- Thread starter MoonQuake
- Start date
The Gentlemanne
L4: Comfortable Member
- Jun 18, 2009
- 170
- 94
this map is very good visually,gameplay...not so much,but I do suggest you do this as a typical payload with a custom cart.
Jamini
L4: Comfortable Member
- Nov 14, 2008
- 196
- 47
I'm going to be running it on the M||V servers a few times these coming weeks. So far everyone who has tried the map has enjoyed it (though it's pretty much universally agreed that the run from the BLU spawn to the cart is exceedingly long.
Things to look into:
1. Making some of the HL2 textures into TF2 styled textures would go a long way in making this map feel more polished. The outside of the ship feels very gritty when compared to the BLU ship.
2.The run from the BLU spawn to the cart is really very long. I'd like to see a forward spawn for BLU near the center of the ship that is accessible once the shields drop. Perhaps a transporter or a people-cannon on the BLU ship? (Like the ones you have now, but more accuracte and less dangerous to use.
3. The people cannons occasionally punt people off the RED ship entirely. The entire server was laughing when a spy flew over their heads and overboard.
4. The first point is very open and sniper friendly. I can see this becoming a problem on larger servers. Especially considering that RED can build teleporters that are nearly untouchable on top of the large communications tower.
5. The vents are very difficult to move through. I'd like to see them expanded slightly vertically to allow easier movement once a player is inside.
6. The assault cart, while a neat idea, is not so great if your team doesn't have an engineer. Also, it's movement is very clunky and irritating to use. It also sucks when the sentry goes down, since it can't be rebuilt without capping. I do like the idea of multiple carts (though I've only seen the basic bomb and assault cart. What is the third?) however I'd say get rid of the backwards mechanic of the assault cart entirely and instead give the attacking team a way to rebuild the cart without forcing their way through a large chokepoint for a capture.
-Suggestion : Perhaps have the buildings respawn one minute after their destruction, letting out a very large alert sound before doing so. This might give the attacking team the advantage they need when receiving this cart over the bomb in order to push into the reactor room.
7. More and clearer signage. It took most people 1.5 rounds to learn the layout of the ship, and even after nearly three sessions of two hours each playing with this map I'm still discovering new routes and hidden features. Having an indication of what breaks where and better directional arrows would help make this map more enjoyable for everyone.
All in all, I love this map. If you are interested in popping in on one of our games on it, just send me a PM in steam (same name) and we'll get something running.
Things to look into:
1. Making some of the HL2 textures into TF2 styled textures would go a long way in making this map feel more polished. The outside of the ship feels very gritty when compared to the BLU ship.
2.The run from the BLU spawn to the cart is really very long. I'd like to see a forward spawn for BLU near the center of the ship that is accessible once the shields drop. Perhaps a transporter or a people-cannon on the BLU ship? (Like the ones you have now, but more accuracte and less dangerous to use.
3. The people cannons occasionally punt people off the RED ship entirely. The entire server was laughing when a spy flew over their heads and overboard.
4. The first point is very open and sniper friendly. I can see this becoming a problem on larger servers. Especially considering that RED can build teleporters that are nearly untouchable on top of the large communications tower.
5. The vents are very difficult to move through. I'd like to see them expanded slightly vertically to allow easier movement once a player is inside.
6. The assault cart, while a neat idea, is not so great if your team doesn't have an engineer. Also, it's movement is very clunky and irritating to use. It also sucks when the sentry goes down, since it can't be rebuilt without capping. I do like the idea of multiple carts (though I've only seen the basic bomb and assault cart. What is the third?) however I'd say get rid of the backwards mechanic of the assault cart entirely and instead give the attacking team a way to rebuild the cart without forcing their way through a large chokepoint for a capture.
-Suggestion : Perhaps have the buildings respawn one minute after their destruction, letting out a very large alert sound before doing so. This might give the attacking team the advantage they need when receiving this cart over the bomb in order to push into the reactor room.
