Karat

CP Karat a4a

Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
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203
Waffe submitted a new resource:

Sleekiercrete - Medieval themed mirrored 5CP with plenty of curves and height differences

I'm back?

Thought to give this another shot, maybe finalize it as I did like this map a lot (and apparently so did many others.)
cp_sleekiercrete_a9_1.png

^ A point

cp_sleekiercrete_a9_2.png
^ A-B, back alley

cp_sleekiercrete_a9_3.png
^ A-B, close side (the water area connects to both B and C)

cp_sleekiercrete_a9_4.png

^ B point. There's a small entrance left of this image, not visible in this shot

cp_sleekiercrete_a9_5.png
^ Behind B, water connector...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Sleekiercrete with a new update entry:

Version a10

- Changed upper mid to be more choky
- Moved mid spawn to the other side, making it less spawncampable and providing better options for the respawned players to reach B
- Added sign to water connector under B. Also, coming from C, the exit towards A is now better hidden to promote players moving to B
- Func_detail-ified the mid dish. Not yet relevant as I'm running fast vvis
- Camera at red's A was assigned to team blu, fixed that
- Under A: moved hidden ammo to water surface
- Added a ring...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Sleekiercrete with a new update entry:

Version a13

Big update

Feedback: map is overcomplicated/too cornery/unfocused/untidy
- I'll try to remove some paths to streamline the combat some more. Tried to eliminate some "corner gameplay". There is still a big question about the second to last area, what should it be turned into?
- I doubled down on the second's underground area, making it a bit more complex than the previous version (easier to enter/exit). To promote the underground area, the upper mid connection to second was...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Karat with a new update entry:

Karat a1 / Sleekiercrete a14

Name changed from Sleekiercrete to Karat.

The full name history is now:
  1. Convenientcover
  2. Sleekcrete
  3. Mainz*
  4. Sleekiercrete
  5. Karat
* Idolon's entry to a detailing contest, which used Sleekcrete as a base.

Names considered:

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Clips around mid highlighted in red. Had to make these manually with vertex manipulation, calculating the angles I could have them so that they would not be invalid.
 

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Karat with a new update entry:

Version b1

Ooh boy, 265 checklist items done. Major changes include: new mid (rip radar dish, welcome "toilet tower"), preliminary art pass, rescaling mid and area between second and last slightly and added "crow's nest" highground and cover to the second point.

Other notable changes are improved signage, moved third spawn closer to defender's second (I tweaked respawn times to accomodate this) and redistributed pickups.

Also, removed spawn invuln as that simply confused players. Added respawn...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
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203
I'm going to try a significant layout change for my next version. The last will be rotated 180 and "attached" to the second point in what was previously the back area. I'll additionally close the larger of the two underground paths from mid to lower second, leaving the "choky" one as is. Also, this lower path connects straight to mid, almost forcing the player to the point.

1670456615679.png

^ BLU second and last, before changes

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^ After changes. The second-to-last connector might become too choky but that remains to be tested.

My main reason is to alleviate layout confusion, which has been a reoccurring problem for many (including myself). The player must make zig-zagging turns in the previous W-layout. Making one false turn makes one feel instantly lost. (The underground paths make this worse, of course.) Now that the layout is in a U-shape, it's easy to turn to one direction subconsciously.

A second reason is the mental picture I got of the last points: a BLUE and a RED castle separated by a very narrow ravine. Might even do some Ronia: Robber's Daughter style split of one castle:
1670457329110.png


EDIT: One problem that might get worse is the fact that you can as an attacker completely bypass the second point and run towards the last point. It's not as bad as it were in a previous W-layout version, where the one-way door below second was always open (making backcapping far too easy.)

This idea came to me before b1 was even tested, and I sorta regret going beta before trying it out. It'll take some time to connect everything up nicely, redoing the lighting, then mirroring and rotating it all to the RED side making a playtest version to focus solely on the last and second points. In the worst case, this will be a waste of time and I'll revert to my b1 vmf.

EDIT #2: Map link to test version
 
Last edited:

Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Karat with a new update entry:

Version b1a

This is an in-between update where I've changed the routes from lower-second to mid. The larger arching tunnel is now blocked, and an additional archway into mid has been opened. Those defending their last point will also have a respawn time of 8 instead of 7. Those attacking the last point will still have a respawn time of 6.

My next update will be a 2cp version of BLU's last and second point with the intention of testing a new layout + some balance changes. In case the new layout is trash...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
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203
Waffe updated Karat with a new update entry:

Version a2 (following b1)

I should start making smaller, more frequent updates... Anyways, here are some significant changes made:
  • The layout has now changed from a W-shape to a U-shape. This has the following benefits: more intuitive for new players (as it should be less confusing to always turn in one direction, subconsciously), better optimization and less egregious sightlines between last and second. A drawback to this is that the layout is possibly a bit less interesting, so I would really like to hear...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Karat with a new update entry:

Version a2a

Oopsies:
  • Seems like I forgot to untrigger the red's last forward spawn. Fixed that.
  • Made the highground slightly less blinding at mid (ground)
  • Fixed a spot players could get stuck in.
Things noted:
  • Map is a bit messy (geometrywise) so it needs some streamlining. Personally I don't like how the lower connector to mid plays, but I don't know yet how to fix it. After streamlining I need to try to reduce the visual clutter/mess as well.
  • Map seems to roll a...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
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203
I think I will go for a northern european medievaly vibe to cp_karat as the "standard european medieval" theme is popular enough as it is. Aiming for something like Sigtuna and Visby (see below) which is more wood-y and bright compared to cp_karat currently. For RED's side I thought blood red walls with white highlights, similar to what I had for the second point in beta pl_flowerbed. Last points will remain as fortresses/castles.

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Sigtuna

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Visby
 

Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Karat with a new update entry:

Version a3

Made some changes in response to feedback:
  • Last's lower route is no more (RIP 2014-2023). I think it is time to admit that it brought on more issues than it solved. A fourth entrance might need to be added to last in case it becomes too easy to hold with sentries but for now I'll leave it as is.
  • Big changes to respawn wave times. Times start at 3-3 instead of 6-6. Capping mid increases the attackers time from 3 to 6. When attacking the last point, the times are as they were in...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Karat with a new update entry:

Version a4

Changes made:
  • Everywhere
    • Changed respawn times to 6-6, with 6-9 when attacking last
    • Redistributed pickups
    • Tried to alleviate visual clutter, still needs work
    • Forward spawns now have one-way glass doors
  • Last
    • Opened up upper route more for both attackers and defenders
    • Made cover at point shoot-through
    • Added stairs up to high ground from point
  • Courtyard (outside last)
    • Simplified layout
    • Added a route to second's high...

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Waffe

L5: Dapper Member
Dec 2, 2012
230
203
Waffe updated Karat with a new update entry:

Version a4a

Changes made:
  • +1 Respawn time (from 6-6 & 6-9 to 7-7 & 7-10). The force respawn cuts the times somewhat short
  • Fixed some visible nodraw
  • Added arrow sign at the back of second
  • Some clipping things
  • Clear boundary to mid cap zone
Things todo:
  • I'm going to raise the lower points by 64 HU to make the height differences between courtyard and second smaller.
  • Points are generally too easy to defend. Need to promote offensive plays somehow

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