Assembly

[MangyCarface]

Looks extraordinarily confined. Stop thinking in terms of bases and instead in terms of spaces: http://www.nodraw.net/2010/01/architecture-and-emergence/

 

[The Political Gamer]

A55555555555555555555555555

 

[Snacks]

Blue doesn't have a func_respawnroom in the new spawn area.

 

[absurdistof]

You tested it already?

 

[The Political Gamer]

Blue doesn't have a func_respawnroom in the new spawn area.

It does its just set to RED. >.> Most people will changes classes in the outer spawn parts and they are set to BLU. So I will fix it in a6.

 

[Hellfire]

well ive dled and made a small run
first of all, new base basement looks better, so does new basement under mid.

Second, i faced small..hm..not issue but..hm, just wierd thing. if you are at the intel,to get to the upper level of your own base, you need to run to the middle of the map, and get to the ground-level there, then go back to your base. And thats the only actual way. Maybe its supposed to be like that, Im just not sure. In general, this prevent engineers from building SGs at the intel, as there is no metal and they cant get to ressuply

third, thats what ive found
one, two, three. Not that big deal, but somthing to keep in mind.

anyway im waiting for playtest

EDIT: and yes,there are errors in the console,like four same things:

func_respawnroomvisualizer(func_respawnroomvisualizer) was unable to find func_respawnroomvisualizer named 'color_global'

 

[Jindo]

I've just been looking through some maps before I test them, something about your map - which could be a major set-back - is its similarity to ctf_well. I can't give too much feedback regarding other aspects at this time but from a competitive player's point of view, I'd probably question playing this map when ctf_well exists.

It's just a thought of course, and the map is only in alpha, I'll let you know when we've tested it!

 

[The Political Gamer]

A6 is up with a few bug fixes

 

[The Political Gamer]

Testing bump. :V

 

[Hellfire]

well..fix nobuild, fis that upper spawn exit respawn area..hm..

 

[Jindo]

Members of killingJoke have just tested this today, you can view the comments here, though the page is WIP and (so far from what I've seen) only seems to be properly viewable on FF (for now).

Some summaries/quotes from players after the game:

Ctf_assembly looked a lot ctf_well, but it just was too big. Having so many areas/rooms to go. Removing lower floor would be great but then again it would be a bit too much ctf_well. For now it would work easily as a pub map, but for compititive it needs to fix(mainly making it smaller and adding something which makes it different than ctf_well).

ctf_assembly_a5

• map is really big, it would do good as a public map, but its too big (imo) for competative play at least ctf play, map would be better suited for a cp playstyle.
• control room is good, but could use some strairs to make it easiere for defending party
• map feels too familiar, a little bit more originality would be good, feels like a map that has copied elements from all other maps
• good placing of doors, stairs and hp/ammo packs

I agree with luxa, uh, yeh, that is all ;p

assembly would be a good pub map with more players (bcuz of the multiple routes and the space)

• Waaaay to big, it would do better as a 16v16 map then as a 6v6
• The middle part favors sollys and demos heavyly, why lower the trains if a nonfan scout still can't get up pn them??
• Add stairs so that some1 defing the intel can get back up (takes as long as on 2fort if you fall down, unless you are a solly/demo)
• The middle is just a worse version of ctf_well
• Cool comandcenter where the intal was

---

The main things that were said were that the map was too similar to ctf_well, and that it was too big and had too many alternative routes/flanks. I'm not entirely sure what to suggest as making the map smaller would involve quite a bit of change overall.

I'll have an STV Demo up as soon as possible, you can choose to listen to/ignore whichever comments you like, I look forward to seeing the next version either way.

Good work on the map so far.

EDIT: I don't know how this has happened but the demo didn't record for your map... I'm terribly sorry about this, I'll make sure that this doesn't happen again.

 

[The Political Gamer]

Don't really know what to do about the size without redoing the hole map. Anyone got any suggestions about size reduction?

 

[The Political Gamer]

A7 is up and I think I may have fixed the sentry problem without using nobuild. Also I am considering making a comp version with the lower part removed.

 

[absurdistof]

To cut out the size you could hack a lot out of the middle trains and the middle building, possibly redisign that part as it's most remeniscent to me of Well. The whole lower part of the middle I think the map could do well without, it just adds more places to look for the intel carrier and to cover.

