Problems with using a map for different gametypes?

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Tupperwits, Aug 24, 2013.

  1. Tupperwits

    Tupperwits L2: Junior Member

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    I've had this idea for a 5CP map for quite a while but I only having a few working attempts and I've been on quite a long break, that's biting off quite a lot. So I thought why not make the mid as a KOTH map, tweek it untill it's balanced and then build out to 5CP when I'm more experienced.

    However I can't help thinking that I'm probably wrong that KOTH and 5CP mid are interchangable. The only example I can think of that works is Koth_Badlands. There's only a few official maps that do it with other gametypes and I hardly ever see servers with CTF_sawmill or CP_5Gorge. I can't think of any examples on TF2Maps let alone whether they're done well.

    I'm probably still going to make the Koth map but humour me just in case I do build on. Are there any maps where the gametype switch has worked? If not, what goes wrong so I can avoid it?

    Thanks
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2013
  2. Egan

    aa Egan

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    Phi's koth_cobalt is a 3cap map with a koth point in the center, which works really well. Although from what I can gather it took a long while to get it balanced and he's still not very happy with it. (But I like it).

    What was fun about it was that you had to defend your base but also had incentive to attack middle as soon as you could because the koth timer was counting down to your loss. So you'd have to build your map to where it's fun to go back and forth often. I'm not sure how well it'd work with 5cap unless you extended the koth timer a bit but then that also lessens the impact of it probably. You can try it out though.
     
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  3. The Asylum

    aa The Asylum

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    Take a look at what Valve did when they turned cp_badlands into arena_badlands, and then turned that into koth_badlands. The Arena version, you'll notice, just featured the mid point and the first forward spawns. Nothing fancy was introduced, just a quick cutting out of the bases. Then when they turned it into a KOTH map, they completely redid the spawn area, to accommodate for multiple exits. Other than that, they left the rest of the map alone, as it was wide, and featured lots of height differences.

    The reason we haven't seen a KOTH version of Well, I suspect, is that it's pretty flat compared to Badlands. It works well as Arena, I guess, because most of the action takes place inside the train building, with it's multiple platforms. But KOTH? I just don't think the rest of the map has enough height differences for players to defend their spawn area and clamp down on spawncamping.

    Of course, koth_well is very possible, but it would need to a lot of adding and subtracting. Same thing with just about every other 5cp map out there. There needs to be height differences throughout.
     
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  4. Tupperwits

    Tupperwits L2: Junior Member

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    Oh no, that's not what I meant. The first map would be like Koth_Badlands where 2nd and last are cut off (or unbuilt in this case) and just mid is used as the point. I'd end up with 2 maps with standard gametype using the same layouts.

    Allthough cobalt does look interesting. Perhaps I could make a KOTH/Push kybrid map to test 2nd for the 5CP?
     
  5. Auwi

    aa Auwi Certified in best in fun

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    I know there is already an arena_granary, but valve still has not released a koth_granary or a ctf_granary at all. The main reason that those maps have not been made is that it might be too easy to push into the other team's spawn area, which is not good. Same could be said with other 5cp maps.
     
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