Here's me, help and welcome would be appreciated

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by WilliumBobCole, Jan 29, 2011.

  1. WilliumBobCole

    WilliumBobCole L1: Registered

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    Hey guys, I got into map making a little while back and just sat down now to try and get more into it and hopefully one day create something of worth.

    firstly, I would like to know if there was a better answer to the thread found here? I'm a bit of a perfectionist and being able to launch a bomb over the door as it appears to move up doesn't appeal to me much, as minor as it may be, so moving the func_door down doesn't feel right imho, is there not a way to move only the lower verts and leave the top four where they are? or maybe a func brush that overrides the func_door so you can still move through an area even if the func_door is in the way? i dont want people on top of my exit tunnel from my spawn to be blocked or even flung up into the air ;P

    Also, has the compiling system changed or something? as far as I can tell, my new test map was built right with no leaks and correct lighting, and yet it compiles as if it has no skybox... I also loaded and recompiled my old map which was lit correctly, and now it too has no shadows? I'm not to worried about this at the moment but was just wondering, I'm more interested in making a fun, playable map, at the moment I just have two spawns, and a no mans land with a cap point... I've also done some basic l4d2 mapping but thats tedious, what with all the corridors and rooms and making sure it works right, and nav mapping, I love it though and will go back to it, but i think tf2 will be simpler for a beginner like me.

    perhaps this could be my training thread, if anyone wishes to help, where I can start making things you recommend for starters and start working up to more cool stuff and maybe eventually taking requests until I can produce a community inspired full map. that'd be nice :)

    mostly I'd like to learn to map efficiently. That is, map well, but fast, and stop worrying about little details like moving posts a pixel to the left when I havent even got a full structured map... I do that... I just want to build a cool map that is fun to play, like yknow, blocked out in full, and THEN do details. I just need you lot to kick me up the arse when I go off track I think ;P

    tldr; how to make sliding doors with no wall above them? why has my previously working lighting now stopped working? who wants to help, inspire and encourage me to make a proper map? (given some time of course!)

    thanks =D
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2011
  2. Ravidge

    aa Ravidge Grand Vizier

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    No.
    Your best option is still using a door model with a proper opening animation. And then using a invisible func_door (set to Don't render) that slides in a direction that doesn't intersect with gameplay area. Downwards usually works.
    This invisible door moves very fast and the direction it opens and closes has no meaningful impact.
    What does "no skybox" mean? Does it mean you get a Hall of mirrors effect? If so you still have a leak of some sort. If it means the whole map is rendered you probably compiled on "fast".
    Maps with no lighting automatically turn on fullbright on mapload. This setting stays on even if you change map, so be sure to type mat_fullbright 0 in the console to get the shadows back.
    Usually the way things work here is that you post a Map development thread in the Maps section. And from there people chip in with suggestions on what you've already built. This forum has been mapping for years and a lot of the beginner questions you may have, are probably answered somewhere so use the search function first. If not, make a new thread... a Mega-thread for a single user is probably not the best idea.
     
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  3. Whated

    Whated L2: Junior Member

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  4. WilliumBobCole

    WilliumBobCole L1: Registered

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    okay, I'll make my func door move down, does that still mean rockets and the like will bounce of the dynamic sliding door prop, even with collisions set to not solid? (I read somewhere that having func_door AND the dynamic door WITH collisions could conflict so I turned collision off for it) and what would be a good speed, it's currently at 500, but sometimes I just about walk into it before it fully opens, and given its current state, there isnt much room for expanding the trigger box without mad spawn killing. I will most likely expand it soon but for now I want to focus on efficient brush and geometry use, because I waste more time than I think I need to on that. Thats not to say I'm FAST at the logic stuff, but I think I will manage that when I get used to the various functions and use them regularly, I spent ages trying to make decent working elevators in L4D2 and tbh I'm still not happy with it, but that was mostly nav mesh based...

    No sorry I should have been more clear, I can see the skybox, but it was on fullbright (never heard the name of it before now is all). the console command fixed it, no idea why it came on in the first place though, but thank you! =]

    Fair enough, I just need motivation and ideas and help, I don't want to produce loads of work and submit it for it to turn out that I've messed something up badly, like bad brushes/texturing (in particular, nodraw between and outside them.)
    I'd also like to know how and where to use the occlusion thingys that valve use to make thier maps not lag (though I need a large working map before that comes around.)

