Discussion in 'Map Factory' started by Sgt Frag, Mar 19, 2009.

  1. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Red and Blu have set up shop in the orient and now must spy on each other and gather intel.

    B3 released

    Added animated model doors to main spawns, didn't have time to do all of them.
    Added custom objects (oriental lamp, bridge, supports, spawn doors)
    Changed some texturing and added signs to make path more clear to intel.
    Added a side door to temples, to cave entrance. May add doors to optimize
    and give cover.
    Tried more light bounces to lessen darkness in caves.
    Cleaned up displacements to help player pathing/optimizing.
    Moved Vault door back for room.
    Replaced brush stairs with models and clipped stairs.
    Added sprites.
    Still waiting for compile to finish.
    Fixed menu photos.
    Fixed sombrero tex so spies could cloak. Added pink elephant pinyata to gibs.
    (turn on bday mode before map loads)
    Added indoor sounds to temple/spawns.
    Lowered balcony so it's eaasier to jump.
    Adjusted rain particles.
    Added ctf_gamerules entities so map will eventually stalemate.
    Tied water to cubemaps.
    Shave 10MB off raw file with lightmap scale on brushes that didn't
    gather shadows.
    Probably more...

    >>>REALLY need feedback on the new side door.
    I might add sliding doors to help optimize it, but I think it'll be good for engies to set up in waterfall area quickly. Also help to defend attack back of bases.

    DOH! forgot to change 4 spawn points from blu to red.. Fixed
    forgot a player clip in red giving advantage vantage point. Fixed

    ctf_orient_b1 Now on TF2Maps.net server (when the forum changed I couldn't figure out how to upload here anymore :p lol)

    added second spawn
    touched up lights
    added tunnel under water fall
    got rid of a water fall
    cleaned up displacements
    added ammo health
    deleted all dynamic fps sucking lights
    rain waterfall particles and sound
    proper sprites
    player clip

    still working on skybox, a couple nodraw/skybox errors
    add more sounds
    tweak lighting
    more details


    Went and changed the name. decided it would be best to have a regular linear style instead of circular, more action, whatnot.
    As it's not in the shape of a yin yang anymore I thought Orient might be more fitting.

    Alot of displacement work, rocks, caves, under water.

    by OR!g!NAL (aka Sgt Frag)

    -Edit - 5- 20-09

    updated to a2

    made some pretty substanstial outdoor area size changes, shrunk it down
    and changed the outside paths so players had to be in the open more.

    no build in intel building. Hopefully that will cure the engie turtling ;)
    plenty of spots to build outside.

    fixed all spawn issues

    failed at cubemaps and menu photos, no time.

    got rid of middle path.

    -EDIT- 5-17-09

    added ctf_yin_yang_a1

    blocked in the gameplay area. have alot to do detail wise, but looking for gameplay comments.

    Currently I have the base layout figured out. I'll post shot later but it is basically shaped like it's namesake, the Yin Yang.

    Red and Blu each have a 'territory', one yin, the other yang. Basically each teams ground is a teardrop shape.
    Their base (shown in the pics) is the dot in the teardrop.

    There will be four exits/entrances into the other teams territory. They will be fairly evenly distributed along the middle of the teardrops. The closer the entrance is to the other teams base the harder it will be to gain access to, the entrances furthest from the base will be easier to enter enemy territory through, but once inside you will need to cover more ground in unfriendly territory.

    The bases will be small and fairly open to hopefully stop turtling within the base itself and instead bring the battle into the outside territories.

    Currently the blue base is almost finished, a few details need to be added yet and the inside areas need pinned down.

    There will be 2 spawns, one away from the base a bit and the other possibly in a corner of the base but only exiting to the outside.

    Here are a couple shots of red color tests. I think I am leaning towards the older version.
    recent test
    old test
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2009
  2. Owlruler

    Owlruler L12: Fabulous Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Oh my god, thats amazing!

    I want it!
  3. Vander

    Vander L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Impressive architecture.
  4. Shadow Monkey

    Shadow Monkey Super Monkey

    Positive Ratings:

    Holy shit! This is fuckin' amazing!

    I want it, too!
  5. Zeewier

    Zeewier L9: Fashionable Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Looks a bit like cp_japan, but already a lot better detailed :)
  6. laghlagh

    laghlagh L6: Sharp Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Damn I wish you would apply for mapper at PVKII and make the asia-themed map I was always hoping for.

    It looks excellent and the gameplay sounds cool too.
  7. uma plata

    uma plata L6: Sharp Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Dude, freakin sweet!

