I think you mean "Brllnt!"
Void: Thanks! I might take you up on that offer for some company sign overlays, or similar
Edit:
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- Thread starter Ravidge
- Start date
I think you mean "Brllnt!"
Void: Thanks! I might take you up on that offer for some company sign overlays, or similar
Edit:
I've been thinking of moving the spawns closer to the middle by some 512 or so units.
But it might make it even harder to grab the briefcase.
So I'm asking for some help, what makes it so hard to take and escape with the intel? and what can I do to make it easier?
Considering I have this funky touch-return in place it's always going to be a bit tricky. But I think it really works in pug settings so I'm holding on to it for now. But any suggestions on the subject is welcome!
But it might make it even harder to grab the briefcase.
So I'm asking for some help, what makes it so hard to take and escape with the intel? and what can I do to make it easier?
Considering I have this funky touch-return in place it's always going to be a bit tricky. But I think it really works in pug settings so I'm holding on to it for now. But any suggestions on the subject is welcome!
These here are old (few days) pictures, that I've already shown in the chatroom. But I might aswell put them up here.
I'm getting close to mirroring it over to the red side soon. I''ll probably just do a retexture for that since IT IS STILL ALPHA! (could have fooled me).
I'm getting close to mirroring it over to the red side soon. I''ll probably just do a retexture for that since IT IS STILL ALPHA! (could have fooled me).
- Sep 12, 2008
- 1,272
- 1,142
I like what i'm seeing! :O
Alpha 3!
I'm really starting to like how it looks now, far from done though.
Please play it and share your thoughts! I might even accept detail complaints/suggestions since I'm actually working on that quite a bit.
There has been a lot of changes to the map, but if you played a2 you will not find any radical changes, I just went back and re-did some parts. New health has been added.
Some sniperlines still exist in the middle, I don't think they are particulary powerful though so I left them in...
Have fun, chilling new pictures in the OP
I'm really starting to like how it looks now, far from done though.
Please play it and share your thoughts! I might even accept detail complaints/suggestions since I'm actually working on that quite a bit.
There has been a lot of changes to the map, but if you played a2 you will not find any radical changes, I just went back and re-did some parts. New health has been added.
Some sniperlines still exist in the middle, I don't think they are particulary powerful though so I left them in...
Have fun, chilling new pictures in the OP
Randdalf
aa
- Feb 14, 2008
- 1,051
- 932
Shall take a look round now, I'm a bit bored.
EDIT: Some very minor things
Smooth it out a bit there
Every one of these props has non-solid "mini-pipes", some rudimentary clipping around them would be good
If you move these 2 pieces of cover togther it makes a larger gap for dropping down to the middle, and simplifies routes (albeit in a minor way)
Clip these corners
An engineer can build on the high part using this route
And a sentry up here could prove problematic, I don't know what your thoughts are on this, but I reckon you should nobuild it. (That said, I can't remember if this was possible in previous versions either).
It's not entirely obvious that you can get up there in the first place, it's the kind of place you'd expect not to be able to go. An "up" arrow overlay there could solve this.
EDIT: Some very minor things
Smooth it out a bit there
Every one of these props has non-solid "mini-pipes", some rudimentary clipping around them would be good
If you move these 2 pieces of cover togther it makes a larger gap for dropping down to the middle, and simplifies routes (albeit in a minor way)
Clip these corners
An engineer can build on the high part using this route
And a sentry up here could prove problematic, I don't know what your thoughts are on this, but I reckon you should nobuild it. (That said, I can't remember if this was possible in previous versions either).
It's not entirely obvious that you can get up there in the first place, it's the kind of place you'd expect not to be able to go. An "up" arrow overlay there could solve this.
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tovilovan
L6: Sharp Member
- Jul 23, 2008
- 391
- 104
Woah. After a ten minute runthrough of a3 I'm quite astonished: what a map! It's really hard to find anything negative: fps is stable around 140, similar to badlands, visuals are excellent for an alpha. You've captured the industrial yet snowy theme great, although it might feel a bit grey at times, especially at mid which I feel should be one of the more interesting places visually rather than a shadowy backyard. That's the only complaint aestethically.
Gameplaywise, I can't see how this map wouldn't work in a 6v6. The only problem might be that comp players don't like getting used to a different gamemode and avoid the map. There are loads of sideroutes, defenders will have to divide their forces to cover all exits and keep watching their backs all the time. I love the tradeoff that defenders will have to make: stay back and be far from the intel, or stay on top of the intel, vulnerable fromn attacks from behind and above. An aggressive team will be rewarded, which is really great. A single sentry won't be able to lock down the entire place which is great (nothing more boring than 30 minutes of hitting a sentry wth the wrench on turbine).
One problem that turbine has is capping cycles: one team holding the intel room getting multiple caps in a row. With this gamemode I can't see this happening. The only thing that might happen is one team staying back with their intel on the back. There are some places, especially the one behind the intel building, that are maybe a bit easily defended if this would happen, which is a problem.
