Overcast Feedback Thread

[Katsu! :3]

I kind of hate steam's interface when it comes to giving feedback so I'm putting this here. The guy who made Overcast friended me and I had some thoughts on the layout so I'm gonna put em here and send this thread to him. This thread is open to people if you have some feedback about the map itself. (Do not turn this into a drama thread.)

One thing I will always preach amount mapping that you need to have different ways out of spawn. Giving people different spawn exits creates less potential for spam and spawn camping to happen, since you can get people coming at multiple angles and force ppl at spawn to have to split their attention. I feel like this map wanted that, but didn't really know how to do it, since the only spawn exits face the same angle and aren't really in a position where they require spam to go in different angles. I think having a door on this side of the building would be really helpful in that regard. I also think you could maybe have a window between the two initial spawn doors? It'd be able to prepare players better than not seeing outside.

I don't think I've ever really understood why this room was setup the way it is. There's so many odd staircases and weird little edges and it just doesn't really make for a cohesive-feeling area in my opinion. It's probably gonna sound harsh but I think a lot of this area needs to be retooled, starting with the main floor just being overall levelled and flat. I think the multiple heights really gets in the way of combat that goes on here and it makes the map frustrating to play. That can be done multiple ways mind you, either by setting the main height to be on the very bottom of the large floor, or by having this area be mostly level with the stair's height instead. I also don't really understand why there's a full health kit in this area, especially next to a shutter? In my opinion, that is just asking for players to be camped in this area, or a bit more boringly a sniper to be able to stay nice and cozy right there, which is just... well, boring. I also think the upper floor could stand to have a bit more substance, as I feel really precarious when standing there since the actual area I can walk on in this room is rather small. Maybe it's a little extreme, but I think it'd be okay to have a doorway where that grey computer panel is right there; it exits out into a sightline blocker anyway, and I feel that would make this area feel a little less... confined? Or, to be honest, maybe just making this building a little less spacious in favour of more outdoor area.

To add to my previous paragraph, you see what I mean about the map feeling restrictive? This area feels incredibly tight, and in my opinion I don't think that's very good for the map. It's a lot of blankness and a lot of, well, tightness that add to the feeling, it just feels a bit overbearing when I'm running around and trying to shoot people. You gotta remember that players want to hold forward, and holding forward here doesn't feel very good for the wrong reasons; It's not dangerous to be here, it's just unfun to be here. I also don't really know why there's water here? If it isn't really intrinsic to your map's theme, it shouldn't be there. It doesn't really add to the gameplay either. The staircases here are pretty awkward too, it all just feels really thin and off and I think you would really benefit from maybe adding a little bit of space here for everyone.

I really don't understand why there is a gap right here, it'd feel much better if this was just all ramp; rn it's awkward and doesn't feel great.



Will post more if I think about it.

 

[Entropy (She/Her)]

All spawndoors need a nobuild on them so teleporters can be put inside spawn. And BLU spawn vault doors need nobuild as well

Edit: Please, get rid of the high pitch noise on the TV on RED spawn. Is really overstimulating

 

[Katsu! :3]

Here's another instance of where the map really feels overly thin in my opinion, this weird walkway up to the door here just doesn't feel great and imho could stand to be removed or, well, made wider, into the building & the righthand wall n' stuff. This is a place where primary combat happens too so it's a little bit more worse than some other instances of these tiny walkways.

I think it would be okay to have some gaps in this large wall so that players could have some better vantage points over the Control Point area. It just feels, idk how to put it, like I can't really do anything when up here? Like walking space just for the sake of walking space, if that makes sense.

One thing I think Overcast does very, very well is that it focuses on making each side distinct. I never feel like I'm lost in a particular side of the map, and a lot of it honestly has to do with the lighting. It's very clear just from the difference in how warm and cool the bases look, and I think that's quite admirable.

Something that's gotta go is these weird displacements inside the stairs. They're really flatly textures and it just looks... wrong. Like idk how else to describe it other than "It genuinely does not look good and doesn't make sense."

 

[Prestige]

Main thing I would improve with layout changes is fixing the optimization at mid. Likely needs something else to be interior to block vvis, but I think the map is fun enough. Weird how spawn areas are so asym, I could spawncamp a little on reds side but not blu's.

 

[Midlou]

The general architecture of the map is pretty simple, which isn’t inherently a bad thing, but then there’s this prop spam to create an artificially “fully detailed” art pass. This, of course, comes from mappers who haven’t yet mastered the composition of the scenes they’re building. The lighting feels timid and unfocused in several spots, and in other areas, it’s poorly balanced, creating these light blotches on the walls that are unpleasant to look at.

The solutions to these issues can be pretty straightforward: for the lighting, change the setting of the lights to make them more focused and brighter in the right areas. Create some sort of lighting variation, without too much contrast, unless that's intentional. As for the overall artpass, reduce the prop spam and introduce small architectural variations to add subtle details that don’t distract the viewer. Often, a plain wall can become visually appealing with just a few simple shadows and details.