    Anyway, thanks for your help, I think I'll draw out a cap point map with 2-3 points (probably an attack/defend one rather than starting with one each and a blank one in the middle, the gamemode has escaped me here, I apolagise), and then start a thread once I start making progress, partly for my own logging benefit, but also for suggestions and advice when I get stuck.
    ...
    MSPaint where aaaare yooouuuuu........ ;P

    edit: I've made two working spawn rooms now, Just need to put in some cap points and then I can copy everything over as a template when it comes to level design so hopefully should go well... a question though, there are two massive red wireframe boxes around my map, overlapping in the middle, leaving two red lines down the middle of the map... they don't seem to be a problem but why are they there? the only thing i can think of is when I pressed ctrl+a to select all (which didnt work), it seemed to resize my windows or something, but pressing it again doesnt get rid of it so i dont know what they are...
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2011
  5. WilliumBobCole

    WilliumBobCole L1: Registered

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    okay so I've designed my map on paper, I've now been setting up the cap points and spawn points and timer/round entities, so that I can focus just on the layout of the map and simply copy/paste my logic setup. I've got two working rounds with 3 cap points each and countdown timer and correct win conditions (for a dustbowl style map). only thing I have left to program is the setup time keeping the blue doors locked. I've been following the tutorial here, but at that point it gets really vague and I don't know how to do it...

    Also, on round two, the hud doesnt display cap points 4-6 correctly at the bottom, that's probably an easy fix but I dont want to mess up my round one hud...

    And I just tested to see if blue team could win from overtime (on point one), but as soon as the point was captured (in overtime), the round was a loss, is this just a feature of the game or should it add time and let me continue?

    There was something else to but I've forgotten it for the time being...

    edit: I can't remember if this is what i wanted to ask, but another thing anyway, how do I change the message to show attack/defend as opposed to capture point, as in the startup of dustbowl?

    thanks =]
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2011
  6. Huckle

    Huckle L4: Comfortable Member

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    You can create segmented doors, where you have the visible model with its animation showing and then splitting up the invisible blocking part into several pieces.

    If you then parent the door parts to each other and open them in sequence, your entire door will only take up the height of each individual segment. It's a lot trickier than just making it go in another direction though. :)

    Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPmwWMDoGdA

    You could maybe even have all the door parts move at once and set the lip (how far the door retracts into the wall) so that they all end up in the same position when open. I'd recommend you trying it out with visible doors in a small test map first to make compile times on changes quicker.
     
  7. WilliumBobCole

    WilliumBobCole L1: Registered

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    I've set my func doors to move down for now, but I think I'll have a quick go at making the segmented doors, shouldn't be too difficult... If I set the lip to say 8, does that mean they will all be 8 units into the wall? or will I need to set them to 8+(number of units they start away from the top)?

    and I'm not too worried about compile times, the longest I've ever compiled a map was about 13 seconds on my L4D map, and TF2 5 seconds so far. Obviously that will go up once I've made my proper map, which I will start after trying this door thing (and my other questions, above, are answered. I have fixed the hud now, that was as simple as I thought, just sticking a comma after the first three and adding the last three after, now just need to know; how to make the blu doors locked during set up time, and making it recognise it as an attack/defend map, because obviously red team cannot cap so the welcome screen is misleading. Also I think Overtime is still broken, havent tested it again but I can't think of anything that I've changed since last time that could have affected it, tho I'm n00b so I may be wrong!)

    Thanks again =]

    edit: just re-read what lip actually does, now I understand, sorry! =P

    edit 2: nope overtime seems to work fine now. and in case I just dont like the way locked doors work on my map, how can I set capping to be disabled until setup time is over? Also, have made and tweaked the new sliding doors, I like them a lot, they open slightly faster than the prop door at the moment though, they're set at 500, with 7 segments, Not sure what speed to set the func_doors so they are in sync, but if you look sideways and strafe out the door as scout, you can see you are in the model for a split second and this bugs me slightly, other than that, theyre great and not too difficult to set up, its just remembering to change all the names, parents, and outputs that I may mess up but it should be easy to locate if i ever get it wrong.
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2011