what is the problem?
Newbie Mapper w/ Questions
- Thread starter mattriddle
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Saying you only play for mario kart isn't wise around here a huge proportion of our mappers hate maps like mario kart (including myself) and will go to extremes to stop them being played because we feel they are damaging the image of the game (which they are)
However, lets not turn on the guy because his tastes are different; after all homosexuals and members of ethnic minorities get equal rights to everyone else, why shouldn't those who don't care about their eyes get equal rights too?
Well, I was joking (mostly) 
Mario Kart has got quite a bad rep on this forum as not only a VERY BAD example of TF2 mapping. But it's also VERY annoying to play (at least IMO and others as well).
Personally I went on a server and lasted about 45 seconds max, don't think I died I just couldn't handle the music/visuals.
Fun Maps in general are generally frowned apon 'round here (not by myself particularily). Then there's Mario Kart.... But hey, it's not a 'rainbow map'
Mario Kart has got quite a bad rep on this forum as not only a VERY BAD example of TF2 mapping. But it's also VERY annoying to play (at least IMO and others as well).
Personally I went on a server and lasted about 45 seconds max, don't think I died I just couldn't handle the music/visuals.
Fun Maps in general are generally frowned apon 'round here (not by myself particularily). Then there's Mario Kart.... But hey, it's not a 'rainbow map'
I can see why hardcore tf2 fans might not like it, but it definitely brings a much more relaxed and fun experience to the game. I like those intense games on 2fort where the teams are fighting for that last point, just as much as the next person, but it's a lot of fun to run around and snipe people and be invisible for minutes, and torch people from across the map, and shoot rockets with your shotgun.
I don't see why both types of gameplay can't occupy their own space and live peacefully with one another.
I love Mario Kart because I used to be a big fan of Unreal Tournament, and Unreal 3 was made way too realistic and didn't have the same fun qualities of mindless killing that it's older versions had. I think it would be great if tf2 could incorporate some of that kind of stuff into it's maps.
It's like the surfing thing. It's a great idea for a fun map. I know people that play the surfing maps just for the surfing part, not even to kill people. When a single game can appeal to multiple groups of wants/people, then it has a much higher chance of growing throughout the years.
We both want to see more players in the game and we both want to see the game grow. We are just approaching the issue from two different angles.
Either way, if you don't want to say anything mean and just want to be quiet, that is fine with me, but you guys have the experience, not me, and any help I can get from you will help tremendously.
I don't see why both types of gameplay can't occupy their own space and live peacefully with one another.
I love Mario Kart because I used to be a big fan of Unreal Tournament, and Unreal 3 was made way too realistic and didn't have the same fun qualities of mindless killing that it's older versions had. I think it would be great if tf2 could incorporate some of that kind of stuff into it's maps.
It's like the surfing thing. It's a great idea for a fun map. I know people that play the surfing maps just for the surfing part, not even to kill people. When a single game can appeal to multiple groups of wants/people, then it has a much higher chance of growing throughout the years.
We both want to see more players in the game and we both want to see the game grow. We are just approaching the issue from two different angles.
Either way, if you don't want to say anything mean and just want to be quiet, that is fine with me, but you guys have the experience, not me, and any help I can get from you will help tremendously.
Snipergen
L13: Stunning Member
- Nov 16, 2007
- 1,051
- 150
I understand your point mattriddle, and I say this honestly, but you will probably don't understand this point of view yet because you maybe are too young(?)
But Mario Kart is just a map that actually destroys everything what TF2 stands for. And that is superb art direction and gameplay.
But Mario Kart is just a map that actually destroys everything what TF2 stands for. And that is superb art direction and gameplay.
Anyone who has listened to the dev commentaries will have a respect for the ten years Valve spent piecing the game together. The first time I went through them, I was amazed at all the thought and planning the designers went through. Then on this forum I was introduced to the multiple slideshow presentations Valve made to showcase their design for the game, further supplementing my respect for them.
They released the SDK, and people abuse it with Mario kart, orange maps, and other gimmicks that have no intelligent thought put into them.
They released the SDK, and people abuse it with Mario kart, orange maps, and other gimmicks that have no intelligent thought put into them.
Define intelligent thought. Just because a map doesn't have a design like one of valve's maps doesn't mean it has no intelligent thought. It might not have the same mindset as valve's maps, but it's directed towards a different kind of gameplay.
You want strategy in maps. A plan, to do this and this, and then you have to do this with this character to get over here, but this character is not as good at this point, and this character is better. You aren't going to find that kind of logic in surf/mario_kart. Does it make them bad? I don't think so. Maybe you do. Maybe we should agree to disagree.
I can understand how you could feel that surf/mario_kart maps take the game away from what it was originally designed around, strategic classes and maps, but I think it's awesome that the game is so open that people can design maps like surf/mario_kart that bring a new feeling and mood to the game. Players get bored of games that can't bring something new every now and then, and games die when players get bored of it. Look at Unreal Tournament. The basic game is alright. But throw in all the mods and mutators, and you have hours and hours of fun you can have trying out all the different stuff. The ability to generate new experiences in the game gives the game many more years of life.
That is why I feel people should accept surf/mario_kart maps as a necessary evil. You might not like them, but the game would be at a loss without them. How much of a loss is negotiable. But take it from me, a casual player, once I get bored with something, I rarely come back to it. I got bored with tf2 around the time of the first achievements coming out. A handful of maps that are just played over and over again. Certain classes being way overpowered (imho), and I wasn't going to wait around for things to change. I found surf maps, which lead me to Mario_Kart maps. I didn't have to worry about overpowered classes because everyone was overpowered (shotguns one-hit-killed, spy could cloak for a minute or two, medic could overheal someone and make them almost unkillable. None of that stuff mattered, because I was having fun again. Now look at me, I want to make a map, and give back to the game. And none of that would had been possible if I hadn't had found the surf/mario_kart maps.
It's a necessary evil, deal with it.
edit: No...better, go play them, and have fun.
You want strategy in maps. A plan, to do this and this, and then you have to do this with this character to get over here, but this character is not as good at this point, and this character is better. You aren't going to find that kind of logic in surf/mario_kart. Does it make them bad? I don't think so. Maybe you do. Maybe we should agree to disagree.
I can understand how you could feel that surf/mario_kart maps take the game away from what it was originally designed around, strategic classes and maps, but I think it's awesome that the game is so open that people can design maps like surf/mario_kart that bring a new feeling and mood to the game. Players get bored of games that can't bring something new every now and then, and games die when players get bored of it. Look at Unreal Tournament. The basic game is alright. But throw in all the mods and mutators, and you have hours and hours of fun you can have trying out all the different stuff. The ability to generate new experiences in the game gives the game many more years of life.
That is why I feel people should accept surf/mario_kart maps as a necessary evil. You might not like them, but the game would be at a loss without them. How much of a loss is negotiable. But take it from me, a casual player, once I get bored with something, I rarely come back to it. I got bored with tf2 around the time of the first achievements coming out. A handful of maps that are just played over and over again. Certain classes being way overpowered (imho), and I wasn't going to wait around for things to change. I found surf maps, which lead me to Mario_Kart maps. I didn't have to worry about overpowered classes because everyone was overpowered (shotguns one-hit-killed, spy could cloak for a minute or two, medic could overheal someone and make them almost unkillable. None of that stuff mattered, because I was having fun again. Now look at me, I want to make a map, and give back to the game. And none of that would had been possible if I hadn't had found the surf/mario_kart maps.
It's a necessary evil, deal with it.
edit: No...better, go play them, and have fun.
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