Metalwood

Discussion in 'Map Factory' started by sniprpenguin, Jan 27, 2010.

  1. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    CTF_Metalwood is the Major Mapping Competition #4 entry by sniprpenguin.

    Set in the middle of a forest, right after a rainstorm, the two teams must try to capture each other's flag. The gameplay is standard CTF.

    The main design goals behind this map were to create areas that would be interesting to play in, both gameplay-wise and visually, as well as cater to the competitive audience. This goal lead to the design of the figure-8 layout above. There are other considerations taken that I'm keeping to myself. :p

    One thing: Yes, the map is on the large side. But I was working under the idea that fast gameplay =/= small map.

    I'd like to thank my computer for not crashing on me as I work from a blank slate to make this and Acegikmo for his Environment Gallery.

    I'd like to thank the Swamp Team for the railings, and SiniStaR for his Blue Train.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2010
  2. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    OK, before I get requests for pics of the map, it's not letting me upload them for some reason. The forum's giving me:
    "Warning: fopen(/tmp/phpqKOIJD) [function.fopen]: failed to open stream: No such file or directory in [path]/includes/class_image.php on line 333"

    In the mean-time, here's some links to them.

    The Layout:
    http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww284/sniprpenguin/ctf_metalwood_a20006.jpg
    Some Areas:
    http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww284/sniprpenguin/ctf_metalwood_a20004.jpg
    http://i728.photobucket.com/albums/ww284/sniprpenguin/ctf_metalwood_a20000.jpg
     
  3. Ezekel

    Ezekel L11: Posh Member

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    1st thing i thought when i looked at your layout was:
    O.O that's pretty complicated looking.

    then again, i might be mistaken. top down views can never give a superb idea of how the map will play and feel
     
  4. Colt Seavers

    Colt Seavers L6: Sharp Member

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    Looks very big to me. I could be mistaken. I'd definitely try to simplify it to ensure a fast-ish scoring potential. Doesn't mean it has to score fast - but if you are playing well as a team, distance and route shouldn't be the thing stopping you destroy the competition.

    Take it with a pinch of salt but - it's something i do wrong in all my maps : my biggest failing atm - but that doesn't mean I can't spot it in others ;)
     
  5. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    Yay, pics work!

    And work has already begun on a3. Also, this will serve as a gameday bump for this Saturday...
     
  6. Boylee

    aa Boylee pew pew pew

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    May I suggest more lights or brighter lights? It looks rather dark at the moment.
     
  7. MangyCarface

    aa MangyCarface Mapper

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    wtf is a metalwood
     
  8. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    It is supposed to be a dark map, but lights have always been my bane.

    I wanted Nightshift, but nightshift was taken so I asked some friends to name it and that's what they came up with. And as far as I can tell, it is a metal wood.
     
  9. absurdistof

    aa absurdistof

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    Contradictory by nature :/
     
  10. Boylee

    aa Boylee pew pew pew

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    Even dark maps should have a fairly high ambient light level as it allows players to see the class silhouettes.
    However, looking at the screenies again it may have just been my monitor at work, so discount that comment for the time being.

    Maybe using the name of a type of metal e.g. ironwood as that kind of implies a wood with metal-like properties (like hardness), or alternatively a wood, or forest where iron is found.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2010
  11. Azazoth!

    Azazoth! L1: Registered

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    Feedback from gameday:

    The biggest problem with this map is that it is way, way too big. (One of the other players suggested a factor of two, which seems about right to me.) Scale it down to roughly half its current size, and the map will improve dramatically.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Partially (though not entirely) a factor of the map's size: there were some really, really long sightlines in some areas of the map. This is generally frowned on, as being sniped from thousands of Hammer units away is considered an unpleasant experience.

    The signage on the map is reversed from TF2's usual convention: your red signs point towards the blue base, and not vice versa. Once I realized what was going on, I didn't have too much trouble, but it was confusing the heck out of most of the players. You should probably swap that.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Your Novint props don't have their textures packratted, so they show up like this in-game. There are tutorials on packratting properly in the tutorials forum.

    Miscellaneous:

    [​IMG]
    This sign is really dark, for some reason. The corresponding red sign doesn't have this problem.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    These lights lit the surrounding area, but not themselves. Very odd.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    There were a pair of lights in the floor of each spawn. The general consensus was that this was odd, as lights are generally placed on the ceiling, and not the floor. Maybe change that.



    Anyway, downscale the map, fix a few other problems (swap the signage!), maybe add a little more cover, and I think you could have the seed of a very respectable map. Keep it up!
     
