Karat a4a

Changes made:

• +1 Respawn time (from 6-6 & 6-9 to 7-7 & 7-10). The force respawn cuts the times somewhat short
• Fixed some visible nodraw
• Added arrow sign at the back of second
• Some clipping things
• Added clear boundary to mid cap zone

Things todo:

• I'm going to raise the lasts (incl. courtyards) by 64 HU to make the height differences between courtyard and second smaller.
• Points are generally too easy to defend. Need to promote offensive plays somehow

Changes made:

• Everywhere
  • Changed respawn times to 6-6, with 6-9 when attacking last
  • Redistributed pickups
  • Tried to alleviate visual clutter, still needs work
  • Forward spawns now have one-way glass doors
• Last
  • Opened up upper route more for both attackers and defenders
  • Made cover at point shoot-through
  • Added stairs up to high ground from point
• Courtyard (outside last)
  • Simplified layout
  • Added a route to second's high ground
  • Removed entrance to second's underground
  • Added a banana
• Second
  • New forward spawn
  • Changed exit of underground passage close to the main route (prevents easy flanks)
  • Added cover to the "bridge"
• Second-to-mid
  • Lower route now connects to the upper route
  • Lost of small adjustments
• Mid
  • Complete overhaul. I never liked the old mid

Things to look out for:

• Is the new mid fun? Is the scaling ok?
• Are the points too easy to defend?

Spoiler: Pics

Overview

Courtyard

Second

Mid

Layout is a bit scrambled at the moment and not "realistic" by TF2 standards. I'll look into this for a5, after I've made small changes for a4a.

Made some changes in response to feedback:

• Last's lower route is no more (RIP 2014-2023). I think it is time to admit that it brought on more issues than it solved. A fourth entrance might need to be added to last in case it becomes too easy to hold with sentries but for now I'll leave it as is.
• Big changes to respawn wave times. Times start at 3-3 instead of 6-6. Capping mid increases the attackers time from 3 to 6. When attacking the last point, the times are as they were in a2a (so 8-6 for defenders and attackers resp.). Additionally, each cap causes a force spawn for both teams. This is disabled in competitive mode. The respawn change is mostly experimental.
  • Remember there is always a 5 seconds killcam time added to each respawn
• The second point's lower route is opened about 15 seconds after a new round starts. This is only to give heavies a slightly quicker rollout
  • Note: the reason I don't have the routes opened from the start is to: 1) force the players through the second point and 2) make scouts and roaming soldiers arrive at mid in about the same time
• Changed environment light direction. This already gives the map a less cluttery feeling in my opinion
• Moved the crates from second away from the point, making the point bare
  • The point should now be harder to cap and hold for the attacking team
• The first forward spawn now points towards mid (ish)
• Added a few signs
• Clipped a lot of things

Things to do in the near future:

• Simplify/Streamline some areas, especially around lower mid
• Lessen visual noise
• Need to figure out how to lessen the walking. Maybe squish the map a bit?
• Start shifting towards a Nordic medieval theme (during summer)
• 3D skybox
• Simple custom models (shorter wooden beams)
• Improve signage

And I will not add a step to the upper mid route to second. You add the step!

Spoiler: Pics

Oopsies:

• Seems like I forgot to untrigger the red's last forward spawn. Fixed that.
• Made the highground slightly less blinding at mid (ground)
• Fixed a spot players could get stuck in.

Things noted:

• Map is a bit messy (geometrywise) so it needs some streamlining. Personally I don't like how the lower connector to mid plays, but I don't know yet how to fix it. After streamlining I need to try to reduce the visual clutter/mess as well.
• Map seems to roll a lot. I might add force respawns for the losing side both sides to keep this from happening (with VScript I bet I can disable this if the map is played in tournament mode. My gut tells me comp players do not like force respawns in 5cp).
• The last point seems to be hard to push out of once the attackers conquer the courtyard area. This is what I want but maybe not to this extent.

I should start making smaller, more frequent updates... Anyways, here are some significant changes made:

• The layout has now changed from a W-shape to a U-shape. This has the following benefits: more intuitive for new players (as it should be less confusing to always turn in one direction, subconsciously), better optimization and less egregious sightlines between last and second. A drawback to this is that the layout is possibly a bit less interesting, so I would really like to hear people's thoughts on this change.
• With this new layout, second's lower path is not a "get-a-flank-for-free" anymore. It's harder/more risky to bypass the enemy team using it.
• Added pathway from last to second around a tower. This pathway uses a 1:1 stair to provide cover.
• Upscaled last slightly (+64, +64), made paths wider around last.
• Moved last's spawn back slightly and provided cover to the point. The cover keeps the point almost fully visible towards the attacker's side.
• Second has now a bigger "back area". The blacksmith building on second has been redesigned.
• Added a crate as cover & sightline blocker to second.
• Minor health and ammo redistribution.
• Made spawn times shorter. (Spawn time of 6, unless defending last when it is 8)

Downgraded to alpha as I'm interested in gameplay feedback.

This is an in-between update where I've changed the routes from lower-second to mid. The larger arching tunnel is now blocked, and an additional archway into mid has been opened. Those defending their last point will also have a respawn time of 8 instead of 7. Those attacking the last point will still have a respawn time of 6.

My next update will be a 2cp version of BLU's last and second point with the intention of testing a new layout + some balance changes. In case the new layout is trash there is less effort lost this way.

Ooh boy, 265 checklist items done. Major changes include: new mid (rip radar dish, welcome "toilet tower"), preliminary art pass, rescaling mid and area between second and last slightly and added "crow's nest" highground and cover to the second point.

Other notable changes are improved signage, moved third spawn closer to defender's second (I tweaked respawn times to accomodate this), redistributed pickups and optimization.

