Things you should know about TF2 workshop, nav files and problems that they cause

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by ics, Oct 19, 2015.

  1. ics

    aa ics http://ics-base.net

    Messages:
    706
    Positive Ratings:
    432
    EDIT - THIS IS OBSOLETE INFORMATION. VALVE HAS FIXED THE NAV EMBEDDING IN THE HALLOWEEN UPDATE 2015. NAV FILES NOW LOAD CORRECTLY WITHIN BSP.

    This week i had very enlightening experience with the workshop and nav files. I'm sharing this because i want to avoid anyone going through the same thing i did. Here's what i figured out and sorry if it's old news for some.

    TF2 workshop doesn't like nav files. They simply will never load up from the bsp correctly (getting back to this part lower). This causes bots not to move or boss enemies, such as HHH and monoculus never actually leaves. So, to avoid further bloodshed, never pack nav files to the bsp when you upload your map to workshop. Always share the .nav file separately. Here's why:

    - If player subscribes to a map, starts it up with map workshop/mapIDhere - the map will load up fine but again, the bots won't move as the nav is completely ignored, even if it's packed inside the bsp file. This will only cause further harm if player does the next step, trying to fix it or someone tells him to do it.

    - If player has subscribed and decides to to take the map off from STEAM\SteamApps\workshop\mapIDhere - then places it to STEAM\SteamApps\common\Team Fortress 2\tf\maps and starts the map with map mapfilename.bsp - the map will cause players game to crash. This may not happen if there was no nav packed in within the bsp.

    - Player can fix this crash by placing separate .nav file to STEAM\SteamApps\common\Team Fortress 2\tf\maps and even the workshop map will load up fine. Though if the map is executed through map workshop/mapIDhere, this nav is still ignored.

    There is no way to have a functional map file with bots working uploaded to workshop.

    If you ship a map with bots or boss enemies and navigation file is needed, just don't pack nav into the workshop version of the map, share it separately. It won't work anyway if you do pack it, and will cause a crash if player tries to load the map up outside workshop commands (map workshop/mapIDhere)
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 8
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2015
  2. Egan

    aa Egan

    Messages:
    1,318
    Positive Ratings:
    1,512
    Precise and colorful, thanks. I've been asked a few times and I told them it was fine (cause it works not in the workshop)! But now I know.
     
  3. ics

    aa ics http://ics-base.net

    Messages:
    706
    Positive Ratings:
    432
    Yes, the nav file within the bsp corrupts during upload to workshop and if the file is used outside workshop, it will cause issues on loading it.
     
  4. worMatty

    aa worMatty Repacking Evangelist

    Messages:
    1,072
    Positive Ratings:
    836
    When you submit a map to the Workshop, it's put through bsp_repack before it's uploaded. I've manually repacked a map that contains a .nav file with bsp_repack and the nav file has worked fine. I am sceptical that the Workshop submission process causes .nav files to corrupt.

    I keep a list of packed files that don't currently work in this post. If ever you find new information about Workshop maps, I'd be grateful if you posted it in the thread so I can keep the post up to date.
     
  5. ics

    aa ics http://ics-base.net

    Messages:
    706
    Positive Ratings:
    432
    What else can it be that corrupts the map than workshop uploading (or automatic packing beforehand by the same process)? Nothing.

    After map models and textures have been loaded, players game initiates the gamemode specific data. In this case it was 5 payload points. After that, the map file borks with these 5 lines:

    Code:
    Unknown NavArea sub-version number
    Degenerate Navigation Area #0 at setpos -4173.7 -10287.5 2187.5
    Unknown NavArea sub-version number
    Degenerate Navigation Area #0 at setpos -1.93124e-019 -1.07907e-038 -5.42103e-020
    Unknown NavArea sub-version number
    The first cords are inside the skybox brush, the second makes no sense. It's 100% the nav in the bsp that messes everything up. Thing is, if there is a separate nav, even though the nav packed in the bsp is present, map works fine. The game looks for separate nav first and then the one in bsp. It used to be different back in CS Source.
     
  6. ics

    aa ics http://ics-base.net

    Messages:
    706
    Positive Ratings:
    432
    Forgot to post this and i updated the 1st post also. Valve did fix this nav not loading in the workshop in the scream fortress 7 halloween update. There just wasn't any mention about it in the update notes.

    Perhaps someone could check if sounbdscapes also load correctly now? I can do it, but it takes time untill i have something to ship in to the workshop.
     
  7. worMatty

    aa worMatty Repacking Evangelist

    Messages:
    1,072
    Positive Ratings:
    836
    They do not. But a Valve employee came in to chat and told us that it's on the list of things to do.