- Thread starter Penguin
- Start date
I think the layout is nice and dandy. The only thing I wish for you to change is the top of the roof. The roof is fine to stand upon, but the very tip should be clipped, as it is really hard to shoot people off of there, let alone see them up there.
Also, the 3Dskybox is going to be fun to make eh?
Also, the 3Dskybox is going to be fun to make eh?
Waif
L7: Fancy Member
- Mar 22, 2009
- 412
- 125
Seems like balance is coming along well. Sometimes it feels like there's a few too many directions you can be attacked from, but I suppose thats to be expected with all the hieght differences. From what I played it seems all classes can perform fairly , snipers do seem to have it hard though.
- May 21, 2009
- 2,039
- 1,484
Snipers are a very fragile thing to balance in arena.
Seeing as they can instakill from great distances, they can be greaty rage inducing when combined with no respawn. At the same time, I don't want to make them totally useless.
Seeing as they can instakill from great distances, they can be greaty rage inducing when combined with no respawn. At the same time, I don't want to make them totally useless.
Exist
L6: Sharp Member
- Oct 31, 2009
- 306
- 136
Arena always has a hard time making snipers useful. Little notes on Valve arena maps and how they made snipers useful.
Arena Well-
-The doors on the side allow for a nice sight line, but at the same time causes pressure from the bridge and the other doors.
-The small, yet exploitable gap between the train cars and walls allow for a cheap shot on match start.
Arena Nucleus-
-The side routes have a strange curve the allows (at the right angle) shots up the stairs.
-As soon as you leave the spawn, there is a bunch of stacked boxes that supply quick cover for snipers and spies.
Arena Watchtower- (I know it's a community map, but theres still learning to be done).
-The grainpipes hold the only health on the map, making them a resource to all classes. Yet, it is also easily exploitable to snipers on the ground.
-health up high, ammo down low. This seems to keep a nice flow in the map.
Arena Badlands-
-Under the bridge shows a unique spot for sentryies to sit.
-As sniper friendly, I can't say much for it...
Just some notes..,
Arena Well-
-The doors on the side allow for a nice sight line, but at the same time causes pressure from the bridge and the other doors.
-The small, yet exploitable gap between the train cars and walls allow for a cheap shot on match start.
Arena Nucleus-
-The side routes have a strange curve the allows (at the right angle) shots up the stairs.
-As soon as you leave the spawn, there is a bunch of stacked boxes that supply quick cover for snipers and spies.
Arena Watchtower- (I know it's a community map, but theres still learning to be done).
-The grainpipes hold the only health on the map, making them a resource to all classes. Yet, it is also easily exploitable to snipers on the ground.
-health up high, ammo down low. This seems to keep a nice flow in the map.
Arena Badlands-
-Under the bridge shows a unique spot for sentryies to sit.
-As sniper friendly, I can't say much for it...
Just some notes..,
BrokenTripod
L5: Dapper Member
- May 11, 2009
- 248
- 65
Just whining without having read anything else in here.
1. There's an exit sign in the spawn room that feels completely unnecessary, since there's a giant door and it's literally the only way to go and you can't even get back in here anyway. I personally think you should not to oversign things, but no biggie if you leave it.
2. You might want to add a clip plane/clip players when the door closes, because you can get caught on the frames of the spawn door.
3. Playing a pyro now, I can't tell if you're supposed to be able to get on the orange ledges to the left and right of the spawn. It's alllmost jumping height, but I can't make it, or it's clipped.
4. There's a penguin fisheries sign on both sides to the left as you come out of spawn, and in this area, there's 3 wooden door frames that are exactly the same. I feel like it's unnecessary and part of that should just be a pillar, if anything? It's like the tiniest possible room before being outside. It just bugs me.
5. Dunno if it's just me, but the area with small health on the left/right sides feels like it should be raised so I don't have to crouch just to get back up. Not sure if you did that to make people less likely to go over there or what. Having to jump up is fine, but there's a possibility that someone will jump and not crouch, then have to jump/crouch again, which ruins their flow, if you knowwhatImean.
6. Actually a lot of these arrows feel unnecessary. There's one on the ramp that just points down at the opening that's obviously there. (If you go up the ramp and turn around).
