KotH Ziggurat

[Luigi Thirty]

koth_ziggurat is a King of the Hill map for TF2.

Two teams battle for control of a temple on top of a ziggurat-like structure.

This is an early version but it's playable.

 

[tyler]

There is already a map called Temple, I believe, and your height differences are crazy. So are the ramps. Actually, everything about this map is bizarre.

 

[Mr. P. Kiwi]

Yes, there is already a map called temple.
On the other hand, this map doesn't look gameplay wise. I don't want to say that all your efforts should be thrown away, but rather changed heavily. First of all, as yyler, already pointed out the map is too high and the ramps are too big. This map can be easily dominated by snipers that shoot everybody that leaves the spawn.

I believe the map looks something like that:

You can see that both teams go in the same direction, in the same way, and there is nothing they can change about it - both sides are completely alike! The first team to capture both brown spots wins the game. You might want to take your time and read these awesome tutorials by grazr:
1. Immersion and Your Map
2. Balance, layout and your A/D map
3. Objectives and Your Map

 

[Luigi Thirty]

Well I renamed it but it won't let me change the name of the thread.

 

[red_flame586]

Another helpful tutorial by grazer, particularly useful to help with your huge hight differences and open spaces;

[Guide] Scale and your map

Also, you have some pretty huge sightlines there which will continue to make snipers dominant.

EDIT: you yourself can't change the name of the thread without an admin, at least I think that's how it works.

 

[tyler]

Gonna be a dick here and say that's not a ziggurat, but I look forward to what you do with it.

 

[Luigi Thirty]

So far I've:

Lowered the upper level a bit to reduce the height difference, no more fall damage between the top and first levels.
Extended the sides of the second level so it actually looks like a stepped pyramidal structure
Blocked off the sightlines on the side with those containers (they look like they contain the parts for that tower structure)
Closed off the corners of the map near the spawn so snipers can't hang out there.
Placed a wooden ramp on each side as an alternate side route to the top.
Opened up the ramp there with an entry into the inside of the second level for... I don't know yet.

Most pressing issues:
Make the height difference from ground level to the first level less, or at least seem less.
Fix the sightline from spawn to the point without seeming too obvious that whatever I placed is there to do that.
Make the ramp thing on the right side of this shot less ugly.

 

[Luigi Thirty]

Trying to simultaneously close off the bottom level and top level is hard.

You can't see the spawn from ground level unless you're right on top of it, but you can still see it from the top level of the temple.

 

[Luigi Thirty]

I believe the map looks something like that:

I think I'm solving this problem. I added an entrance into the inside of the temple on the bottom level here:

Which opens into an arena room and these staircases:

Which lead up to a second floor, exiting to either a split version of the ramp allowing the team to flank enemies on the ramp or platform:

Or exiting to the side which is a back way around for spies or anyone to flank from the side or reach the point:

But I haven't tested any of it yet so I could be completely off-base here.

 

[tyler]

Okay, I legitimately want to help you, but first I want to know something. Does any of this look like something that's in the core TF2 to you? You really ought to read some guides about TF2 design and revisit this idea.

 

[red_flame586]

Ok, the thing is, even though this map looks kinda cool, by trying to fix it by just adding and adding random stuff all over the place, it's beginning to look really messy.

 

[Luigi Thirty]

Okay, I legitimately want to help you, but first I want to know something. Does any of this look like something that's in the core TF2 to you? You really ought to read some guides about TF2 design and revisit this idea.

If we stuck to "core TF2" design then we'd only be playing infinite versions of Badlands or Goldrush or Generic Rocky Desert Map until the end of time.

 

[tyler]

That's not what I mean.

 

[Luigi Thirty]

That's not what I mean.

I'm not sure what you mean then?

Ok, the thing is, even though this map looks kinda cool, by trying to fix it by just adding and adding random stuff all over the place, it's beginning to look really messy.

Part of that I'm sure is using the mismatched clashing textures I used to tell brushes apart. The cover models I'm using are semi-placeholders until I find something better. Obviously I'm not going to leave copy+pasted metal barriers near the spawn points forever, that sort of thing.

 

[Luigi Thirty]

Updated to a8.

 

[Fruity Snacks]

This is a ziggurat, used by the mesopatamians in the fertile crescent (aka, iraq)

Your structure looks more greco/roman in nature...

and agreeing with just about everyone else, the map needs some work. (Like Line of Sight, need to break up some of them at the point... from what I can tell at your point)