7. More and clearer signage. It took most people 1.5 rounds to learn the layout of the ship, and even after nearly three sessions of two hours each playing with this map I'm still discovering new routes and hidden features. Having an indication of what breaks where and better directional arrows would help make this map more enjoyable for everyone.
All in all, I love this map. If you are interested in popping in on one of our games on it, just send me a PM in steam (same name) and we'll get something running.
- Jul 18, 2009
- 111
- 21
Back from a nice break!
Thanks a lot everyone for taking the time to comment on the map!
Psy: one of the 3 possible carts available for this map is broken right now. The one with the sentry and dispenser. I'm looking into that right now. Please, don't let this simple problem ruin the fun you can have on the map, man.
BB: working on a few improvements for beta 9. Redship's core mechanics will always remain the same, but a few tweaks and changes should do the trick.
Jamini: your feedback reflects 90% of all the feedback I got from all the people who emailed me. You are right on the money.
I'd like to comment on a few points, if you don't mind:
2.The run from the BLU spawn to the cart is really very long.
I've had this comment from very few people but still had it, but most of these people didn't know the map that much and played the map on a not so populated server. Which doesn't seem to be the case for you, tough.
I was under the impression while making the map that the launch pods and the eventual teleporters added by fellow engineers would take care of the problem.
It takes roughly about 20 seconds as a heavy to get to the red shield which I think pretty much reflects the time it takes on other maps, and this would be considerably reduced using the pods or teleporters. I'll keep an ear open about this issue, but I won't add another spawn room for the next version.
3. The people cannons occasionally punt people off the RED ship entirely.
I've had that happen to me on a server once, but we couldn't repro the problem.
If it ever happens to you again, could you take note of the circumstances? That'd be nice if you guys want to do some testing and have everyone on the team use them like crazy and see if it happens again.
Again, thanks for the very detailed feedback post Jamini, I'm looking forward to playing on your server with beta 9 and see what you guys think about the changes and fixes.
More comments like the above are extremely welcome!!
MQ
Thanks a lot everyone for taking the time to comment on the map!
Psy: one of the 3 possible carts available for this map is broken right now. The one with the sentry and dispenser. I'm looking into that right now. Please, don't let this simple problem ruin the fun you can have on the map, man.
BB: working on a few improvements for beta 9. Redship's core mechanics will always remain the same, but a few tweaks and changes should do the trick.
Jamini: your feedback reflects 90% of all the feedback I got from all the people who emailed me. You are right on the money.
I'd like to comment on a few points, if you don't mind:
2.The run from the BLU spawn to the cart is really very long.
I've had this comment from very few people but still had it, but most of these people didn't know the map that much and played the map on a not so populated server. Which doesn't seem to be the case for you, tough.
I was under the impression while making the map that the launch pods and the eventual teleporters added by fellow engineers would take care of the problem.
It takes roughly about 20 seconds as a heavy to get to the red shield which I think pretty much reflects the time it takes on other maps, and this would be considerably reduced using the pods or teleporters. I'll keep an ear open about this issue, but I won't add another spawn room for the next version.
3. The people cannons occasionally punt people off the RED ship entirely.
I've had that happen to me on a server once, but we couldn't repro the problem.
If it ever happens to you again, could you take note of the circumstances? That'd be nice if you guys want to do some testing and have everyone on the team use them like crazy and see if it happens again.
Again, thanks for the very detailed feedback post Jamini, I'm looking forward to playing on your server with beta 9 and see what you guys think about the changes and fixes.
More comments like the above are extremely welcome!!
MQ
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Jamini
L4: Comfortable Member
- Nov 14, 2008
- 196
- 47
The big problem with this is that once BLU is past the shields they are forced to double-back in order to assault the cargo room, computer room, and finally the core. Returning to the cargo room alone nearly doubles the walk time to the front. If you take some of the more commonly-accessed vents your walk time can triple or more.
