds exactly like Freeman in an ad for the politician. Kinda relevant to the thread, right?

 

[DJive]

Of course this only applies to a small amount of people that your media chooses to highlight which I then may or may not see. So my views on this is probably skewed in ways unimaginable.
I hope it's not as bad as I see it, because from here it looks like madness.

Its worse then you think or see. It's terrible and the republicans winning midterms is even more a scare.

 

[lana]

Something that completely baffles me is how some politicians over there can get away with some of the stuff they say and/or do. It seems there's a new story every other day (at least for the past months leading up to this election). Stories that should ruin these peoples reputation and creditability as candidates/representatives for years, possibly permanently. Yet nothing happens, and next week it's pretty much forgotten because something else has happened.

Honestly, the President should have no control over most domestic affairs, so whatever he does in his personal life/says/invokes upon his party to do are really irrelevant to the campaign as long as their foreign affairs are intact. Or the midwest votes them in.

 

[Leminnes]

First, Leminnes, your "response" annoys me.

I'm sorry? My point was that Obama HAS done things. Maybe not as quickly as either of us would like, but if you're going to get pissy because he hasn't turned the government, an establishment more tightly wound than Victorian corset, around in 2 years, your expectations are far higher than they should be.

Here, have a field day: http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/

 

[lana]

Obama hasn't done as much as he could do. Healthcare needed reform, but economic stability was far more important. Slicing out Bush tax cuts and plugging up loopholes while there was a Democratic majority was probably the largest problem he needed to tackle, but now that there's no chance of a Dem. majority ever again, businesses will continue to be unregulated and destroy the economy even more.

That said I support healthcare reform.

EDIT:

By the way Obama is in violation of my opinion of a good president because he exists to fuel internal reform.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

What I do not get is how people can complain about the stimulus and agree with bush tax cuts.

 

[lana]

I didn't agree with any of Bush's policies, besides speeding along the immigrant legalization process

 

[DJive]

My personal favorite is they let bush kill for for 4 years.. then gave him another 4 years to kill us further and yet we get upset that in 2 years Obama hasn't fixed everything and we get made at him.

What a nation full of idiots we are.

 

[WastedMeerkat]

I don't understand American politics. Luckily I'm one whole ocean away so I can safely ignore it most of the time.

Something that completely baffles me is how some politicians over there can get away with some of the stuff they say and/or do. It seems there's a new story every other day (at least for the past months leading up to this election). Stories that should ruin these peoples reputation and creditability as candidates/representatives for years, possibly permanently. Yet nothing happens, and next week it's pretty much forgotten because something else has happened.

Of course this only applies to a small amount of people that your media chooses to highlight which I then may or may not see. So my views on this is probably skewed in ways unimaginable.
I hope it's not as bad as I see it, because from here it looks like madness.

Nope, you pretty much nailed it. Eddie Bernice Johnson, for example, was caught sending 15 scholarships to her family members, and they weren't even in her district. Her excuse was [paraphrase] "If there were more deserving applicants in my district, I would have given them the scholarships." She later on gave them to other people in her district, but I personally don't think she should have been allowed back on the ballot. Of course, she won reelection anyway. I just gave that example in particular because I live near that area, but you could pretty much find something similar in every state.

Anyway, you guys know what the Fed did today? They decided to print off $600 billion to buy a bunch of U.S. Treasury bonds. Hurray for buying our own IOUs of IOUs! How does this make sense? Since when was "quantitative easing" (aka inflation) a good thing? We all recognize that devaluing the US Dollar is bad, right?

(Also, Nerd, I still don't see why you don't get that trickle-down works. I guess you just think that all rich people just get their money then they pull completely out of the market and become hermits. On the contrary; chances are that the company he earned his wealth from only grows and employs more people than it initially did. Then the money he spends on useless things, guess where that goes? It goes to other companies and keeps them running, too. If he has a gigantic house built, he gives jobs to architects, construction workers, safety inspectors, etc. Then the people who invested in his stock early on also get rich and use their money to do the same thing: invest and employ. This all makes sense to me, but I guess you're stuck thinking that taxpayer funded jobs are what employ most of America. Also, your comment about the top 1% of the economy is stupid. Tax brackets are stupid. We need a flat tax rate, because even the rich people earned their money one way or another. Even if it's money they were born into, it's still rightfully theirs.)

 

[absurdistof]

On that last point I have to contest with you Wasted, on two terms.

The first is that I agree with nerd about trickle-down economics. There is overwhelming evidence to support that rich families tend to not only stay rich, but in fact get richer, acting as an antithesis to the entire idea of trickle-down economics. They spend money, but not nearly enough as to push trickle down economics into the green zone.

The second point is not so much something against you but something of interest. I was just learning today how the esteemed value of work changed over the industrial revolution, with the emergence of mass unskilled labor. A topic brought up was that today work is considered much less of ones life then it was pre-industrial revolution, and the notion of value of earned money has dropped off a cliff ever since Rockefeller and Carnegie made their millions on the backs of thousands. To summarize, I don't believe in the value of hard earned cash because I don't think it possible in most applicable cases of trickle-down economics. Additionally, this isn't counting those who inherit their money.

Finally, my thoughts on democracy are close to Ravidge's, but I will say that I absolutely detest the "team mentality" of republicans and democrats.

 

[grazr]

stuff

Saying that, it's not like the same isn't true of Britain. We had several expenses scandals over the past years and the Conservative Party was the worst cuplrit of them all, with expenses fruad in the hundreds of thousands of British Pound Sterling. Whilst most Members of Parliament resigned over the issue, the ones who should have didn't; and "we" still (somehow and for some reason) voted the Conservative Party in, the MP in question who spent the most of the tax payers money out of them all was voted in by her represented area as well.

