PL Swiftwater (swift revisited)

Discussion in 'Map Showcase' started by What Is Schwa, May 18, 2009.

  1. Wilson

    aa Wilson Burial by Sleep

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    Well instead ranting how Schwa massacre all fun, you could always give him feedback on what makes it so terrible.
     
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  2. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    If you can't run swift in DX8 add me on steam and lets talk!

    Speaking of feedback, I'm about to roll out another version. However, I'd like to make sure people who were having DX8 problems can play the next version. If you were unable to load it previously PLEASE ADD ME ON STEAM and I will send you a sneak peek version.

    This next update is a big one.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2011
  3. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    Thanks for the feedback. I'd love if you took screenshots of places you feel need visual improvement. I admit, I'm not very good at aesthetics and am just sorta winging this. I thought I was moving in the correct direction, but feel a bit "two steps forward, one step back" about this whole project.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2011
  4. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    I'd also like to mention that the skybox has been gone for a very long time. I plan on putting one back in when I've finalized the layout.

    I'm in talks with Rexy to do some custom model work and perhaps even a custom skybox texture. Stay tuned!
     
  5. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  6. LeSwordfish

    aa LeSwordfish semi-trained quasi-professional

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    Man, schwa, ever heard of the edit button?

    Since i don't like to be flippant without at least a stab at being helpful, Can i say that i don't like the habit you seem to have of sticking sheet metal props in between poles as cover? It bugs me because it looks really off, using what is usually junk lying around used seemingly in the intrinsic part of a building. Maybe i've just been conditioned to think of all those props as "ramshackle". (for the same reason, i dont like the corrugated iron prop wall on the second floor by the staircase in that picture.
     
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  7. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    That is a very valid complaint. I hadn't really considered it before. I was more or less following gravelpit's example of "metal everywhere." It is a cheap way to add color and flair. I'll mull over solutions in my hollow skull.

    Thanks!
     
  8. tyler

    aa tyler snail prince, master of a ruined tower

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    tbh I thought it was kind of a clever thing to do. makes about as much sense as the 2fort sniper fences.
     
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  9. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    I think I was over using them. I appreciate a fresh set of eyes giving real feedback.

    I changed it a little bit and I am happier with the result:

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2011
  10. Citizen Snips

    Citizen Snips L3: Member

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    I really hope that Valve's attention is brought to this; it's definitely one of the maps up there that most deserve being made official.
     
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  11. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    Again, if you or someone you know is having problems with DX8 please CONTACT ME. I cannot replicate the problem and want to make sure Swift is playable for everyone.

    Add me!
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/whatisschwa
     
  12. zort

    zort L1: Registered

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  13. Sergis

    aa Sergis L666: ])oo]v[

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    your map managed to successfully freeze my dx8 on mapload. it has happened before with swamp water and pl_corrode which uses custom slimetexture i think. from what i know its because of custom waters having something dx8 related set up wrong or missing.

    however i was having this problem with arena_huaca_a1 (arena_kieranator_72), yet loaded huaca a2 just fine and theres no water in that map afaik.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2011
  14. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    There was an issue with a water brush that was causing DX8 users to crash. This issue is fixed.

    Unrelated to the DX8 issue, it has come to my attention that people using some high FPS configs have trouble with Swift. Currently I don't think there is anything I can do about it.

    To resolve the issue I would suggest doing as the config suggests:
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2011
  15. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    Current version is pl_swiftwater_final_rc

    No known bugs. DX8 works.

    Until further notice, there will be NO MORE UPDATES. (hooray!)

    I have made all the changes I feel are necessary. There are a few minor areas of polish that will be touched up at my leisure. All that is left to do is fine-tweak balance from community feedback. I feel this is something that can only happen with lots of data and players.

    If you are a server operator and have hard stats please link me them here. I'll update the OP with everyone's stats as they come in.

    Thanks to everyone for playing and testing this map. I hope you enjoy it as much as I do.
     
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    Last edited: Aug 23, 2011
  16. Citizen Snips

    Citizen Snips L3: Member

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    To this day, the biggest gripe I have with the map is the final spawn area; never before have I seen people take the stairwell to the upper house area (I'm talking in the courtyard, not defending the final point). That area should be prime real estate for Snipers, as well as the fastest method for RED to pour out into the field, instead of taking the more "natural" route of the lower path and being ran over by oncoming BLU.