Here are some Ice Tower examples of what I mean:

Spoiler: Lighting changes example 1

Notice how the lighting changed from a "dim fullbright" to something much more focused. Before, the lamp was weak and diffuse, lighting the whole scene evenly. Now, the lamp is stronger and lights up the floor really well. The middle of the walls up to the ceiling is darker, but there’s enough light at player height to aid visibility. The added window with natural sky lighting makes the environment feel more pleasant while also expanding the scene’s lighting in a natural and believable way.

Notice how the sunlight coming from the window really makes use of the brick texture’s normal map. The wall itself is super simple, but the texture adds a sense of detail without messing with visibility

Spoiler: Artpass example 1

Before, the architecture was unrealistic, awkward, unbalanced, and had poor visibility. After the changes, the structure became straightforward, with simple walls at player height to improve visibility. Of course, there are infinite ways to approach this, I went with the simplest route, but you can always experiment and get creative with it.

Spoiler: Artpass example 2

Don’t clutter the horizon with buildings, and don’t be afraid to stretch out the landscape, it really helps make the scene feel more realistic and beautiful. It’s tempting and easy to box in the playable area with structures, but it’s even easier to expand the skybox further out. Just stretch some displacements with small cliffs and terrain variations, PLUS some trees and what not.

Spoiler: Artpass example 3

Here’s another example of architectural variation. Notice how the wooden building on the right was just a plain box with windows before. After the change, the box was split into smaller sections, with one side angled. The roofline against the sky also became a bit more varied

Well I hate to bring up one of my maps as an example again, it’s starting to feel like I’m pushing my way of mapping onto people, but I really think these simple adjustments can help a lot.

 

[Slowmotion Milk]

Regarding spawn:
Yeah that's a fair point. I was responsible for the layout and since it was my first time ever working with hammer, I obviously made tons of changes and over like 2 years I eventually ended with the final layout. What's funny is that since the very first version we actually had a side door and windows in spawn. Near the end of the layout making process we for some reason removed the side door, and when the detailer started detailing the map he just removed the windows outright. But I'm glad that you mentioned it, we will add both back.


Lobby floor leveling:
Yeah I see what you mean. I can't initially see anything wrong with raising the ground in lobby to make it level and I think it would improve the area. It has always been like this and I think I made it like this to add more height elements to the map since it was very flat at the early stages of development.

Although these ramps are used for rocket jumps so I don't wanna change them.

And the purpose of this is to block a sniper sightline.

Lobby healthpack:
The health pack is simply just for people who are playing in valley who are weak. Instead of having a medium healthpack that won't heal them fully which might make them go to spawn, we just wanted to make it easier for them and make it full. As for people camping there we haven't seen anything like that and I don't think anyone would play there anyways since very little happens there. As for sniper, there isn't a very useful sightline there so I don't think he would even play there.

Lobby top area:
We have that just to prevent camping outside of lobby. This was a problem during playtesting and we fixed it by having an exist with higher ground than the outside. That's really all it does.

Yard/water area:
I agree the area is very tight and I think a solution can be found in changing/removing this platform in some way.

As for why there is water, we thought it looked good and it also makes rocket jumps super amplified. If you do a rocket jump from the water and shoot off of the wall, you can fly super far and I think that's a very fun map element for soldiers.


Flank:
There was a very specific reason for the staircase to only take up half the area but I'm not sure I "exactly" remember why. I believe it has something to do with building in there, staying out of a sightline and maybe something to do with demo rollers being nerfed? I'm not sure, but I don't know if it's worth changing.


Valley:
Yes I see what you mean with the area being too tight. It was tighter before and we expanded it, but I think expanding it further would be beneficial since that area is very similar to the old cliff which we made very wide. I think the solution lies in retracting the walkway further back to allow more space in valley.

To add to that, maybe angling this staircase would help as well as it would make the area on the left slightly more spacious.

Bridge:
The bridge was made so people could cross from cliff to flank and vice versa without being seen. If I were to make a gap it would open a huge sniper sightline. It is just a walking area, but I'm afraid it would mess with the map balance if I changed it in any way.

 

[Slowmotion Milk]

Also I was working on a "pro" version of the map that fixes a lot of these issues.

Spawn:
Three doors, no window though.

Lobby:
This is the same but we got an extra door and a small healthpack.

Yard:
We made this area slightly larger by just extending that platform all the way over. This removes the water but this is also a competitive version and the water was too unfair in playtesting.

Valley:
I managed to add a lot more space by pushing the walkway back and angling the staircase. Idk if you would consider this enough though.

 

[Slowmotion Milk]

Ah yeah on the pro version i also extended this staircase

 

[Cass]

I think the clipping in these spots could be improved, I can see there's some clip brushes acting as stairs but that only gets rid of one of the three jumps.
On blu side, I honestly think the whole thing could just be clipped as a ramp, and on red side I think clipping the other two jumps with stairs would work well (although on red side they look much more like jumps so you could probably get away with not clipping them at all lol).