It's like the majority of people voting don't actually know what the fuck is actually happening.

As far as mid term elections go it seems a little silly, over here we're implemented the opposite scheme. The coallition government is protected from re-elections for 4 years so that the country can see some stability, for better or for worse (i believe the last coallition government lasted 6 months).

 

[Terr]

Something I think idealists of all ideologies agree on (as opposed to entrenched politicians of all ideologies) is that the US' plurality voting system sucks. I practically guarantees a two party system due to how the math works, and that makes every single election an issue of "voting for the least-shitty candidate who might actually be able to win". To relate to absurdist's post, it also causes that "team mentality".

 

[Numerous]

Something I think idealists of all ideologies agree on (as opposed to entrenched politicians of all ideologies) is that the US' plurality voting system sucks. I practically guarantees a two party system due to how the math works, and that makes every single election an issue of "voting for the least-shitty candidate who might actually be able to win". To relate to absurdist's post, it also causes that "team mentality".

I agree.

Although I've realised that politics isn't so much about trying to somehow convince the opposition that your methods are much better, as it is to convince the clueless that you and your ideology are better in every way, using some basic slander/record polishing (for you, and your opposition) and some bullshit facts that are increasingly one-sided as you continue your "arguments", and that anyone who seriously thinks they can convince someone who decides to talk politics with them is either feeling incredibly optimistic, is incredibly lucky, or is incredibly deluded.

Of course, in these forums there isn't much in terms of slander/record polishing.

 

[drp]

welcome to american politics.

its all a clusterfuck with no end in sight. heres how i see it, and it will probably be the last post i make on the issue.

both republicans and democrats have their problems. big problems. democrats like to throw money at problems. republicans like to create problems with money.

democrats claim to about the people. and i do belive that, because wanting healthcare and removing the bush tax cuts was a step forward.

now the republicans. they're for less govt (supposedly) and less spending (bullshit). ofcourse, under the last administration the govt got even bigger, and spending skyrocket with tax cuts and 2 fucking wars that we didnt need. but those bombs we pay for need to be used right? how else will our war machine keep moving if we dont use it?

now, republicans have openly said they want to extend the tax cuts to EVERYONE indefinately. poor, middle class, and rich.

why the rich? and why do the tea party, that consists mostly of middle to lower class families support this? because they've been told by their republican senators and representatives that tax cuts for corporations will allow the wealth to trickle down. of course, its been proven that it doesnt work that way.

 

[DaBeatzProject]

welcome to american politics.

its all a clusterfuck with no end in sight. ...
[/IMG]

Ohhh then please watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ceg6NQKHd70 and try to understand it.

 

[drp]

Ohhh then please watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ceg6NQKHd70 and try to understand it.

wooooooooooooooooow.

 

[Pocket]

You know, I think that americans should stop whining and start implementing preferential voting. At least then, voting for someone other than one of the two main parties will actually do something.

Why not? Are you all too dumb to fill in more than one box?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preferential_voting

That's never going to happen. The only people with the power to change how the voting system works are the people who are already in government, and guess what, they're not about to just voluntarily make it easier for other people to take their jobs.

I don't understand American politics. Luckily I'm one whole ocean away so I can safely ignore it most of the time.

Something that completely baffles me is how some politicians over there can get away with some of the stuff they say and/or do. It seems there's a new story every other day (at least for the past months leading up to this election). Stories that should ruin these peoples reputation and creditability as candidates/representatives for years, possibly permanently. Yet nothing happens, and next week it's pretty much forgotten because something else has happened.

You would be shocked by the amount of shit incumbents can get away with. Witness the late Strom Thurmond, who filibustered against the Civil Rights Act in the '60s, an act so heinous that another Senator, Trent Lott, was pressured into resigning after saying the guy should have become President. And yet Thurmond himself suffered no loss of reputation for this and continued to serve until his death in 2003.

Or Robert Byrd, who was a member of the fucking KKK at one point, who also continuted to be reelected until his death earlier this year.

You'd think stuff like that would be a gold mine for their opponents; can you just imagine the commercials? "He tried to block the Civil Rights Act. I don't know which is more shocking, that he's that racist or that he's that old. Either way, it should be obvious to anyone with half a brain that he should not be in our government any more."

 

[Numerous]

That's never going to happen. The only people with the power to change how the voting system works are the people who are already in government, and guess what, they're not about to just voluntarily make it easier for other people to take their jobs.



You would be shocked by the amount of shit incumbents can get away with. Witness the late Strom Thurmond, who filibustered against the Civil Rights Act in the '60s, an act so heinous that another Senator, Trent Lott, was pressured into resigning after saying the guy should have become President. And yet Thurmond himself suffered no loss of reputation for this and continued to serve until his death in 2003.

Or Robert Byrd, who was a member of the fucking KKK at one point, who also continuted to be reelected until his death earlier this year.

You'd think stuff like that would be a gold mine for their opponents; can you just imagine the commercials? "He tried to block the Civil Rights Act. I don't know which is more shocking, that he's that racist or that he's that old. Either way, it should be obvious to anyone with half a brain that he should not be in our government any more."

I figure people are like goldfish, with the memory slightly adjusted due to a longer lifespan.

If enough people kick up enough shit about it, then eventually you should be able to get something through, as I see it.

 

[lana]

No you're talking about midwesterners. They don't know what's good for them unless someone's laid out everything that's bad for them.

 

[TMP]

Voting is a terrible system for knowing what the public wants anyways.

Here's proof

I just roll with the punches. I have opinions, I have choices, but I'm not honestly concerned whether the american people are happy or not.