[WIP] cp_Hillside

Discussion in 'WIP (Work in Progress)' started by Zipok, Aug 29, 2008.

  1. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    A huge update to the thread. The thread is now useless due to myself uploading the map for downloads! Go and grab it, and bash it as much as you want, as long as your criticism is constructive. :)

    The map has been designed to with the competitive side of TF2 in mind, and thus should provide some nice matches with teams of six. And seeing that the layout would work out for competitive matches, it would also work on publics to some extent.

    Game type: Control Points
    Suggested teams: 6v6 - 10v10
    Completion: 80%
    Download link

    The future discussion about the map goes here


    MIDDLE CP AREA

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    SECOND CP AREA

    [​IMG][​IMG]

    The "Elevator":
    [​IMG][​IMG]

    The upper level:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Looking down and up:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    THE LAST CP & The map from above

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    NOM NOM NOM


    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2008
  2. samn

    samn L4: Comfortable Member

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    Map looks nice, would look fantastic if you put lighting in though.
     
  3. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    All of the older pictures I've posted, starting from the oldest. Keeping them here just to keep track on how the map has been developing :) EDITING THE THREAD ATM!

    ___________________________

    FIRST POST IMAGES:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

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    SECOND POST IMAGES:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

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    THIRD POST IMAGES:


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    ___________________________

    FOURTH & FIFTH POST IMAGES:


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    ___________________________

    SIXTH POST IMAGES:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2008
  4. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    Lights. Night too.

    Only one reply besides mine this far? Hopefully these new screenshots will get at least some comments out from you all. Especially I'd like to hear comments about the decision to make the map a night map. Personally, I like nighttime a lot because of the feeling and the atmosphere, therefore making a night map is kinda fitting for me :)

    Now the pictures. They are all from the middle point area, because that is the only region with lights so far.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
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    Still no proper 3d skybox, and I'm expecting that the scenery at the midpoint will be quite something after I've done that :) Comments please!
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2008
  5. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    Some more pictures.

    Added some fancy light effects to the middle CP area.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    The RED Base, second last capture point:
    [​IMG]
    The RED Supply / Spawnroom:
    [​IMG]

    Edit: No ceiling supports in the supplyroom picture, thats been added to the map after screenshotting.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2008
  6. luxatile

    aa luxatile deer

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    Man, lots of people are using night themes right now! It's fine in my opinion, though.

    I like how it looks, but maybe you should use the grass from Lumberyard instead? Also, the doors in the last pic you posted...yikes! They look a bit odd, mostly due to the huge frames I guess.
     
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  7. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    Long silence, but for a reason.

    I've been pretty quiet about the development of this map lately, and that has been because of both real life, and the fact that I decided to remake the second and first capture points. The door system was too complicated for a first-timer to realize.

    Now as I am happy with the layout, there is still the problem that you can reach both first and 2nd cp from the middle equally fast, but to fix that I made another door system that is easier to everyone to recognize, but it still alters the gameplay of the map in the way I want it to. One picture taken from hammer to show the first CP as it is now:

    [​IMG]
    The door with the hand painted on it is open until the other team takes the middle cap. Then it closes, and opens when the second cap is taken, or when the middle cap changes owners. This makes midpoint owners unable to reach the first point before the defender-controlled second, and you will also have to pass through the second cp room. With this the gameplay problems regarding this are fixed. This also makes the rush to the middle cap faster in the beginning.

    The layout has also been tested about how the rushes to the middle CP work with the usual 6v6 classes. Demomen are first with scouts, soldiers come soon after, then the medic, and then the heavy. Gonna make this map a viable choice for competitive gamers, as that side of the TF2 scene really needs more attention from both gamers and mappers. It just has huge potential that is overlooked by so many.

    Edit: Oh yes, the odd looking huge doors were removed.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2008
  8. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    Changes towards symmetry.

    More news, the map layout got changed, again! It is now 100% symmetric, and I again like the direction the map has taken. Only things I need now are lights to all areas, and a proper skybox. Here, take a look, some quickly snapped (low-quality) pictures for you. :)

    First CP, with lights:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
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    The stump was removed after taking these pics.

    Middle area:
    [​IMG] <-- Seems that here is a funny mistake that I failed to see while taking the pic, the lamp no longer floats in the air. :p
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]The map from above, in this pic you can clearly see which parts haven't been lighted up yet.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2008
  9. Galago

    Galago L2: Junior Member

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    It's coming along. I'm not one to critique, because I don't have much experience, but it looks good so far. I like that it's a night map. If I were you, I might add a few more props to make it a bit more exciting (barrels, containers, boxes, other junk, etc.)
     
  10. MangyCarface

    aa MangyCarface Mapper

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    Not a good choice to make it a night map. Sometimes, SOMETIMES it can work. But don't let your good brushwork go to waste out of a stubbornness to keep it dark. Recompile with regular goldrush or hydro skybox/lighting and note the difference. It really becomes apparent on high-end cards. At least give it a try and post some comparison screenshots.
     
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  11. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    I tried the map with daylight settings and the lumberyard skybox. No matter how I look at it, and how everyone who is a professional mapper gives me the advice to make it a daylight map, I can't. I like it much more with the night theme and thats what I'm gonna go for. :) If the map appears to be succesful, and people demand a daylight version, then perhaps. Just perhaps. But today, nay to day.

    Shame the lumberyard skybox (sky_trainyard_01) doesn't come with night colored alternative. It would be made of pure win.

    And to answer the request for props.. I'm thinking of something, will take a while until I come up with good enough detailwork without it interfering with the actual gameplay too much.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2008
  12. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    Spawnroom has some looks now.