7. Also, up that ramp, if you look to the left side there's a stack of crates and you can't jump on those. It's weird. Also, if you jump down to that orange ledge I mentioned earlier, you can't because there's a clipping plane here. You should probably raise the ledge off this direction so you can't make this jump? Or put some nice trees or something. (But you said dustbowl stage 3, so I dunno)
8. Also, that ledge where the ramp is seems a bit too tall. If you're trying to Spy and have someone following you, it would be really cool to smoothly jump over that ledge behind the guy chasing you instead of clumbsily crouch jumping onto it, then running off the ledge.
9. In the cap building, the little ledges you've been consistently using outside is used and I really feel like you should replace it with a metal prop so it's more catwalk-y. You're probably planning on doing this.
10. It really sucks to jump to the middle beam at the top of the building for the small health and have to fall and take fall damage. You can't jump back the way you came, and you can't comfortably land on any of the walkways that are elevated unless you walk to one side and crouchwalk/slide. Dunno how to fix this, so you might be okay leaving it the way you have it. Maybe make the healthkit a medium one so that you actually can have a netgain in health if you go in with ~1/2?
11. I don't think the paths on the far far right and left (with the full ammo) get used that much currently because there's really no cover here at all. If you want it so they still have a disadvantage by using this area (other than the fact that they're lower than everyone else in the map), perhaps give them something small to use for cover, like a barrel or small rock? Just so they don't get mowed down too easily.
12. Can you make the far far right/left buildings w/ full ammo slightly lower? Mostly so that when you back into the stairs that lead into them you automatically walk onto the steps instead of stop? Also maybe move the walls back or clip them so that you can casually walk into them backwards while firing the opposite direction? I ran into that corner at least 3 times during play and gave up on it.
13. Underneath the spawn area, there's a bunch of pillars and some boxes. Navigating the box/pillar part is very terrible because it looks like you can fit with just a small hop, but you hit the lantern, pillar and the top box and it's basically terrible.
Yeeeeep.
1. There's an exit sign in the spawn room that feels completely unnecessary, since there's a giant door and it's literally the only way to go and you can't even get back in here anyway. I personally think you should not to oversign things, but no biggie if you leave it.
2. You might want to add a clip plane/clip players when the door closes, because you can get caught on the frames of the spawn door.
3. Playing a pyro now, I can't tell if you're supposed to be able to get on the orange ledges to the left and right of the spawn. It's alllmost jumping height, but I can't make it, or it's clipped.
4. There's a penguin fisheries sign on both sides to the left as you come out of spawn, and in this area, there's 3 wooden door frames that are exactly the same. I feel like it's unnecessary and part of that should just be a pillar, if anything? It's like the tiniest possible room before being outside. It just bugs me.
5. Dunno if it's just me, but the area with small health on the left/right sides feels like it should be raised so I don't have to crouch just to get back up. Not sure if you did that to make people less likely to go over there or what. Having to jump up is fine, but there's a possibility that someone will jump and not crouch, then have to jump/crouch again, which ruins their flow, if you knowwhatImean.
6. Actually a lot of these arrows feel unnecessary. There's one on the ramp that just points down at the opening that's obviously there. (If you go up the ramp and turn around).
7. Also, up that ramp, if you look to the left side there's a stack of crates and you can't jump on those. It's weird. Also, if you jump down to that orange ledge I mentioned earlier, you can't because there's a clipping plane here. You should probably raise the ledge off this direction so you can't make this jump? Or put some nice trees or something. (But you said dustbowl stage 3, so I dunno)
8. Also, that ledge where the ramp is seems a bit too tall. If you're trying to Spy and have someone following you, it would be really cool to smoothly jump over that ledge behind the guy chasing you instead of clumbsily crouch jumping onto it, then running off the ledge.
9. In the cap building, the little ledges you've been consistently using outside is used and I really feel like you should replace it with a metal prop so it's more catwalk-y. You're probably planning on doing this.
10. It really sucks to jump to the middle beam at the top of the building for the small health and have to fall and take fall damage. You can't jump back the way you came, and you can't comfortably land on any of the walkways that are elevated unless you walk to one side and crouchwalk/slide. Dunno how to fix this, so you might be okay leaving it the way you have it. Maybe make the healthkit a medium one so that you actually can have a netgain in health if you go in with ~1/2?