The accessible roof between intel and the yard area should be more apparent that it's reachable. Right now I didn't even try getting there, I only saw it in Randdalffs last post. Putting some props or maybe a kit there would make it look more interesting.
These are the things I can think of right now. Might return for more once I've played it with other people.
Gameplaywise, I can't see how this map wouldn't work in a 6v6. The only problem might be that comp players don't like getting used to a different gamemode and avoid the map. There are loads of sideroutes, defenders will have to divide their forces to cover all exits and keep watching their backs all the time. I love the tradeoff that defenders will have to make: stay back and be far from the intel, or stay on top of the intel, vulnerable fromn attacks from behind and above. An aggressive team will be rewarded, which is really great. A single sentry won't be able to lock down the entire place which is great (nothing more boring than 30 minutes of hitting a sentry wth the wrench on turbine).
One problem that turbine has is capping cycles: one team holding the intel room getting multiple caps in a row. With this gamemode I can't see this happening. The only thing that might happen is one team staying back with their intel on the back. There are some places, especially the one behind the intel building, that are maybe a bit easily defended if this would happen, which is a problem.
The accessible roof between intel and the yard area should be more apparent that it's reachable. Right now I didn't even try getting there, I only saw it in Randdalffs last post. Putting some props or maybe a kit there would make it look more interesting.
These are the things I can think of right now. Might return for more once I've played it with other people.
Randdalf: Thanks! Much appricited.
Tovilovan: Your post makes me very happy
And I think all your concerns are valid and something I've been thinking myself! The middle is bland, I don't have any real plan for it just yet but I'm sure something will come to me sooner or later.
I probably won't put a health pickup on the roof, There's already 2 small ones below, and I think the high ground it provides in a fair battle between ground vs roof. Though I can't say I have any ideas for making it more obvious it's a playable area... sometimes it's just a matter of trial and error, sooner or later everyone will figure it out. But if there are suggestions on that I will gladly consider them!!
Tovilovan: Your post makes me very happy
And I think all your concerns are valid and something I've been thinking myself! The middle is bland, I don't have any real plan for it just yet but I'm sure something will come to me sooner or later.
I probably won't put a health pickup on the roof, There's already 2 small ones below, and I think the high ground it provides in a fair battle between ground vs roof. Though I can't say I have any ideas for making it more obvious it's a playable area... sometimes it's just a matter of trial and error, sooner or later everyone will figure it out. But if there are suggestions on that I will gladly consider them!!
tovilovan
L6: Sharp Member
- Jul 23, 2008
- 391
- 104
The healthkits was just an example, something that will immediately tell players the area is a part of the map. I'd recommend looking at valve maps: you can almost always tell at first sight if an area is impossible to reach. I'm pretty sure a few crates would do well, just to make the roof feel like the yard area you just left. Signs also never exist in places where players can't go, just a sign pointing towards the intel might work. It really isn't a great issue, but I can see quite some players saying "woah, where did he come from?" the first few times before they figure out the roof is a play area.
- Feb 26, 2008
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It looks awesome but the base snow really looks terrible compared to your work, it tiles too quickly and the normal map looks odd... use a diff one?
Good suggestion, it has been bugging me a bit but not enough to make me change it. I'll put it up on my to-do-list
Looks really good just wondering that rock texture is that swamp one?
Nope, it's the rock from cp_yukon, filter for winter/ and you should easily find it!
Acegikmo
aa
- Jan 31, 2008
- 555
- 1,482
Great map! I'm really liking the layout and the overall environment. You've managed to make the area look believable, which is something I always forget when I make my maps!
The gamemode works fine, but it doesn't seem to be very different from normal ctf, since the touch return is making it very easy for the other team to counter the effort you put into progressing the flag away from the enemy. I recommend removing touch return, or at the very least try it out and see how it plays!
Overall, this map has got great potential. I think this is my favourite map among the contest entries!
The gamemode works fine, but it doesn't seem to be very different from normal ctf, since the touch return is making it very easy for the other team to counter the effort you put into progressing the flag away from the enemy. I recommend removing touch return, or at the very least try it out and see how it plays!
Overall, this map has got great potential. I think this is my favourite map among the contest entries!
Glad you enjoyed it! Yeah I think my layout might actually be designed with more of a standard ctf-ruleset than I intended. But I like my layout and I think it flows pretty well. So I'm gonna have to look for other elements to switch around.
There is a clear issue with how the current touch-return plays out in a match so I'm going to try out some variants with and without the touch-return feature. And see how that would affect the gameplay.
a4 released. It's a small update.
I removed the touch-return feature and lowered the returntimer to 30 seconds. The capturezones are still attached to the intels!
Small improvements to clipping and health pickups.
This is the first test without touch-return, which favours the scout class a bit too much, both as a offensive and defensive force, other classes have a very hard time to keep up.
I'm really looking forward to try this!
I removed the touch-return feature and lowered the returntimer to 30 seconds. The capturezones are still attached to the intels!
