payload track "dynamic event" (i.e. barnblitz & hightower)?

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by kinggambit, Nov 2, 2013.

  1. kinggambit

    kinggambit L1: Registered

    Messages:
    17
    Positive Ratings:
    2
    I'm trying to create dynamic payload events such as the rotating track in pl_barnblitz or the elevating track in plr_hightower (except these events are controlled by some cap point).

    There isn't much out there on this and I'm fairly new to all the entities and logic; Though I'm looking through plr_hightower and pl_barnblitz, I'm a bit overwhelmed at where to start.

    If someone experienced could suggest a plan of attack for me to take, I'd appreciate it a lot!

    There are 3 scenarios that vary slightly:

    Stage 1- Independent CP lifts a drawbridge needed to push the cart
    [​IMG]

    Stage 2- Independent CP will push the cart up a spiralling track that is inaccessible to players
    [​IMG]

    Stage 3- Payload CP will lift and rotate the track and cart upward (essentially the same as hightower's elevators)
    [​IMG]''

    My general plan so far:
    1. lock cart at certain path_track
    2. Associate the CP (and capture areas) to the bridge (or cart in Stage 2); apply "downhill cart" effect
    3. upon capture, the path_track is unlocked and the prop/bridge will be locked into place.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2013
  2. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

    Messages:
    4,769
    Positive Ratings:
    5,535
    You basically have the idea of it.

    1: very easy. just use the enable/disable inputs on the paths to prevent the cart from moving across the gap until the bridge is raised via whatever means, then enable the path.

    2: similarly easy. when the cart reaches that path you can stop players from moving it by disabling the capture zone on the cart, then send movement inputs once they take the CP. When it reaches the end path, stop the cart and enable the capture zone again.

    3: eurgh. cart elevators are a massive pain to get working smoothly. even moreso if it is a mid-route elevator and not a single change (like hightower). If you're new at this I'd honestly recommend holding off on that and redesigning the area unless you are willing to pull out your hair a few times.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  3. kinggambit

    kinggambit L1: Registered

    Messages:
    17
    Positive Ratings:
    2
    :eek:hmy: bummer. Well, I guess I could just make it simpler by having the cart enter a closed-off "elevator" and teleport it up to a new path track.

    Maybe it'll work out for the best just re-blocking though. The area in question is a really vertically oriented which might be hard to balance anyway (defending red soldiers and demos at the top too strong, Blu reinforcing the CP while the elevator is already half way up, etc.)

    We'll see. At the very least, I want to get Stage 1 and 2 functional to see if this style would even succeed. Thanks Snark! I'll repost on this thread once I've gotten it to work hopefully.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2013
  4. henke37

    aa henke37

    Messages:
    1,944
    Positive Ratings:
    460
    I don't think it is a good idea to disable track points. Not only is it risking crashes if the cart reaches that spot, but it also breaks overtime.
     
  5. UKCS-Alias

    aa UKCS-Alias Mann vs Machine... or... Mapper vs Meta?

    Messages:
    1,264
    Positive Ratings:
    749
    For rollbacks it works fine at least so im not sure at the crashing part. Note that disabled doesnt mean they are fully disconnected. It just tells the cart to stop there (and if that crashes valve did some bad work there).

    For elevators i dont realy think there is a major problem as long as you know what to do. If you dont even have an idea of the entity work its not a good idea to try it.

    Also, to connect the path to the elevator just disable the control point from deciding the speed. Just manualy control the cart similar to the cross sections. Once its good give the control back to the control point (and this also is the moment you can prevent it from rotating). The same can be done at the end, make the cart manualy roll off and give control back afterward. And it doesnt actualy have to physicaly roll off, A few units in distance would do enough (just 1 unit for example).
     
  6. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

    Messages:
    4,769
    Positive Ratings:
    5,535
    Have you tried making one? :bored: I've made a few for mine own purposes and I've helped two other people with them in their maps and while I'm one of the most entity-minded people around (pardon me, not meaning to sound full of myself) I have a heck of a time making them glitch-free while accounting for all hiccups and situations without any visual disconnections.

    However, the less the elevator does, the easier it is to make. Hightower (despite being massively complex entities in that map) is relatively easy because you have only a single event to handle. Change to elevator mechanics; Done.
    Will the elevator recede if unattended (rather than automatic)? Will the cart back off the elevator once on it? Can players get under the elevator? Each new case creates more problems.
     
