Volt

[A Boojum Snark]

<identical copypasta for two maps/generalized rant about what koth shouldn't have>

There is no line of conflict. In most maps (including Viaduct), there is a line on the map (which moves with the flow of the game) where you can think "I'm on my side of the line, the enemy will probably attack from in front of me".

Here, there is no such line. It's just chaos everywhere, you are equally as likely to be attacked from every direction because it doesn't take a significantly longer or more difficult path to get behind the enemy.

It's far too easy/too many routes to get around to all sides of the battle. It's more of a web-like arena layout than a linear-with-connections layout that most maps have.

The result of this is a lot more unexpected deaths and a frenzied random battle without much sense of team combat. It also serves to exacerbate the already low usefulness of engineers in koth. As difficult as it is to find somewhere to put a sentry in a koth map due to the lack of any real defense line, it becomes much worse when your sentry can and will be attacked from any direction.

 

[drp]

<identical copypasta for two maps/generalized rant about what koth shouldn't have>

There is no line of conflict. In most maps (including Viaduct), there is a line on the map (which moves with the flow of the game) where you can think "I'm on my side of the line, the enemy will probably attack from in front of me".

Here, there is no such line. It's just chaos everywhere, you are equally as likely to be attacked from every direction because it doesn't take a significantly longer or more difficult path to get behind the enemy.

It's far too easy/too many routes to get around to all sides of the battle. It's more of a web-like arena layout than a linear-with-connections layout that most maps have.

The result of this is a lot more unexpected deaths and a frenzied random battle without much sense of team combat. It also serves to exacerbate the already low usefulness of engineers in koth. As difficult as it is to find somewhere to put a sentry in a koth map due to the lack of any real defense line, it becomes much worse when your sentry can and will be attacked from any direction.

thanks for the feedback, but i do have to counter with a few points.
koth_nucleus is FAR from what you suggest, and i personally think it plays well.

engineers usually play a small role in koth /arena due to the small layouts. most koth maps that I have seen play well are ones that keep side routes to a minimum and fighting is usually just in the mid/point area.

volt is pretty linear with only 1 side route to the cap area and NO routes lead past the point in to the opposing team except the main mid route.

while i was in spectator i did notice teams were staging up in the upper area side route and pushing as a team with a medic + heavy and more. This i noticed was pretty common throughout the rounds.

I would have to disagree that the the combat is 'too' chaotic, but I do agree that there is room for improvement for engineers.

 

[Sgt.Sausage]

Gameday: Played very nicely and was alot of fun.
All the layout changes seem to be for the better from the last version.

I think the size is perfect the only complaint is the right elevated spawn room. No big deal though.

 

[Caliostro]

Played it yesterday, and really can't come up with any complaints... Which is rare... Plays quite well with all classes having their place. Disagree with Booj, Engies also have their place.

The issue is most engineers play "turtle style"... Try to set up a dispenser, level 3 sentry, teleport, and sit around it. You really can't in KOTH... You have to be a more dynamic, better, class of engineer. Lay the sentry down as a "second pair of guns" and get moving. Remember sentries are disposable, and "rebuildable". And from my experience a good engineer can play it's role here. Seen the middle point held up from an entire team by a single, well placed, level 1 sentry and an engie.

Send forth a beta, or at least start detailing, IMO.

 

[drp]

updated to b1. started detailing the mid and some of the more fight intense areas.

 

[Cerulean]

I didn't notice this was the alpha I played a while back until I looked at the layout.

Soldier seemed a little OP from the top. As for engies... I'm with ABS on that, but I also agree with Caliostro:

...it becomes much worse when your sentry can and will be attacked from any direction

You have to be a more dynamic, better, class of engineer. Lay the sentry down as a "second pair of guns" and get moving.

They definitely need a safe place for a teleporter, only really able to be taken out by an uber.

I'd suggest moving the health/ammo from under the stairs to between the turbines (more obvious, risky out in the open). And, maybe add a little nook to the side path:

 

[lana]

The windows around the point are a little helter-skelter. Make them either low enough to provide waist up cover, or make them tall enough to protect your head.

 

[The Political Gamer]

Ramirez finish this map!

 

[MrAlBobo]

Ramirez finish this map!

lolz...i like how dig up old maps to prod the mappers back to work...
on that note... http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=3891
hint hint

also...the first post still lists the version number as a4 not b1

 

[The Political Gamer]

lolz...i like how dig up old maps to prod the mappers back to work...
on that note... http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=3891
hint hint

Yeah getting constantly kicked from the chat room is not fun. :V