Small improvements to clipping and health pickups.
This is the first test without touch-return, which favours the scout class a bit too much, both as a offensive and defensive force, other classes have a very hard time to keep up.
I'm really looking forward to try this!
Heh, I still believe it can work, but my layout just isn't the one to prove it. I've played a3 a bit and it's the same story every time. I have to be open-minded and change if there is a problem
This is the first and easiest change to make, so obviously it's first in line. Let's hope it works!
- Jan 18, 2009
- 844
- 479
I played it at the impromptu test on the EU server 30 minutes ago or so and the map looks and plays quite nice.
The capture-system will be in my opinion be confusing for pub/comp though. You have a sign with the 'rules' on it, but for some reason I also didn't bother to read it and just walked past it. And if I already do that, pub/comp players will probably do it as well.
So it happened that both teams capped the flag and were waiting at their own bases with the flag, trying to cap, which didn't work. That did result in that the teams didn't really attack the other team anymore, but defended their own flag carrier, or that the carrier was just hiding next to a sentry.
I think a lot of pub players will do this as well. :/
Another thing is that the map is rather big and open. It wasn't a big problem when we were playing 8v8 - 10v10, but when you will play this with 6v6 teams, scouts will dominate the map. In 6v6, there are too less players in both teams to be able to defend your map. There are many routes leading to the intel and many escaping routes around the map to give scouts an easy time capping the intelligence.
Soldiers and snipers were also pretty good on this map, the Soldier because of good rocketjump areas, and the Sniper because some good sightlines (Or was that awesome sniper just you? ).
If I come up with some other points I'll post them but for now these are the only bad things I noticed. I already liked the visuals a lot, and keep going.
The capture-system will be in my opinion be confusing for pub/comp though. You have a sign with the 'rules' on it, but for some reason I also didn't bother to read it and just walked past it.
And if I already do that, pub/comp players will probably do it as well.So it happened that both teams capped the flag and were waiting at their own bases with the flag, trying to cap, which didn't work. That did result in that the teams didn't really attack the other team anymore, but defended their own flag carrier, or that the carrier was just hiding next to a sentry.
I think a lot of pub players will do this as well. :/
Another thing is that the map is rather big and open. It wasn't a big problem when we were playing 8v8 - 10v10, but when you will play this with 6v6 teams, scouts will dominate the map. In 6v6, there are too less players in both teams to be able to defend your map. There are many routes leading to the intel and many escaping routes around the map to give scouts an easy time capping the intelligence.
Soldiers and snipers were also pretty good on this map, the Soldier because of good rocketjump areas, and the Sniper because some good sightlines (Or was that awesome sniper just you?
).If I come up with some other points I'll post them but for now these are the only bad things I noticed. I already liked the visuals a lot, and keep going.
I played it at the impromptu test on the EU server 30 minutes ago or so and the map looks and plays quite nice.
The capture-system will be in my opinion be confusing for pub/comp though. You have a sign with the 'rules' on it, but for some reason I also didn't bother to read it and just walked past it.
So it happened that both teams capped the flag and were waiting at their own bases with the flag, trying to cap, which didn't work. That did result in that the teams didn't really attack the other team anymore, but defended their own flag carrier, or that the carrier was just hiding next to a sentry.
I think a lot of pub players will do this as well. :/
Another thing is that the map is rather big and open. It wasn't a big problem when we were playing 8v8 - 10v10, but when you will play this with 6v6 teams, scouts will dominate the map. In 6v6, there are too less players in both teams to be able to defend your map. There are many routes leading to the intel and many escaping routes around the map to give scouts an easy time capping the intelligence.
Soldiers and snipers were also pretty good on this map, the Soldier because of good rocketjump areas, and the Sniper because some good sightlines (Or was that awesome sniper just you?
If I come up with some other points I'll post them but for now these are the only bad things I noticed. I already liked the visuals a lot, and keep going.
Thanks for taking time to both play and reply!
First I will say that the score system is not complicated. I do think the sign is a bad way to go about explaining it. I will try something else.
But compared to other ctf game modes (like invade or a/d ctf), fusion is atm very similar to a normal ctf map.
I don't think it will be the same story in 6v6. These players tend to have a lot more teamwork, and getting just 6 people to realize that the thing they are defending is also what they are attacking, and that it can move around. To their will (unlike ctf_system
)! I'm sure that if a team is eager to score. moving around as a team is a much better strategy than camping and sending small attacks at each other for 10 minutes.I don't think the map is too big in a 6v6. I know it's a terrible argument, but I think the scale "feels right"... Scouts will be a important class in any ctf map. But you see, with my current game mode, defending the base is really not that important compared to defending a flag (which may or may not be yours, or even in your base)
And I'm pretty sure I was the only sniper on my team in that game, so... thanks I guess
----
First up in my line of changes:
Nobuild these crates, I think that should stop engies from getting up there too easily. The sentry was a lot more powerful that I anticipated.