    Another update. Small but important, often overlooked place that is actually the first thing the players will experience with your map, the spawnroom.

    Yes, I made the very first spawnroom a good looking one. :) Posting some low detail pictures for you.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2008
  13. Zipok

    Zipok L2: Junior Member

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    High Quality Pics!

    More mapping done, I'm on a vacation so you should be suspecting a beta version to appear sooner or later, in this case sooner I hope. But yes, the mapping. I realized that the second cap favored a heavyguy way too much. Opened it up to soldiers and demomen by adding another floor level. It still allows for a good team with HWG to excel just like a good team with two soldiers would. :)
    The way you can access the upper level as one of the non-jumper classes is pretty funny, a lot of air turbines that boost your way up like an elevator would. It is also pretty easy to understand, just go and walk on a platform :) The upper level is going to be nobuild btw. No easy campings there. Muhah.

    The "Elevator":
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    The upper level:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Looking down and up:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    NOM NOM NOM
    [​IMG]

    I think these were the first high-quality pictures I've posted to this thread btw. Some of the pics look kinda empty, and I'm outta ideas atm, any suggestions how to make the map look more interesting in some parts? Also, if someone knows of a model that looks like a huge ventilator and spins.. tell me. :p
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2008
  14. luxatile

    aa luxatile deer

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    Here's some feedback from the gameday test. Overall, I had a lot of fun - as people mentioned over and over again, it has great potential but it has a ton of issues too.

    - Many people complained about brushes being a bit off the grid. I didn't see it myself, but let's hope someone else brings it up.
    - I think there are too many doors. Makes it hard for spies to exit and enter areas cloaked, and it's always a good idea to let people get an idea of what's in the next room.
    - The final control point is hovering.

    [​IMG]
    A rope in the air.

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    What is this door's purpose? I never saw it open, but it seems like it should...

    [​IMG]
    All shadows are blue, which seems out of place.

    [​IMG]
    I think I remember jumping up here in the previous version, but I can't do it. Or maybe I'm wrong. Either way, this stack of kegs really wants me to use it as a staircase, so you should probably remove it make it have a purpose.
     
  15. TheDarkerSideofYourShadow

    TheDarkerSideofYourShadow L10: Glamorous Member

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    Okay, I actually like the way this map flows. I can agree with the comment about there being so many doors. There also were plenty of cases where brushes don't line up (some actually seemed to just have been placed on top of another brush, like the hazard stripe around the 2nd/4th cp). Here are some screen shots I took.

    [​IMG]


    Make these the TF2 looking logs, rather than the HL2 looking ones.
    [​IMG]


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    Please put a diagonal noclip on these stairs, to make it smoother.
    [​IMG]


    There are several other cases of things not being aligned correctly (including the floating CP bases), but these are all the pictures I could find.
     
  16. laghlagh

    laghlagh L6: Sharp Member

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    I really enjoyed struggling over the middle point, wich I found very well made. I would however make this into a 3-cp if I was you. Trying to get the 4th cap wasn't nearly as interesting, and when I played, the last capture seemed un-interesting in terms of gameplay. I'd make a final 3rd cap with more ways to it. Sorry if i'm just rambling like a hobo, I'm tired.
     
  17. bob+M|M+

    bob+M|M+ L6: Sharp Member

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    Fun map, really enjoyed it today. I think the map is a little too dark, not in terms of lack of lighting, but just the light_environment itself.

    These doors seemed to always be closed. Several times I walked up this path only to be blocked by the door :(
    [​IMG]

    Some issues with false pathways like this door here that gives the illusion of a real door
    [​IMG]


    Again, maybe use a different texture than door texture
    [​IMG]


    This door right here and the surrounding area gives a strong impression that you can walk through the door, despite the no entree sign.
    [​IMG]

    bob+M|M+
     
  18. Dox

    Dox L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

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    I had the same frustrations, almost all the doors were closed all the time so there was basically one way in or out of the bases.
     
  19. Aragon

    Aragon L1: Registered

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    Well we tested this map out in one of our custom pugs and it was alright. Some ideas to make it better for competive play.

    It feels like a box, very similar to labor.
    The last point is seems fine but there is never actually a chance to defend as normally the team that rolls second follows on.
    Otherwise the defensive team push's back just as fast.
    The game is very slow. And rebounds regularly where a team should be able to push onto the last. For example if you kill everyone in the middle and your team push's on you should have an advantage. Alot of these advantages can be achieved by resp awn times. The attacking team has a ridiculously long re spawn time once reaching the last point and makes it difficult to organize a push and then you get pushed back. This map has a well style of game play but as massive emphasis of it. Where in well if you attack middle and win depending on the outcome the defensive team will either drop some players and setup on second for a defense or they will drop to final and setup.
    When the attacking team then goes for second point and they start killing players eventually all the players go down after awhile. But in well you have time to regroup for another attack and you can defend the point easily. This way you can get ready for another push.
    This is where this map fails at. The defending team can really easily push in after they lose the second point and kill the 3-4 or how many people are left as the respawn times and the way the point is setup don't allow for a easy defence. Then the team pushs on and caps the middle while the attacking team is trying to stop them. Now the attacking team is the defensive team and it all starts over again. It turns into a massive ping pong where only wins occur when scouts go on to back cap making the final point nearly useless.

    The middle is fine but second and last need adjustments before this map would be considered for competitive play.

    About MAP:
    Lot of random doors in places that don't go anywhere.
    The night skybox works well i believe as its not too dark.

    Anyways that's my rant and i thought i throw my two bobs in as the concept of the map is nice and i would love to see the map come a competitive map but there is a lot of issues needing to be fixed first otherwise it will come another custom map which barely gets played competivly.