CP Hold the Flag

Discussion in 'Map Factory' started by Sebi, Sep 4, 2011.

  1. Sebi

    Sebi L2: Junior Member

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    Hi there, TF2 mapping community! I've mapped for years now for several games and such, but I never had the determination to finish anything, to make anything "for real". But not this time! This time, I mean it!

    What is this map?
    - I introduce a new gamemode, invented by me, designed by me and you best hope... yeah lame joke ;)
    - A symmetrical map, relatively small
    - A map in it's first stage of public testing. That means dev textures all over the place!


    What is this new game mode all about?
    - There are 5 Control points. All of them are locked.
    - The goal of the map is to capture all five Control Points.
    - In the middle of the map, there is a neutral intelligence.
    - Whichever team gains control of the intelligence by taking it to it's base is able to capture the control points. The intelligence stays at it's owner's base.
    - Captured Control Points are instantaneously locked to prevent the enemy team from capping them back.
    - Stealing the intelligence from the enemy base and taking it to your own, inverts the lock/unlock status of all CPs; effectively meaning:
    - Only the team in posession of the intel are able to cap the enemy's CPs.


    What's the purpose of uploading it here?
    - The map's gameplay shall be in the focus. Making it pretty is for later.
    - If someone has a great idea how to name it, feel free to post it here.
    - Feedback on how the map plays and feels, whether it is too fast-paced or if the CPs' captime is too high or too low or whatever is greatly appreciated.

    Have fun!

    ---

    Known issues:
    - The basement has some superfluous space. That is due to the fact that I was making an additional route from the basement to the enemy intelligence place, which I shut down temporarily until I feel more secure about the rest of the map's architecture / gameplay.

    - The wall to which the intelligence capture zone is attached kind of stands there in the middle of nowhere. I want to include it into the complex but came across a creative block, not knowing how. (So I uploaded it here)
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2011
  2. thekurnuttaja

    thekurnuttaja L1: Registered

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    First when I saw the title I thought the game mode would be like if someone has to keep the flag and somekind of timer starts to run out.

    Hard to say how its going to work, put on gameday to test.
     
  3. Goombac

    Goombac L4: Comfortable Member

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    Sounds really complicated. Is it just 5 CP except you can only capture if you have the intel? So it starts with 2 red, 2 blu and 1 neutrel with an intel thrown in? Or are they all neutral? And when the other team gets the intel are the points reset? Or just stay that way until recaptured, just with the intel-holding team's points locked?

    Because from what you said, it sounds it'll either end in stalemates because the teams aren't able to hold the intel for long enough, or it'll end in a steamroll with the intel surrounded by sentries in the corner of the map. Of course I'll have to play it to see.

    And if the team with the intel drops it, is it still theirs? Or does someone need to be in possession of it?
     
  4. Sebi

    Sebi L2: Junior Member

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    It is not complicated. Perhaps I only wrote it complicated.
    Yes, but it is far smaller than badlands or granary. And it is not linear. The two team-assigned points behind the middle neutral point should, in theory, be equally good reachable.
    It is also important to know that the points are completely independent of one another. It doesn't matter if you have capped Center if you stand on a point far in enemy territory. It will capture anyway. (As long as your team has got the intel)
    Yes
    Nope
    Yes
    ---
    Isn't this contradictory?
    True. You could also download it to see how it works.

    It works different:
    The intel spawns in the middle of the map. From there it can be taken by either team and brought to an area to store it; to put in on the floor; to capture it. As soon as the carrier touches that triggerbrush of the capture area, the intel is automatically put on the floor and capped for that team which can capture from then on.
    If an enemy manages to not only take the intel but get it back into their own base, to their own func_capturezone, then the locks-statuses of the CPs get switched.
    I designed the map on paper so, that it should not be too hard to steal the intel from the enemy base. Unlike 2fort where it is virtually impossible to get to the enemy intelroom in one piece.

    That should hopefully clarify things. Gonna update the starting post.
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2011
  5. Terwonick

    Terwonick L6: Sharp Member

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    I like the idea, and I'm glad that the entities work, but I think you should remove the medieval resupply from the map, unless you decide to change it to medieval mode, in which case remove the regular resupply cabinet...

    pic:
    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Sebi

    Sebi L2: Junior Member

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    D:

    Typical case of routine blindness. I just didn't see that medieval supply anymore :blushing:

    Big Thx!
     
  7. LeSwordfish

    aa LeSwordfish semi-trained quasi-professional

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    Yup, and that's exactly how it works. The line between "Bad defense, easy to capture" and "Good defense, impossible to capture" is very thin, and this will only be exacerbated by splitting the defenders SIX ways- defending five points and attacking a flag.

    Why not make it standard 5cp with this twist: this way teams are only split in two- flag and unlocked point.
     
  8. Sebi

    Sebi L2: Junior Member

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    Because then I would need another map :p. This won't works so easily with standard 5cp. Besides, I want to make something fresh.

    ---

    Let's see what tomorrow's gameday reveals.
     
  9. Terwonick

    Terwonick L6: Sharp Member

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    FWI, it is standard 5cp with a twist:

    you have to hold the flag to cap the opponent's points

    there is only one flag
     
  10. absurdistof

    aa absurdistof

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    I'm interested to see how the 'cap whichever point in whichever order' mechanic will work. In principle, I would predict that giving each team so many objectives to worry about would make for erratic and uncoordinated captures in public games. So from principle I would advise that you give the map an element of sequentuality (new word starting now), so that a team couldn't be stopped from winning by the opposing team holding one capture point somewhere in the map.

    But truth be told I'd love to see this.
     
  11. Sergis

    aa Sergis L666: ])oo]v[

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    the test was madness. it was difficult to find the intel area, it was dificult to find the points and it was difficult to figure out wtf are we supposed to do. i don't think i ever even went to last cap. also 4 points available at the same time are madness. also you shouldnt make sniper-only battlements. snipers have plenty of sightline opportunities without them.

    it'd be interesting to see how this would work in a familiar map, for example, badlands with intel zones in the houses in front of 2nd spawns. with people knowing the layout, at least some of confusion would be killed off.
     
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  12. Sebi

    Sebi L2: Junior Member

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    That sounds like a good idea. I am gonna use the badlands sdk file and put my objective entities in. That cannot be too much of work. Copypasting and readjusting a bit.

    I think this will always be the case when someone is popped into a new gamemode with knowing neither the layout nor the objective. Practically the whole test was learning the map, which is why I would wish for more than 10 minutes playtime. :(

    yea. the sniper battlements kind of came while I was building already. originally there weren't any. gonna redesign those probably. I don't think I'm gonna abandon the map, that would be far too early but rather redesign some part of it. The problem is. With a ridicolously short playtest where even I could not find out much about the flow of my map, I cannot gather enough information needed for a proper redesign. :mellow:
     
  13. Sergis

    aa Sergis L666: ])oo]v[

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    you have to make it bloody obvious what is where and wtf are we supposed to do. thats pretty much all the information needed for a redesign. any kind of "flow" can only be talked about when players actually know what they are doing, which was not the case.
     
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  14. Sebi

    Sebi L2: Junior Member

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    Thank you very much for your input, Sergis! Your texts give me ideas.
     
  15. Sebi

    Sebi L2: Junior Member

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    Updated!
     
  16. waxpax

    waxpax L5: Dapper Member

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    Played it earlier tonight, took me way too long to figure out what was going on with the flag and the points; but, it was fun once I grasped the concept.

    I think you need a better way to identify the points, like letters or just better signage. At one point, we needed to cap one point to win and I swear I ran around the map three times looking for the last point before the other team finally capped the intel to lock that last point :/
     
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