Alpine skybox acting as an easy way out?

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by absurdistof, Oct 19, 2009.

  1. absurdistof

    aa absurdistof

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    After playing through quite a few custom maps (mostly 2f2f) I came to the conclusion that the alpine theme can very easily serve as an easy way out for inexperienced mappers. First off, unlike most desert skyboxes, the alpine skybox features a massive mountain and foothills all around, complete with a river, so a 3D skybox is already mostly taken care of. Another thing is that the skybox fits with a lot of non-tf2 themes. This includes maps where it's obvious that you aren't fighting over something in an environment that was there before, but that this environment was already made for you to fight in it. Often these maps include the team colored concrete textures, the iron support textures, and some random wood(I forget what it's called, like wood beam or something but the 3 shades of it are used for supports EVERYWHERE) texture, but for the most part really don't adhere to the tf2 theme.

    I'm not saying that all alpine skyboxed tf2 maps deviate from the tf2 theme, but IMO most of them do. Correct me as you please :3
     
  2. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    What an amazing observation. from this we can conclude: noobs like pretty things that are easy to make.
     
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  3. gamemaster1996

    gamemaster1996 L13: Stunning Member

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    Agreed
     
  4. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

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    Easy as opposed to what?

    Building sandstone cliffwalls all the way around your map to block skybox view.

    None of Valve maps have amazing skyboxes. Each has little sections of detail but for the most part they don't waste too many resources there. 2 fort has probably got the most detailed skybox of all.

    Point me to a desert skybox that is better than a good alpine one. A bad skybox is a bad skybox, no matter what theme it uses.

    Alot of maps nowadays do include alpine, it has been the least used Valve one so far (part of the reason) and people like it.

    Most of all Alpine came out when map making really started to ramp up, so of course everyone started using it. Same could be said for PL maps if you want to be vague and generalize.
    'most custom PL maps are alpine'
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2009
  5. MoonQuake

    MoonQuake L3: Member

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    "Easy as opposed to what?

    Building sandstone cliffwalls all the way around your map to block skybox view."


    Ouch...

    I think it simply depends on your needs.
    It also helps for performance because you don't have to add all the trees and whatnot using models.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2009
  6. The Political Gamer

    aa The Political Gamer

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    I think this is true because Alpine has a very diverse color pallet. Snow is white, Desert is light gray, Swamp is dark brown, and so on and so forth. While Alpine has light/dark greens, light browns and other mixes. So you could say it "easier" to make the map look pretty.
     
  7. Dr. ROCKZO

    Dr. ROCKZO L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

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    At least Alpine is pretty, to make look pretty. If we were getting inexperienced mappers using a theme that is hard to pull off. Yikes.
     
  8. Stormcaller3801

    Stormcaller3801 L5: Dapper Member

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    Given that some of the advice offered here to new mappers includes "do something small to start," a simple map sounds like just the ticket. Make a small map, use a forgiving skybox, and get a feel for things. If they also avoid fullbright and pick up A Boojum Snark's stuff, I'd say they're well on their way to success.
     
  9. absurdistof

    aa absurdistof

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    It sounds like I didn't phrase it too well :/

    What I meant is a lot of what TPG is saying, which is that sure what they are making is a map, but if you are using a desert skybox, the tf2 theme is much more pressed upon you than if you were using the alpine theme. It just seems to me that most maps that really don't adhere to the tf2 theme at all use the alpine skybox.

    Granary has an interesting one, so does badlands. Badwater's isn't that bad either. I guess the point I was trying to make about that was skybox models and architecture vs. skycards.
     
  10. Dr. ROCKZO

    Dr. ROCKZO L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

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    Yes, Using an Alpine map gives you room for lots of concrete, wooden planks and open grass, the Desert theme needs little tricky buildings, lots of displacements and very diverse areas..