Also, removed spawn invuln as that simply confused players. Added respawn closets to forward spawns (don't worry, they deactivate if the defenders capture the relevant point)

Here are some pictures:

Last point

Second point and area below it

Going to mid

Mid point, marketplace

Stuff to do:

• Adding depth to walls making them less flat
• Custom soundscapes and models
• Fix so that the mid capture point is visible to the player when coming from lower
• Custom "tarp"/cloth texture
• 3D Skybox

Name changed from Sleekiercrete to Karat.​

The full name history is now:

1. Convenientcover
2. Sleekcrete
3. Mainz*
4. Sleekiercrete
5. Karat

* Idolon's entry to a detailing contest, which used Sleekcrete as a base.

Names considered:

• Karat
• Carat
• Fortune
• Halcyon
• Bounty
• Bullion
• Cold Hard Cash
• Crete: if I would use the Greek theme. See: https://tf2maps.net/downloads/santorini.13265/ and Greek Pack from Freyja
• Beacon: there exists an abandoned map with same name: https://tf2maps.net/threads/beacon.11353/
• Aureus: roman gold coin
• Motherlode: might refer more to mining
• Hoard
• Azimuth
• Coelostat
• Lode
• Trove
• Sleekiestcrete

Changes made​

• Sleekified mid: Make stuff smoother and clipped a lot of things. Clipping the dish was a slight nightmare. First, I used tetrahedra (or the like) but these were very wonky with a feeling that some of them were lost on compile? Then I attempted to use a clip displacement, but apparently this doesn't work in TF2. Lastly, I made the clip piece by piece calculating the angles (note that the dish is tilted) so that they would not be invalid. Not fun.
• Mid is ever so slightly bigger than before. Added a pillar to mid, and made the point's "pillar" more narrow to make it easier to damage enemy scouts.
• Fixed a lot of janky brushes at second-to-mid area. (Nothing anything that visible.)
• Fixed every thing that was feedbacked, except for:

1. Player getting stuck around second's back area. I could not replicate.
2. Hard to "read" where the points are from the environment. This is something I'll keep in mind when detailing.
3. Kept sightlines from last to second. I will fix this if deemed necessary.

• Centered map around 0,0,0 and moved map into a fresh .vmf to reset brush numbers etc.
• Changes to last:

1. Small health kit under dropdown is now medium.
2. Added sign
3. Made last's door "room" taller, making it easier to rollout
4. Made the back gold light slightly less bright

• Removed forward spawns' protection for now.

I even half-made a quick conversion to payload, but I figured I've made enough payload in my life already.

Here's also a pic of the dropdown at last point.

Big update

Feedback: map is overcomplicated/too cornery/unfocused/untidy
- I'll try to remove some paths to streamline the combat some more. Tried to eliminate some "corner gameplay". There is still a big question about the second to last area, what should it be turned into?
- I doubled down on the second's underground area, making it a bit more complex than the previous version (easier to enter/exit). To promote the underground area, the upper mid connection to second was removed. It was never my intention that this way would be the main way to attack second.

Feedback: it is too easy to bypass holds/points
- The main "point" of the second point should be that attackers can use the underground area to flank the enemy.
- It was too easy, however. I closed down lower mid so that it forces the player to enter the dish area. Also, lower second now has a one way door to make sure attacking players can't sneak to last without some effort.

Feedback: gameplay is usually at corners, not areas
- Still needs work. I made second and the area between second and first slightly wider, and removed some unnecessary dead end areas / sentry nest locations.

Feedback: map doesn't feel 5cp
- TODO: Could use some elaboration? The W-shape gives off that vibe, I know, but is there anything else?

Feedback: Hard to push for both teams
- Double sentry at last is very powerful. Added a dropdown to lower last from which it is possible to demo spam a sentry above. The dropdown also "promotes" the lower last route more to the defenders.
- Might still need work

Feedback: Gold is green
- Hopefully it is now nice and shiny (added cubemaps.)

Other changes:
- Made some door triggers slightly larger as scouts were bumping into them
- Lamps are now non-solid
- Made stuff more accessible to scouts with default double jump
- Moved pickups around
- Added better pickups to the lower last route
- Added more health around second
- Added nobuilds right at spawn doors
- Removed A, B and C signs
- Made last cap zone simpler and slightly larger
- Added indicator to the cap zone at last
- Lots of scaling around second and last (and it might still need some work)
- Moved second spawn to "coffee shop" near B. This second spawn has a better protected teleport entrance platform. Changed spawn time to compensate
- Added spawn invulnerability to the forward spawns. Why isn't this the norm?
- Moved mid dish so that it was less rare to get stuck on it
- Lowered mid dish's platform so that it is easier to normally jump to
- Directed the path at mid towards mid (I don't really know what I was originally thinking)
- Made forward spawns use "no entry" door skin


Things I attempted but discarded

- Removed the second's underground area and made changes to the now gone upper mid connector. I really didn't like how uninspired it turned out.
- Rotated the map 180 to see if the lighting is any better this way. It wasn't.
- Continuing the lower pathway at last 90 degrees. It did not provide a good second angle to attack sentries with.
- Added but removed a second pathway from outside last to lower last
- Thought about moving the last's spawn back, providing more space for the defenders to stand and defend the point from. Might come back to this at some point


Things to check

This map might be slightly underscaled at the moment so I will need to join the next playtest to check that.


My goal with this map

Weird and fun 5cp, with a "two-layered" second point


Other things

Thanks to the players who left valuable feedback. I'm really glad I had this tested on both EU and US, as I got good feedback "coverage".

Note: versions a11 and a12 were simply non-public backups before bigger changes.