Engineers do help significantly on offense. However unless your team has a solid lockdown on the back deck it can become nearly impossible to keep a teleporter (or sentry) up in that location due to the very open nature of the top. In one of my more recent games, a friend of mine playing scout managed to get out of the belly of the ship and pistol down the entrance of a teleporter I had placed. Again, opening some of the alternate vents to the computer room a little earlier would probably alleviate a lot of problems.
At the time I was playing a spy, and I think I may have actually landed on an enemy player while getting punted. If it happens again I'll get back to you.
I do look forward to your next release.
- Jul 18, 2009
- 111
- 21
After months of hard work, beta 9 is finally out!
Payload fixes and changes, we now got a radioactive emissions cart!
Optimization improved performance greatly.
All TF2 style textures!
Easter eggs for all 9 classes of the game! Can you find them all?
Gotta go to bed. Have fun.
MQ
Payload fixes and changes, we now got a radioactive emissions cart!
Optimization improved performance greatly.
All TF2 style textures!
Easter eggs for all 9 classes of the game! Can you find them all?
Gotta go to bed. Have fun.
MQ
Played the prior version several times and was not particularly happy with it.
On defense I found myself completely lost; in the first game I played I couldn't even tell it was a payload map because I never saw a cart. Attempting to find a path out to the top resulted in doubling back several times seeing nothing except for glowing consoles. On a few occasions I could hear fighting but could never get to where everyone else was. Finally I ended up on the outside of the ship near the BLU spawn, just about in time to discover we'd lost the game.
On offense, the conning tower is ridiculous. RED could (and regularly did) set up a base on top of it that could not be reached and would proceed to snipe from up there at angles and distances that nobody else could match- with a Heavy-Medic team and a Sentry at the top guarding the (difficult) way up, there wasn't a way for anyone except Snipers to fight back. Attempting to avoid the area and move forward worked about as well as one would expect in crossing a very large, open area while a Sniper's above you with a Dispenser at his back.
Once we actually got to the far end of the ship, things continued to be at best difficult- at least one chokepoint required a rather precise jump to get around, and could easily be defended. At the same time, as stated above trying to set up and maintain a teleporter, Sentry and Dispenser was an effort in frustration due to the fact that the tower and vents allowed RED to show up just about anywhere they wanted and then destroy it.
Again, it was confusing trying to move down into the ship; between the constant attacks from all sides and no clear directions, it was a matter of repeatedly stumbling into ambushes and Sentry fire, which along with the long run back to the cart (under Sniper fire) would cause me to discover RED had pushed behind the cart and re-fortified an area we'd already fought through.
On defense I found myself completely lost; in the first game I played I couldn't even tell it was a payload map because I never saw a cart. Attempting to find a path out to the top resulted in doubling back several times seeing nothing except for glowing consoles. On a few occasions I could hear fighting but could never get to where everyone else was. Finally I ended up on the outside of the ship near the BLU spawn, just about in time to discover we'd lost the game.
On offense, the conning tower is ridiculous. RED could (and regularly did) set up a base on top of it that could not be reached and would proceed to snipe from up there at angles and distances that nobody else could match- with a Heavy-Medic team and a Sentry at the top guarding the (difficult) way up, there wasn't a way for anyone except Snipers to fight back. Attempting to avoid the area and move forward worked about as well as one would expect in crossing a very large, open area while a Sniper's above you with a Dispenser at his back.
Once we actually got to the far end of the ship, things continued to be at best difficult- at least one chokepoint required a rather precise jump to get around, and could easily be defended. At the same time, as stated above trying to set up and maintain a teleporter, Sentry and Dispenser was an effort in frustration due to the fact that the tower and vents allowed RED to show up just about anywhere they wanted and then destroy it.
Again, it was confusing trying to move down into the ship; between the constant attacks from all sides and no clear directions, it was a matter of repeatedly stumbling into ambushes and Sentry fire, which along with the long run back to the cart (under Sniper fire) would cause me to discover RED had pushed behind the cart and re-fortified an area we'd already fought through.
