KotH Shrinkray! A8

[TwinMill]

Shrinkray! - Simple king-of-the-hill centered around a giant shrink ray.

"Sir! We have successfully built a working shrinkray! Problem is, it's HUGE."
"Damn. I don't suppose you eggheads know how to shrink a shrink ray?"

Welcome to koth_shrinkray!
Well the alpha anyway. A simple king of the hill centered around a giant shrinkray, as if the tagline wasn't descriptive enough. Fits 24 players, nice and cozy, and before you ask yes the shrinkray will minify whatever unfortunate soul happens to be under it when the round ends.
This is my first map, so please forgive me if things are done a little... amateurishly. I'm still learning the ropes.

https://imgur.com/a/6xrBF Here's an album in case the images break for some reason.
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This is my first actual map. everything else I've made before this wasn't worth the garbage it was made out to be, and was kinda me testing out hammer in general. This is my attempt at an idea I've had for a long time; a facility all built around operating this one machine, a giant shrink ray, something that is so outlandish it feels like it shouldn't exist and constantly looks like its about to fall apart. Cutting edge technology doesn't always start off slick and smooth.
I had a few other iterations that I tested with some friends just to get a feel for what layouts work best, and while this is technically not alpha one, it's the first version I felt alright with releasing without the embarrassingly long sight-lines and camp spots other layout iterations had before it.
So here we are the official release of the Koth_shrinkray project. I encourage people to test it out for themselves, and if you do please be so kind to send me the demo. The only people that have played this map are... casual... players, so I haven't exactly seen it being put to the experienced player test yet. I'll probably have it hosted by TF2Maps anyway, but I can use all the feedback I can get.
It's so hard to come by these days.

 

[MegapiemanPHD]

Feedback time


no info_observer points for spectator cams


weird shadows. The origin of the prop on the left may be in an odd place. Use a info_light to change it's lighting origin


These concrete pipes are not only ugly but really annoying to try and walk around or over


weird reflections on the solar panels


the barb wire texture can be seen through both sides of a brush. You only have to put it on one side with every other side being nodraw, otherwise it'll double up and look off


Overall the map is small. The basic KOTH Viaduct formula is Spawn room, Courtyard, Building, Courtyard, Building, Courtyard, point. This map has Spawn Room, building, courtyard, point. Because of this there isn't a lot of space to move around in for faster classes like Scout and not many decisions for players to make on their way to the point. You don't have to follow the Viaduct formula though so it really depends on how the map plays in testing.


These computer props in an outdoor area look weird. The whole map overall feels like it's supposed to be indoors from it's architecture but instead it has a sky


The slope of these windows lets me slowly slide up them by walking into them. Clip them flat


This building seems kinda pointless since it doesn't really lead anywhere nor offer much to a team and the only way to access it is from the spawn areas


lips like this need ramp clips for smooth transitioning between lower and upper levels. Right now it's hit or miss as to which part of the displacement is high enough to let me walk onto the higher brush


Messed up no_entry texture here. I've seen this happen on with a few maps and don't really know how to fix it :/


Getting shrunk at the end of the match is a neat idea but seems somewhat superficial. With the shrinkray being such a main landmark for the map, it feels like it would be used more often like the UFO's on Probed's KOTH point. Then again, that would be gimmicky and possibly not want you want to do with the map. Still a neat idea though.

That's all I got for now. Get the map in a imp when you can for some more feedback and indepth testing.

 

[TwinMill]

Thanks @MegapiemanPHD! Really appreciate the input!
A lot of the cosmetic stuff comes later. All I'm focused on right now is how it plays. If it works and it's fun then I'll go to aesthetics.
The map being small has been a concern of mine. I've played it with a 24 player server a couple of times, and have yet to have a complaint about it. It will probably take a LOT more testing. It's better than the previous iterations, at least.
Thanks so much for the feedback!

 

[phi]

Next version, please do not forget to include a version number such as _a2 after the koth_shrinkray, so that it will properly update here and on the servers when uploaded.

 

[TwinMill]

"Any update on the shrink ray?"
"Yes, sir! We put the health and ammo kits on a slightly raised platform!"
"At last, actual progress."

Koth_shrinkray is going to be the death of your dear old friend TwinMill, who only just realized his brushwork is hot garbage. Here's an update, and a major one at that:

> Adopted "a4" version string
> Lowered overall height of center slope
> Removed computers from platform near point, replaced with bridges
> Added small health kits under bridges
> Increased distance between spawn building and testing area
> Modified catwalks to match
> Added buildings on either side, complete with new flank routes
> Did indeed put center health and ammo on a raised platform
> Removed annoying as all hell pipes
> Improved clipping
> Added info_observer_point spots
> Removed right-side pipe covers
> Removed concrete blocks
> Added small ammo packs near point
> Improved sightlines
> Added dump trucks on both sides
> Updated barbed wire textures
> Widened right flank
> Modified spawn times
> Improved optimization
> Replaced batteries in smoke detectors

Okay so some explanations on the changes:
One of the biggest problems that seemed to arise was whoever caps the point first had it forever, and that just plain sucks. Most people mentioned pushing up that hill to the point was a nightmare, so I lowered the height. Since the only ways on the point were from either side, it was pretty easy for the opposing team to shut down people trying to get on it. I added some bridges to the point so maybe it wouldn't be so difficult. Another change was increasing the distance between the spawn building and the testing area, which is where the medium health kit is. It got pretty claustrophobic and choke-y there, especially with pyros, so I made it be a bit more open. Everything else is just kinda experimentation. still new to mapping so fingers crossed.

