Tips for a vertically oriented A/D map?

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Nanoworlder, Sep 5, 2012.

  1. Nanoworlder

    Nanoworlder L1: Registered

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    I've been thinking of creating an A/D map with a subterranean theme.

    Forward for BLU in this case is downward. Each second point of each stage is on a lower tier than the previous and each successive stage is usually lower than the previous one.

    While this thread may have helped in general A/D mapmaking, I wonder if anyone has tips for a an A/D map where the action generally travels downward instead of in the usual space filling curve.
     
  2. Tarry H Sruman

    Tarry H Sruman Large Orphanage Proprietor

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    The inherent problem with having the map get progressively lower is that the attackers have a constant height advantage.
     
  3. Nanoworlder

    Nanoworlder L1: Registered

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    What if I make two tiers/plateaus on each stage connected by tunnels and the second tier of the previous stage and the first tier of the current stage overlap?

    This should confine that high ground issue to the tunnel connecting the tiers.
     
  4. fubarFX

    aa fubarFX The "raw" in "nodraw"

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    tip #1: don't make vertical maps unless pl_rainbowride
     
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  5. Nanoworlder

    Nanoworlder L1: Registered

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    That doesn't sound very encouraging. :mellow:
     
  6. tyler

    aa tyler snail prince, master of a ruined tower

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    If I had a nickel for every time someone proposed this or tried and failed, I'd probably have close to twenty big ones.
     
  7. Nanoworlder

    Nanoworlder L1: Registered

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    Well I do it anyway.

    Just got to keep most of the fighting on the flat tiers. Although, the inter-tier tunnels will have a very high chance of becoming chokepoints.
     
  8. tyler

    aa tyler snail prince, master of a ruined tower

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    You might first want to read these guideline threads for ideas on how vertical space works in TF2:
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=18699
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=14943
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=12605

    Then you might want to look at these maps that tried extreme vertical space before you and try to examine why they never went anywhere/no one liked them:
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?p=259590
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=19809
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=16748
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=19919
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=19596
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=19734
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=19262
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=19112
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=19090
    http://forums.tf2maps.net/showthread.php?t=6113

    Some of these maps also attempt chokey halls between tiers.

    (This is only in the past few months, I got bored. I also didn't bother linking the ones where the mapper blanked the screenshots and left quietly after we told them their idea was bad. I also didn't go to FPSBanana, which is chock full of them.)

    When you can solve all the problems enumerated in the guides and discovered by these mappers, you can make your map. Hint: it's all fundamentally the same problem. Believe us if you want, or don't. Up to you. I'd be more inclined to take our word for it and not make a several tiered map full of chokey hallways, but hey, I've only been testing maps on a daily basis for like three years, what do I know?
     
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  9. Sergis

    aa Sergis L666: ])oo]v[

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    tip #2: if you do make one, expect it to be hated here just because.
     
  10. Nanoworlder

    Nanoworlder L1: Registered

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    Ok ok sorry.

    I don't mean to be disrespectful and I am aware of the issues, but I'm still going to try it because, hey, may be it might work better than the previous ones.
     
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  11. fubarFX

    aa fubarFX The "raw" in "nodraw"

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    consider this, do you know why our eyes are set on both sides of our head and not on top of each other? because we evolved in a horizontal world, not vertical. that's also how our brains work and as a results, humans don't look up ever. what I'm getting at is, chances are your layout will not be intuitive. people will tell you that vertical combat is what makes a map fun but even with a lot of verticality, tf2 is still vastly horizontal.
     
  12. Wander

    Wander L3: Member

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    Go for it

    The only way to learn what does and doesn't work in mapping is by trying it out, and failing many times over and over
    Not by by listening to a bunch of people who tell you what does and doesn't work (no matter if they're right or not)


    (I felt this post was needed after so many creativity-killers telling you how horrible it will be)
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2012
  13. Faux Rhinoceros

    aa Faux Rhinoceros Also known as Dr. Element

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    We do have a pretty bad habbit of tearing everything apart. Hell, our unofficial interpretation of quality is much, much harsher than VALVe's.

    I say go for it, but don't get too caught up in the idea that it should be vertical all the time. Do what works, and try to keep the verticality as much in focus as possible while doing so.
     
  14. tyler

    aa tyler snail prince, master of a ruined tower

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    Alright, but be aware that's what each of those mappers thought before you. There's a reason you don't see very many outstanding custom maps like this, that's all I'm saying. I'd focus on pinning down core TF2 gameplay, not innovating against all odds for a game you haven't mapped for.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 6, 2012
  15. Nanoworlder

    Nanoworlder L1: Registered

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    In case things don't work out like many before me, I could just give an illusion of going deeper.

    Each stage has a different cliff texture, with elevators at the beginning and end of each stage.
     
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