    Looks very authentic, but also very TF2

    New official theme go go go!
  8. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

    Positive Ratings:

    I've been trying to be really meticulous about this one. Mitering all the corners and optimizing as much as possible.
    The roofs started a 5 brush curves, now they are 3 brush displacements. Some of the porch/wall trims became objects. I had alot of t-junctions in the func_detail trim on the walls, figured out how to optimize them AND get more detail at the same time (tut to follow) :)

    cp_japan was a bit of an inspiration, always thought it was cool visually. But I googled a ton to try and stay away from cloning it. I guess I'm ending up with a japanese/chinese/american amaglam.

    What is PVKII Notoorjus?
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2009
  9. laghlagh

    laghlagh L6: Sharp Member

    Positive Ratings:
    It's a mod, Pirates, Vikings and Knights.
    I've been playing it a lot lately, and it really has some great maps, but I was always hoping for one with a more asia-themed look. And if you'd be seriously interested, they ARE actually looking for mappers/environmental artists.

    I wouldn't worry about it being too similar to cp_japan, it looks way better already.
  10. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

    Positive Ratings:
    added a few screens, zip file first post.

    blocked out gameplay area. alpha with tex. looking for gameplay feedback.
  11. StoneFrog

    StoneFrog L6: Sharp Member

    Positive Ratings:
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  12. FreeLance_FoX

    FreeLance_FoX L6: Sharp Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Yes yes yes yes yes!!!! I've been waiting for someone to create an Asian theme like this for such a long time! I've always had a special place in my heart for cp_japan, and this just looks absolutely fantastic! Those of you who hang out in the chatrooms have probably heard me crooning over a particular sketch:


    I loved this image as soon as I saw it and envisioned it within the TF2 world immediately. If you do in fact create an interior, I dearly hope it looks like that! :p So far it just looks amazing!

    Best of luck,
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  13. Fireman

    Fireman L4: Comfortable Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Some feedback from earlier today on the Cc server:

    Beam clipping through wall in spawn

    I don't know if these were nodrawed, or there were just no pillars added, but the floating roof was just weird, even for an alpha

    May not be obvious from the pic, but there were some instances of walls clipping through the bottom of doorways

    This room, leading up to the BLU intel, was as dark as anything, my playermodel actually disappeared at one point

    My friend and I locked down the intel room pretty well with a sentry here...

    and here

    Also, if you'd notice he was able to build directly ON TOP of the intel, pretty much screwing over anyone trying to run in and snatch it. A sentry per doorway proved a pretty good strategy, since there was no real way for the other team to effectively attack them without getting torn apart by either one.

    Random bug that may or may not be related to the map, when standing next to my dispenser, myself and other teammates would randomly be launched into the air, and then drop down again, no idea wtf that was.

    Also, as a scout I fell into the water while running away, and couldn't get back out. The sides were too high to be able to just jump out of the pools.

    I'd really advocate sizing down the map, as of right now it just felt way too big, and most of the fighting took place away from the intel, in the map's common areas. Also, the other team was able to get to our spawn pretty easily, making building teleporters impossible.
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  14. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Thanks for the feedback Fireman. Always appreciated.

    All of that stuff is gonna/already has changed. I know there were some rough details, I just wanted to get a quick gameplay round in to determine where the map needs to go before I detail it all, like those beams in spawn, not even sure if that building will be that style later (it actually HAD round beams which I changed to square but forgot a few - the ones you see)

    The play areas outside have shrunk a bit.

    The dark one way rooms have been changed so you don't exit by spawn (until in game with others I really hadn't realized how close that actually was). It was a quick addition at the end but was deffintaly a wrong choice.

    I will add no build zone around intel. In fact I am thinking of making the entire base a nobuild zone. I was hoping to not have turtling engies, but on the first test the intel room was locked down almost immediately, so I guess its gonna have to be forced.
    But there will be alot more places outside for good sentry placements.

    What I really want is for the outside areas to be thought more of as the team bases so people fight outside and try to stop the team from getting into/out of their base.

    Also with shrinking it down and adding more nooks it should now be better for spies.

    The dispenser thing I have no idea, I wish I would've seen it. Never heard of it and don't know why it would happen.

    Oh, and the bridge has been changed. I knew it was a little odd to have no pillars, I just threw it up in a few seconds so it would be closer to the final product so the test.

    I'm also fixing the spawn room issue today.
  15. captainAngry

    captainAngry L7: Fancy Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Played this last night. Posted feedback on my forum.

    It seems like a really nice map but the bases need to be more defined and the outiside area of the map needs to be scaled down.