  7. Fish 2.0

    Fish 2.0 L6: Sharp Member

    Messages:
    324
    Positive Ratings:
    116
    This is too good. I can't help but think how good this would look if you made like supports for a spiraling hallway that sit above the track and have the cart go underneath with doors on either side. That's a great design and I think players will get the point.

    Technically I have no idea, glhf
     
  8. kinggambit

    kinggambit L1: Registered

    Messages:
    17
    Positive Ratings:
    2
    Hi guys, so I made the bridge a func_tracktrain that moves up a path_track. I created a train_watcher to link that to the capture area/CP.

    I'm sure I messed up some of the logic but this is what happened:

    1. Everything is fine for capping the payload CP 1. However, that doesn't activate the bridge CP's capture area (well, it might but there isn't anything to confirm it).
    2. On map spawn, the bridge (func_tracktrain) will automatically start moving upward.

    Here are pics of the various entities' I/O involved:
    http://imgur.com/a/OiUrW#6ZY9VZ7

    I honestly don't know what is going wrong. Everything seems to be logically sound when I look at it. If someone could take a look at the pics and suggest something, I'd be vurry grateful!
     
  9. Little Dude

    Little Dude L4: Comfortable Member

    Messages:
    172
    Positive Ratings:
    54
    For the bridge you could take a look at Thundermountain's first cp in the first area. There is a bridge that moves up once the capture point is controlled by blu and allows the cart to progress.
     
  10. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

    Messages:
    4,769
    Positive Ratings:
    5,535
    You shouldn't even need to make it a train, and definitely not with a watcher. Just make the bridge a func_door and trigger it when the CP is captured.

    Assuming you want the CP to be capturable before the cart stops at the gap:
    Make a "cartstop" relay that disables the cart's capture zone.
    Have the last path before the gap trigger that relay (with fire once ticked).
    When the bridge-control CP is captured, enable the cart's capture zone (with appropriate delay to allow for the bridge to rise) and kill the cartstop relay.
     
  11. kinggambit

    kinggambit L1: Registered

    Messages:
    17
    Positive Ratings:
    2
    Whoops, sorry, I should've clarified. I want the CP to update the drawbridge in real time (like in hightower's elevator where the platform moves so long as there are players on the cap point). Is this too hard to achieve? thundermountain's first stage has a similar bridge train except it seems to be automatically set forward by capping the CP (rather than having to cap another point).

    I want the bridge CP to be enabled sequentially, after the cart is pushed to the first CP. I think it'd be too confusing for many players to have two simultaneous objectives (i.e. gravelpit, standin, steel)
     
  12. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

    Messages:
    4,769
    Positive Ratings:
    5,535
    Ok, well in that case, you still shouldn't need to "connect" the two together with logic like you have. Just set up the bridge like a separate train and enable/disable the respective capture zones when needed.

    After the first CP is sensible, but that was more directed at the bridge itself. If players would HAVE to move it to the bridge before the CP unlocks to raise it, it could be simpler. But now that I see how close the bridge is to the first CP, that would be a little silly so what I said is probably the better way to go about that part of it.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  13. kinggambit

    kinggambit L1: Registered

    Messages:
    17
    Positive Ratings:
    2
    Sure, ya I'll try it your way. I'm shooting blind anyway on the balance and flow of the level.

    The only design issue now though is that I think I have to scrap Red's inital spawn. The pic shows the opposite view of the bridge.
    [​IMG]
    Currently, capping CP 1 will move Red back to another respawn room (since the draw bridge's initial (lowered) position acts as the exit route for Red's spawn). Blu then would have to cap the bridge CP for a long time which gives Red a chance to stop Blu (Blu would "defend" the cap point like in gravelpit's A/B CPs)

    So I think I'll have to either 1. remove Red's initial spawn or 2. move CP 1 further forward in the track/move blu spawn back.

    Here's an overview of Stage 1 so you guys get a better understanding:
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2013
  14. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

    Messages:
    4,769
    Positive Ratings:
    5,535
    I'm not saying you need to allow CP2 to begin capture before CP1 is owned. It was the CP2/bridge relationship. My point is: if the bridge is not up the cart must stop and wait when it arrives. You basically have two options on how that event relates to CP2.
    1: when the cart arrives, it is stopped and CP2 is unlocked (easy).
    2: you can start capping CP2 before the cart arrives, in which case you need to perform a check when the cart arrives to see if the bridge is available or not.

    2 is the situation I outlined, using the relay as the "check" function. If CP2 has not been taken, the relay is fired and disables the cart. If CP2 has been taken, the relay is removed so the cart is not stopped.