11. I don't think the paths on the far far right and left (with the full ammo) get used that much currently because there's really no cover here at all. If you want it so they still have a disadvantage by using this area (other than the fact that they're lower than everyone else in the map), perhaps give them something small to use for cover, like a barrel or small rock? Just so they don't get mowed down too easily.
12. Can you make the far far right/left buildings w/ full ammo slightly lower? Mostly so that when you back into the stairs that lead into them you automatically walk onto the steps instead of stop? Also maybe move the walls back or clip them so that you can casually walk into them backwards while firing the opposite direction? I ran into that corner at least 3 times during play and gave up on it.
13. Underneath the spawn area, there's a bunch of pillars and some boxes. Navigating the box/pillar part is very terrible because it looks like you can fit with just a small hop, but you hit the lantern, pillar and the top box and it's basically terrible.
Yeeeeep.
Godslayer57
aa
- Sep 1, 2009
- 573
- 323
I find it's a bit strange that the door opens when you spawn. However I love it as it's quite Pyro friendly 
- May 21, 2009
- 2,039
- 1,484
Oh BTT....
1) I plan to flesh out the spanws a bit more when I commence detailing, but you're probably right.
2) I don't quite understand what you mean with this one.
3) I followed the rule of hydro, "It's boring so you don't go there."
4) Uhhh, sorry. It's not gonna change. I don't see why it would bother you.
5) Lots of people say this, but I think I'm gonna move the health anyway, so this will be a nonproblem.
6) Good point.
7) See #3.
8) Are you sure you can't clear that? It's just as tall as all the other railings.
9) I really have no idea to what you are referring here. The railings?
10) Pros land on the railings and don't take fall damage.
11) I'll certainly look into it.
12) Uhh I think I'll just clip the stairs to offer a ramp from all angles, or remove the stairs and replace them with displacent mounds.
13) I'll jiggle those around a bit so that everyone can fit.
@Godslayer: I don't really see how the open door is pyro friendly, but okay.
1) I plan to flesh out the spanws a bit more when I commence detailing, but you're probably right.
2) I don't quite understand what you mean with this one.
3) I followed the rule of hydro, "It's boring so you don't go there."
4) Uhhh, sorry. It's not gonna change. I don't see why it would bother you.
5) Lots of people say this, but I think I'm gonna move the health anyway, so this will be a nonproblem.
6) Good point.
7) See #3.
8) Are you sure you can't clear that? It's just as tall as all the other railings.
9) I really have no idea to what you are referring here. The railings?
10) Pros land on the railings and don't take fall damage.
11) I'll certainly look into it.
12) Uhh I think I'll just clip the stairs to offer a ramp from all angles, or remove the stairs and replace them with displacent mounds.
13) I'll jiggle those around a bit so that everyone can fit.
@Godslayer: I don't really see how the open door is pyro friendly, but okay.
Godslayer57
aa
- Sep 1, 2009
- 573
- 323
I ment the map was pyro friendly not the door, my mistake due to not being very clear.
- May 21, 2009
- 2,039
- 1,484
I am unsure how to deal with demos, really.
I know how to play them and everything, but it seems like total guesswork regarding jumping to ticks and I wouldn't even BEGIN to know where to begin with video conversion.
I know how to play them and everything, but it seems like total guesswork regarding jumping to ticks and I wouldn't even BEGIN to know where to begin with video conversion.
Moose
L6: Sharp Member
- Nov 4, 2009
- 312
- 616
Only because I let you :O
really great map. love the speed of it. <3 rikka's commentating too.
one thing that really annoys me is when you fall from the roof to get the health on those slightly lowered platforms, you take fall damage, and then you have to kind of bounce putting yourself in danger and taking more time.
Its just really awkward.
another thing that was annoying was heavies raining down from the roof, but meh, nothing you can do about that.
one thing that really annoys me is when you fall from the roof to get the health on those slightly lowered platforms, you take fall damage, and then you have to kind of bounce putting yourself in danger and taking more time.
Its just really awkward.
another thing that was annoying was heavies raining down from the roof, but meh, nothing you can do about that.
Horatio Weapons
L1: Registered
- Jul 23, 2010
- 5
- 4
Cool map, but I really don't like the railings in the outdoor areas, they just block movement.
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=934312
A nice guide for recording demos without FRAPS or whatever.
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=934312
A nice guide for recording demos without FRAPS or whatever.