- Jul 18, 2009
- 111
- 21
Stormcaller: totally agree with you. Beta 9 addresses many issues you mentioned.
Again, because of the amount of changes, it needs to be thoroughly tested.
But I'm positive you'll find it much better when it comes to "what the heck should I do, and where should I go."
Give it a shot (on a populated server obviously) I'd like to have your comments.
I'll also have it registered for the next gameday.
MQ
Again, because of the amount of changes, it needs to be thoroughly tested.
But I'm positive you'll find it much better when it comes to "what the heck should I do, and where should I go."
Give it a shot (on a populated server obviously) I'd like to have your comments.
I'll also have it registered for the next gameday.
MQ
The_Ulf
L6: Sharp Member
- May 26, 2009
- 399
- 115
TEXTURES! This is looking great (dunno about the cart variants, I'd have to see it played to judge), but it will look so much better, more cohesive and on theme if you get everything in TF2 textures or make custom TF2-styled versions of what you're using. TF2 has a very explicitly painterly, detail-de-emphasized visual style that sets it apart and makes everyone's first map using HL2 stuff look like fail.
- Jul 18, 2009
- 111
- 21
The Ulf: dunno if you actually played the map, but like I mentioned in the changelog, I TF2-ized each every texture of this map. Now, this is a space ship themed map, you just won't find your usual wood plank and metal sheet textures, I'm sure you know that!
It would be nice to also have feedback from people that actually run this map on their server. See how people welcome it.
Also, system specs vs. performance. I spent some time optimizing and, even though the map runs at a good 80fps on average and is much more detailed, I haven't tested it on a lot of configs.
MQ
It would be nice to also have feedback from people that actually run this map on their server. See how people welcome it.
Also, system specs vs. performance. I spent some time optimizing and, even though the map runs at a good 80fps on average and is much more detailed, I haven't tested it on a lot of configs.
MQ
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ricardojvc6
L6: Sharp Member
- Jun 8, 2009
- 268
- 66
The only thing this map misses is Darth Vader It would be epic if this map has a darth vader.. a rly bad ONE! Don't forget the textures.. just remove the hl2 textures and put them with TF2 style.. i'm sure with look good
It would be epic if this map has a darth vader.. a rly bad ONE! Don't forget the textures.. just remove the hl2 textures and put them with TF2 style.. i'm sure with look good
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DontWannaName
L3: Member
- Jan 12, 2009
- 112
- 24
If its ready for servers then I will take a look at it and perhaps add it.
DontWannaName
L3: Member
- Jan 12, 2009
- 112
- 24
I took a look, why is there a track and then it ends and it keeps going, perhaps make it a hovering cart with the blue teleporter effect on the bottom? At the end the bars should open so the cart drops into the laser and blows up. The dispenser on the cart doesnt look so good. Theres a lot of destroying stuff which takes a while, I dont know how people will react to that on a full server. Each thing to destroy also counts as destroying a building on steam stats.
- Jul 18, 2009
- 111
- 21
ricardojvc6: lol Darth Vader! Yep, all TF2-ized textures.
DontWannaName: hovering cart.... I like it! The dispenser on the cart is a regular dispenser with added FX because it's a super dispenser. There are many things that need a few rockets or many bullets to be destroyed, but remember, you played the map alone. As a heavy, alone, it takes a few seconds to destroy a console. Some classes are better at destroying objectives. Each destroyed objective gives you points and counts as a destroyed building.
Great feedback there!
Need more!
MQ
DontWannaName: hovering cart.... I like it! The dispenser on the cart is a regular dispenser with added FX because it's a super dispenser.
There are many things that need a few rockets or many bullets to be destroyed, but remember, you played the map alone. As a heavy, alone, it takes a few seconds to destroy a console. Some classes are better at destroying objectives. Each destroyed objective gives you points and counts as a destroyed building.Great feedback there!
Need more!
MQ