Also, the version string might be the second alpha here, but it's easily beyond fourth in its development. I've trashed so many versions of this map I've lost count at what alpha it's up to know. But, whatever, 4 sounded like a good number so I went with that. I at least know for a fact it's the most updated version.

ZZZAP! Let's get some screenshots! https://imgur.com/a/qnnPB


Read the rest of this update entry...

 

[TwinMill]

"You've done well, eggheads. Great in fact. The one thing I have to ask is, why does it take so long?"
"...our office got outfitted with chairs that spin."

And so another update to this map is here. I had fun with this part, just because I've never detailed anything before... and I guess still haven't. it's a start at least. The previous verison - a5 - turned out to have a lot of technical issues, so this version fixes all of that.

> Began texturing, and minor detailing
> Shortened outside spawn area
> Improved clipping on pipes on flanks
> Moved health kits from ledge on left buildings and improved stairs
> Nulled unseen textures with no-draw
> Changed ammo boxes under bridges to medium
> Added medium rock on both sides of point
> Heightened fence walls on right sides
> Added patches under health kits and ammo kits
> Added in stairs and made ramps into pure clips
> Added center circle on point with proper clipping
> Added proper lighting
> Added proper skybox
> Modified overhead skrinkray
> Modified overhanging brushes
> Compacted spawnroom

Screenshots!
https://imgur.com/a/8yXWtZE

So after plenty of testing there really hasn't been any problems I've seen, meaning gameplay is probably as good as it's going to get. Whether that's a good or bad thing there's jury is still out, but hopefully more testing with different version will make more problems surface.



Read the rest of this update entry...

 

[TwinMill]

"At last we have a functioning shrink-ray! Very nice work."
"Thank you, sir. Now if only we could make this place a bit less of a dump."

Well even the best-laid plans sometimes need to be re-visited, and this map is no different. I was severely dissatisfied with the space between spawn and just outside the point, so I went for the scorched earth method of modifying geography. Hurt to do it, but in all likelyhood a total redo of the first two areas was a long-time coming. Took some time to think of a new layout for it, so with this new one we'll see what things are horribly wrong with it this time.

> Deleted everything past the barbed wire and re-built from scratch
> Widened ramps by the point
> Added cover
> Added medium health kit
> Extended mid cover
> Added an admittedly pointless extension to the right flank
> Re-built the skybox to not be so shoddy
> Re-did clipping
> Jeez there's a lot of 're' in this update
> Re-lowered the shrinkray
> Moved the central building back
> Raised concrete walls
> Added better scaffolding
> Modified location of health kits
> Edited skybox/lighting
> Removed building health kits
> Relocated flank health kits

Images are here https://imgur.com/a/tmIjOam


Read the rest of this update entry...

 

[_Blamo]

Here is a map thoughts video I made which may or may not help you, but is indefinitely stretched out for way too long

View: https://youtu.be/0pYAMn63xhE

 

[TwinMill]

"Sir! We've fixed a couple of small details involving the area around the shrink ray!"
"That's great and all... but why...?"

After some testing I have come to the conclusion that there is still something missing from this map, something else that makes the map a bit more versatile, and so I've made an attempt of adding that.
So:

> Added area to the left of point
> Widened the area between the observation deck and the central point area
> Modified clipping
> Changed outside spawn doors so it's not a straight shot
> Modified skybox (still haven't figured out how I want it)
> Changed most of the staircases to be more.. beleivable
> Added stairs.. just a lot of them
> Cleaned displacements
> Added detail to store house room thing (for fun)
> More optimization

Big thanks to Blamo for his feedback! If only everyone else was as detailed and dedicated as you are. Your input is appreciated and taken into consideration.

Read the rest of this update entry...

 

[_Blamo]

Back from San Francisco so I couldn't hop in earlier unfortunatly.

Seeing how I feel obligated to keep a real close eye on this map apparently (maybe due to wanting to help mappers on top of actually having played earlier versions which is something I can't say for other maps...having a fond impression of this same map) I installed the latest version and after doing a fly-around I noticed one glaring issue

I also looked at the demo for this version (which there was only one of it seems) and surprisingly the server didn't really make a substantial amount of comments which is odd for a full tf2maps imp...which could potentially mean that the map still plays fine as expected...? Though tbf just playing is enough for most which is fine (although there seems to be an issue regarding clipping and hp to some people apparently)

There's a missing medium ammo on blu's side (and aside from doing that, maybe have no ammo packs for both sides or make them smalls again since there's already a medium along with a medium hp on both team's respective transitions to mid? However, I'm just making predictions on how it'll play at this point).

Also this stair should be red imo if this wasn't due to you overlooking some things

And I would keep continuing to take bits of my feedback into consideration for problems that might still persist if you haven't already (most notably how parts of the upper catwalk to the observatory being real right around the computers, engies needing to do dare-devil jumps for most if not all of the metal packs to help them hold there, as well as that one sniper sightline unless that surprisingly plays fine. And the space between spawn and mid might still seems small. But yeah...I would really only worry about the latter three imo) However, you've already mentioned how you've been aware of my feedback (which I highly thank you for btw) already so chances are you might agree with me on those issues anyway. Of course, you can do what you feel is right as always

Also, I don't feel any clipping around these stairs on both sides of the map (rule of thumb: including stairs, you usually want to prioritize clipping for areas where people might get stuck on...even in alphas. Otherwise, save the clipping parts for later versions)

But overall it seems that I'm a fan of what you've done with this version so far, keep it up!