Brainstorming, want comments for ctf_hedge_maze

[Geuel]

So, I've started brainstorming for my second map, ctf_hedge_maze.

Concept Picture (Top-Down View)

Basic Rules:
Capture the Flag: 4 captures to win
There is one flag
There are two alternating flag spawn areas
There are two alternating capture areas for each team

Basic Layout:
Top-Left: Red Capture 1 == Top-Right: Blue Capture 1
Bottom-Left: Red Capture 2 == Bottom-Right: Blue Capture 2
Center-Left: Blue Spawn == Center-Right: Red Spawn
Top-Center: Intel Spawn 1
Center-Center: Intel Spawn 2
The Left and Right side are symmetrical with the exception of a vortex-like spiral maze in the center of the map.

Features:
-As the name implies, most of the map will be made up of grassy hedges.

-The "maze" aspect will not be very difficult, since I want the users to be playing in an environment that feels like a hedge maze. I don't think they should have to figure out TOO much.

-There will be guidance through the maze in the form of Signs, Beacons in the air (showing the active capture point), and Ground Lines ("Ah, like in hospitals? That's a *very* good idea" -dirtyminuth).

-Hedges will vary in height to allow various levels of jumping over-ness. Most will be just high enough to disallow scout-jumping over.

-While standing on a hedge, players will be forced to crouch

-There will occasionally be "gaps" through the hedges that players can crouch to go through.

-The Center-Center Intel spawn will be in a room in the center maze. The middle room in this maze will have 2 doors. The door on the blue side will allow blue to enter one way and red to exit in the opposite direction. The door on the red side will allow red to enter one way and blue to exit in the opposite direction. Effectively, once you enter the room, you have to leave out of the other door.

-There will be plenty of out of the way dead-ends

Considerations for each class:
Scout: Can jump over some walls, can traverse maze quickly.
Pyro: Plenty of corners.
Soldier/Demo:Can jump over just about all walls
Heavy: Some walls may be shot through while standing.
Engineer: Plenty of places for Sentries/Exit Teleporters
Spy: Plenty of out of the way dead ends to hide
Medic: Many people are anticipated to get hurt
Sniper: A few longer hallways and corner-pathways for sniping.

Things I need to make/find:
-Good textures/sounds for hedges and hedge interaction
-Figure out how to force players to crouch
-Figure out how to do multiple alternating Intels/Capture Areas

 

[Dox]

-While standing on a hedge, players will be forced to crouch

Why?

Medic: Many people are anticipated to get hurt

Nice

 

[Geuel]

-While standing on a hedge, players will be forced to crouch

Why?

Well, hedges aren't solid. So, I originally thought to just find a way to hinder the player's movement, but then the suggestion was made that I could simulate this by making the player crouch.

Plus, it would have the added bonus of preventing players from jumping from the hedge...which in real life would be quite difficult.

 

[grazr]

func_friction? Is that still an entity in hl2?

 

[trackhed]

http://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Trigger_vphysics_motion

 

[dirtyminuth]

Got a chance to test a few ideas here: http://tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=1144.

Long story short, point_clientcommand can be abused, there is no func_friction entity in TF2, and there is no trigger_vphysics_motion in TF2.

And on to map thoughts:

This map will be too confusing for most people to get into. Why? Alternating flag spawn and capture areas, the fact that the map is a maze, and dead ends. At least consider having static flag spawn and capture areas, or have holograms / signs far above the maze so that they're visible from all parts of the maze.

 

[Geuel]

Got a chance to test a few ideas here: http://tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=1144.

Long story short, point_clientcommand can be abused, there is no func_friction entity in TF2, and there is no trigger_vphysics_motion in TF2.

And on to map thoughts:

This map will be too confusing for most people to get into. Why? Alternating flag spawn and capture areas, the fact that the map is a maze, and dead ends. At least consider having static flag spawn and capture areas, or have holograms / signs far above the maze so that they're visible from all parts of the maze.

My original concept actually only had one intel spawn point. However, I was thinking through it and figured what would happen was this:

One team, let's say RED, gets the intel. They battle fiercely, maybe die a few times, but ultimately score.

At this point, they are in an offensive position and most of the action is going on in the left side of the map, since BLU has been defending. The intel spawns again in the middle...it's much easier for RED to get the intel again.

I really like the beacon idea for the capture points, though. =)

 

[Paria]

one thing you could do is to break the hedges down into various colour schemes, to help with player navigation, the red team could almost be the autumn colours (rustic reds/browns), and blu summer i guess

i have no idea what textures or how your going to make a realistic hedge, but you could ease player naviation without making it too obtrusive, if you had a decent selection of textures.

 

[R3dRuM]

Sounds interesting, but i dont agree in making it a hedge. 2 Bases in the shape of a maze would be cool.

 

[MangyCarface]

I think your heavy players are going to get murdered in such tight corridors... they only work well as a class in a decent amount of space around them. Also, pyros will probably dominate... just some thoughts on balancing, those "large" areas might have to be more numerous/bigger.

 

[Earl]

I'm having bad flashbacks to those horrible skyscraper maps with the mazes in them....

 

[l3eeron]

This is all My own humble, amateur opinion


I really really hate to sound negative... but this map will not get any good air time.

Why?

People are too lazy to learn maps, let alone, a maze. Add to that hindered movement and you've got a pile of frustrated players.

Unless it's done up to par with the stock maps it won't be popular (maybe you dant care about that, maybe it's for your own tastes) But if you're looking to make a server filler, this will not do it.

Again, not because of your "bad" idea, but because people don't want to spend hours learning the layout before they can successfully frag an enemy.

Afterthought:

Maybe if you had something like a minimap people could navigate without frustartion.