Generally, I think if you simplify mid (get it to one level, or establish a strong use for the second) and shrink it down so that its not as wide the map could be a lot 'smaller,' more compact, and faster

 

[The Political Gamer]

After talking with Jindo I will be making some big changes with A8. Oh and absurdistof will take a look at that.

The Political Gamer: Jindo would removing the hole basecment fix the size problems?
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: i know someone said that it would pretty much be identical to ctf_well if that part was removed
The Political Gamer: so the upper mid
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: perhaps there's a better way you could have the basement? rather than 2 staircases on either side of the centre track, perhaps have doors from the basement leading to those lower levels outside the bases?
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: (i'd probably need to draw it up for that to make sense)
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: i'll try tomorrow when i have time and am able to take screenshots etc
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: http://forums.tf2maps.net/geek/gars/images/3/8/7/6/hl2_2010-01-16_18-24-43-03.jpg where the bridge is, down there you have some doors, you could probably have a large door in the centre (directly below the bridge) which goes straight to the basement?
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: that would probably solve part of the "too many flanks" issue
The Political Gamer: so just a strait shot?
The Political Gamer: and that "should"
The Political Gamer: fix the size problems?
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: it would solve it to some extent yes
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: as well as removing some flanks
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: (a lot of people used the staircases to avoid the enemy when they had the intel)
The Political Gamer: in the basement?
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: yep, they'd sort of wind around the staircases leading in to the basement
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: running down and up them (as scouts), made it annoying to get them D:
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: but with doorways instead of the those staircases, you now have 1 way to get in and out of the basement (similar to 2fort) plus that's less flanks which should be better for the 6v6 audience
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: i'll draw up some diagrams/plots and stuff tomorrow, it really sucks that the demo didn't record because you probably would have seen a lot of what im talking about from that
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: what basically happened with us was that the entire 12 players were almost spread out across the entire map ;P
The Political Gamer: I will put this and tomarrows feedback in A8
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: occasionally encountered the person with the intel, but not enough
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: alrighty
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: i'll also speak with some of the people who tested the map, they'll have better ideas than me
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: (although they might be quite big changes, the other testers are way pickier than me with competitive maps D
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: i'll also upload the latest version of your map tomorrow and get people to explore it, they'll probably be able to come up with more up to date changes based on that then
The Political Gamer: oh and how were the senties?
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: we didn't have any problems with sentries
The Political Gamer: good
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: partly because there was only two engineers through out the entire game, and whenever we found one they were JUST building it (we took it down before it went up)
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: sentries are always a problem in new maps, they're actually easy to get rid of it's because people aren't used to the map layout that they don't really know how to approach it
-kJ- Axeassin Jindo: but then as people play the map more they find more ways to get rid of the sentry

 

[Snacks]

You can get behind the train cars on blue side but not red side.

 

[The Political Gamer]

Snacks your picture is busted. :S

EDIT: Its working now.

 

[Jindo]

Snacks' picture is referring to the Blue trains on BLU's side of the map (you can walk between them.)

---

I've downloaded A7 and taken some screenshots, I can't garauntee that these suggestions will help at all, right now they're just ideas (but I think they could help), I've also asked playtesters from yesterday to come up with a few suggestions since they'll probably know better than me.

Anyway, here are my ideas:

First Idea: I don't think that you should remove the basement so much, but alter the entrances and exits to it. This proposal basically removes the staircases and allows players to get in and out of the basement through a new door placed between the two side doors, reducing the entrances to the basement from 4 to 3. (per side)

Second Idea: This is more of an alternative to the first idea: rather than removing the stairs, remove these side doors (personally I found the stairs awkward to use so I'd probably do away with them instead.)

Third Idea: Not so much an idea, but you have about 6 ways to get to the intel, which is near impossible to defend. 2Fort has 2 ways to the intel, Turbine has 3, and Doublecross I think has 2/3 as well, you want to keep it to something like that to make it easier to defend and to avoid overwhelming players with options.

I may come up with other/better suggestions, or (most likely) see what yesterday's testers have to say. Overall it seems that it's not so much the size of the map that's the problem but the layout: having all these different paths meant that half of the time players in yesterday's test were exploring rather than fighting each other.

Hope this helps.

 

[The Political Gamer]

I thank you greatly for the feedback.

What about moving the stairs here:

 

[The Political Gamer]

So far I have reduced the number of ways to get to the intel from 6 to 4 by removing the 2 side entrances. Also the basement under RED and BLU now has only one entrance/exit and 2 paths to the intel from it. Also I have moved the stairs to the place shown by in the picture above.