  12. honorum646

    honorum646 L6: Sharp Member

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    Yeah the factor of two was me.

    As said above, you literally could take all the outer areas and scale 50%.


    Also, there wasn't just a problem with the direction of the arrows, but there also is no other gameplay signs, which would definetly help with the flow.
     
  13. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    ctf_metalwood_a3b is go!

    Editting first post to reflect this.
     
  14. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    a4 is now released!

    Editing first post to reflect this.

    Screenies to come, but only if necessary.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2010
  15. honorum646

    honorum646 L6: Sharp Member

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    Screenies are necessary, seeing as your previous ones don't do it justice.
     
  16. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    New version is up of A5, along with screenshots. Not a whole lot changed between versions, but due to the upcoming deadline for the contest, the next version will be b1, barring any major changes to the layout. Will be putting up for Gameday testing.
     
  17. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    B1 is out.

    Official Changelog:

    -Heavy decoration
    -Added platforms to allow easier access to far roof-tops
    -Changed health & ammo around
    -Added "walkways" accessible from upper entrance in each base. Blu has a set of pipes, Red has a wooden support beam.
    -Added the train bridge
    -Lit up more areas
    -Started added env_sprites to lights
     
  18. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    Belated gameday bump.

    Would be nice to hear feedback since most of the conversation in-game was about what map to play next...
     
  19. alecom

    alecom L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

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    Okay so.. teams were slightly imbalanced and lead to spawncamping but regardless, I will try and give my opinion on how it plays out normally! All theoretical of course :p
    But hey you need feedback.

    There are two main routes effectively, and they allow complete bypassing of the other team if they both choose to take the 'left' route say. 2 major routes is not something I like, as there doesn't feel to be enough focus. I would Now I don't know if anybody will agree with me on this, but it felt like it has a bit of excess room on the sides. The houses for instance, maybe keep the roofs accessible sure, but I really don't think you need to be able to go inside them.

    After looking at the layout of your map.. I don't really know if this is the best way (since it's a bit of an unnatural flow tbh to get to the other base) but I think it keeps the action more focused. I have just come up with my suggestions of how _I_ think it would be better. Keep in mind this is the first play I had of the map, so don't take it too much to heart as you will no doubt know better how well your map works!

    So here we go: I crossed out the part I don't think is needed, the roofs are fine by me but I don't think the innards are needed.
    http://img638.imageshack.us/i/ctfmetalwoodb10000.jpg/

    Here is the overhead. I tried to outline boundaries and walls with red to show what I would do. I included the balcony part that soldiers and demos can jump up to, but I would completely scrap the route below. The new room is pretty simple - has the route from outside to it alongside one straight to intel, and the exit to intel is a bit narrow (to try and balance out the safety of bypassing spawn). Also not pictured there, I thought it would be good to have stairs going up from this place to the soldier/demo balcony.
    http://img641.imageshack.us/i/ctfmetalwoodb10001.jpg/

    I was considering making the spawn extend to here instead (rather than the other spawn exit on the left) - but I don't know how well that would work.
    http://img682.imageshack.us/i/ctfmetalwoodb10002.jpg/

    Trying to show how I would add the room
    http://img63.imageshack.us/i/ctfmetalwoodb10003.jpg/

    and where the exit for that room would be. I know the red has a double doors there, but you can get smaller doors .. pretty sure you can anyway.
    http://img709.imageshack.us/i/ctfmetalwoodb10004.jpg/

    Me scribbling out the part I don't think needed!
    http://img80.imageshack.us/i/ctfmetalwoodb10005.jpg

    Okay one thing I forgot in the overhead image, maybe make a route to get there so it's not so overpowered for soldiers and demos, but the defence needs some hold on the place to get there.
    http://img88.imageshack.us/i/ctfmetalwoodb10006.jpg/




    so YEAH. I don't know how much you are prepared to change your map, let alone listen to my ideas - but this is how I feel.
     
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  20. sniprpenguin

    sniprpenguin L6: Sharp Member

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    Just gonna write down my thoughts on each point so I can help myself organize:

    The innards were going to be a bitch to detail, and were rarely used except by roaming stragglers. Getting rid of the insides might not be a bad idea.

    A nice idea, actually, though I was also think of a spawn exit leading up to the balcony on the far side as a means to prevent spawn-camping like we had earlier today. Both of these could work.

    404 Not found.

    It's been heavily changed in each version. In fact, my original sketches look nothing like this. Changing geometry doesn't scare me- optimisation does.