    The thing is, the way the room is positioned, when people spawn they walk out towards that main room under the houses. And what do they see? An open path to the courtyard. The stairwell to the upper houses is off in the corner and not as visible. So, naturally, people who aren't 100% familiar with the map will take the visual cue and go through the lower path, and even people who are familiar with it will go that way through instinct. You shouldn't have to actively search out the stairwell and ignore your primal urges to go through the most visible path; that should BE the most visible path, seeing how it's the best one to defend the courtyard from.

    What I still don't understand is, why even make that lower area not part of the spawn room? Just slap a door over the opening to the track, and you're good. Not only would it encourage Engineers to build on the upper ledges (like I'm assuming you intended), but it would also make it so that you can lock that area off while defending the courtyard and have people spawn literally facing the stairwell to the upper houses, then give them the choice of exiting the lower area or the upper area to defend the final point. Plus, it would be a good excuse to ditch the hole in the grating that leads down to that area which, I'm sorry, is one of the STUPIDEST things in the world. If you're on BLU and you find yourself messing around back there, whoops, you've fallen into a hell of RED players spawning. If you're RED and you're trying to snipe from there or, heaven forbid, actually walking out of there from the spawn, you slip, fall through, and hurp da durp gotta go back up the stairs again.

    Also, with the final point, I still see more people just coming out of the lower area to fight folks off instead of utilizing the high ground. Maybe you should make that tunnel wider, so that people on the high ground have more room to fight downwards? I dunno, the final cap never sat right with me; it just feels like BLU ramming itself against the RED spawn in a battle of attrition until they get 5 seconds to push the cart, as opposed to there being enough room for RED to set up an actual defense, and room for BLU to mount an attack without being confined to a tiny hallway.

    Most of the map is gold, but it's the last two points that still need some renovation.
     
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  17. Wilson

    aa Wilson Burial by Sleep

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    In Schwa's defence, your stairs problem sounds more like issue with players not knowing the map well yet, rather than issue with spawn. I have seen people use all routes at last when i have played this on full server (too) many times.

    (Also, if this goes official, what is Valve going to call this? Swiftwater_final_final?)
     
  18. Pocket

    aa Pocket func_croc

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    Or just pl_swiftwater? My understanding was that when a map gets stuck with a _final suffix in its official form, it's because the creator already jumped the gun and used the plain form.
     
  19. Citizen Snips

    Citizen Snips L3: Member

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    I suppose it can be attributed to players not knowing the map, but still, not everyone is going to take the time to learn every nook and cranny; hell, I've had to tell my teammates "TAKE THE SHORTCUT YOU IDIOTS" after the first few points are capped.

    And even when knowing that the stairs are there, the lower route just feels like the more natural route, because when you walk out of the spawn, you are looking at the lower opening; the stairwell is off in the corner, and you have to actively go out of your way to climb it.

    That's bad.
     
  20. What Is Schwa

    What Is Schwa L6: Sharp Member

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    I'd appreciate it if you gave this final version a few plays before forming judgement. Your feedback has been most helpful in the past and I responded to most of it. It is frustrating that you formed a judgement before playing it, and even more so that you made a lengthy post complaining about problems that have been largely fixed.

    There are a lot of subtle changes that occur to the map that only happen when stages have been capped. For example, the red spawn-doors lock in obvious sequence. If you would have played the map you would notice that it is now impossible to proceed out the door into the underground area after the next to last CP has been capped by blue. Further, spawn focus has been adjusted to reflect this change. Red spawns with their noses literally on the door they should exit. In playtesting this solved the exact problems you are complaining about. Players now move up the stairs and often take higher ground. It has smoothed out progression between stage 4 and 5 and most players have been incredibly positive about the change.

    It is possible to solve the problems you presented in alternative ways and I believe I did so without removing playable space or limiting player options. Regardless, there will be no more changes made.

    Seriously, give the latest a chance before declaring it a failure. Your post was really discouraging.
     
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    Last edited: Aug 28, 2011