  16. DaFatCat

    DaFatCat L3: Member

    Positive Ratings:
  17. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

    Positive Ratings:

    I've fixed all the issues that came up in the first alpha for a2 on sat gameday. The list is in my first post.
    As for issues I know of for gameday.

    Spawn doors are are all double. I need to make a trigger open them, right now they are open on touch and it's easy to open one and bump into the other.
    Not exploitable but a little annoying.

    lighting- Some areas are a bit bright + white tex + HDR = burnt retinas. I suggest turning off hdr for it, it'll be a little more freindly in a few areas. I don't even know why I bothered with hdr anyway.

    cubemaps. I failed in the process, it was late, still had to upload and work in the morning. using mat_specular 0 in the console will get rid of all purple except on the water.

    no draw - 'holes', etc... Alot of detailing has been done to base, but not finished and the spawn building detailing will probably change. So there are corners that stick out, etc... that have no draw. Nothing major. Also the roof displacement ridges will have objects to cap the ends, right now they have the same 'hole effect'

    map description/menu photos. It was late, I was killing myself not figuring out why they didn't work. Probably because they had 'ctf' in the name DOH!
    Basically it tells you:
    Go out the front or back of you base to reach enemies intel.
    There are some signs and arrows but it's basically a big circle with a base at each side.
    (2 fort would be a straight line with base at each side).
    There are only 2 paths to take with minor side paths that are for cover so it shouldn't be confusing.

    AND, I forgot to put a resupply cabnet in the spawn building, although the spawn room in the intel buildings do have functional cabinets and they are close by. There are also 8 med health and ammo packs around the perimeter of the map.

    Oh, another weird issue that popped up. probably because I thought the menu photo issue was because of an extra underscore in name yin_yang, I changed the name to yinyang.
    So my custom models all of a sudden showed up as white wireframe, something I've never seen before in game but have heard of once a few days ago.
    So the trims on the patios might look weird, not sure if they'll block bullets or not, but they'd only block some anyway. And it's alpha so...
  18. Termaximus

    Termaximus L5: Dapper Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Got a chance to play today. Fun map overall. The exterior detail on buildings is great, can't wait to see this thing further along.

    Others have said this, but definitely need to use triggers to open doors, rather than touch.

    Nice work so far overall.
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  19. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

    Positive Ratings:
    I appologize to everyone for the failed map upload. Major props to Shmitz for uplaoding and testing at last moment and everyone that stuck around and played both versions.

    Things I got from gameplay that need fixed.

    red supply doesn't work :(
    water a bit tough to get out of still
    doors need trigger set-up
    props wireframe
    info screen not worky
    forgot supply cabs in back spawn buidling
    Issues that were brought up that concern me in a major way.

    * problem 1Right now there are 2 paths. One out of front, one out of back to enemy base.
    The issue was that if someone on the far side of the map had your intel you couldn't stop them.

    This was intentional, but I don't know if it'll work or not.

    I want to have a quicker paced, non-turtle map. The 2 paths seem to help somewhat because you have to fight through fewer people in either direction. The map went several rounds and it didn't seem like either team dominated over the other, and turtling wasn't ever an issue.
    However one play test isn't the best guide as to what'll happen when people learn the map.

    A solution to this that was brought up would be to mirror the map and have both 'waterfalls' lead to each other and only have one major path.

    So my question is
    Should I leave 2 paths as it is, or should I change it to one? Should I change to one and get a gameday on it like that first?

    * problem 2 is nobuild.
    I no built the intel purposely to stop turtling. Obviously during this gametest engies inside the intel room were NOT a problem. And not too many people went engi, maybe because of this? I was hoping engies would be more aggressive outside.
    I did a bit and another player did, but that was all the engi action I noticed.
    In my mind that's not a bad thing, but what others feel is completely different.

    Last test you could build in intel and right away there were 2 sentries in intel and it was locked down. I can change the layout some to help that. But I'm still afraid it would lead to difficulty retrieving intel.

    I think those issues go hand in hand.
    If I make one path and let engies build I have a standard ctf that I'm afraid would be locked down to easily.
    If I leave 2 paths and let engis build I'm afraid of medic teams having a hard time getting there together.
    If I do one path and nobuild engies might be able to locked down the path easy, but ubers might be able to break through just fine.

    Another thing that was brought up was that I should just make a CP map out of it. As is I could probably do a grinder style cap map and put the A and B points at the bottom areas and not have to touch layout much at all. (in theory)

    if I did that it might be cool to have a one path version for ctf. Any other CP style would take too much of a work over I think.
  20. DaFatCat

    DaFatCat L3: Member

    Positive Ratings:
    Great brushwork/texturing!