New Map Style idea - Campaign Maps

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Aki, Aug 2, 2011.

  1. Aki

    Aki L4: Comfortable Member

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    Campaign is a mixed objective game mode in at least three stages. It is like cp_dustbowl in that there are multiple stages, but unlike Dustbowl each stage has a different objective type. The sequence of objective types loosely make sense, but as a game mode campaign doesn't require any specific order or objectives.

    To prevent player overload though there is only one objective per stage.

    For example consider
    Stage 1: Teams are in opposing forts and must steal enough intelligence to learn where the opponent's main base is at (CTF, 3 caps)
    Stage 2: Gain access to their base and the bomb warehouse (CP map, 2 CP's)
    Stage 3: Destroy their base (Payload).

    Stage 1 establishes who will be attacker for stage 2 and 3. If the defender wins stage 2 or 3 the campaign returns to stage 1.

    This is only one idea. Thoughts?
     
  2. Yacan1

    aa Yacan1 D I G I T A L I N F L U E N C E R

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    I like it, this made require some in-depth study on how gamers would feel about a single player (I assume it is) for a multiplayer game. The idea seems good enough
     
  3. Aki

    Aki L4: Comfortable Member

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    No, not single player. Once teams are set scrambling doesn't occur until the campaign is finished with one team winning and the other losing.

    Where did you get the idea this would be single player???
     
  4. Jethro

    Jethro MUSty Complainer

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    Maps bug out if you try and include all three objective-types in one map.
     
  5. Sergis

    aa Sergis L666: ])oo]v[

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    so basically a map containing 3 gametypes. i think unless maps story is very obvious, it'll just confuse people because afaik so far, every one map has one gametype.
     
  6. Randdalf

    aa Randdalf

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    It's certainly possible, but whether it'd work, I don't know.
     
  7. Aki

    Aki L4: Comfortable Member

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    NO!

    Sheesh, I must not be communicating clearly here.

    First - READ THE DESCRIPTION OF DUSTBOWL.

    Now Dustbowl just happens to be the ancestor of this type of map. It is a 3 stage map.

    Multistage maps already exist - this is not a new concept....

    Now... one day while playing Dustbowl I wondered, why do we have to do Attack/Defend CP on all three stages?? Answer - we don't.


    That's where this map style comes into play. In a given stage there is ONE GOAL ONLY.

    Let me repeat that for some of you with reading comprehension problems...

    Each stage has only ONE GOAL!!

    The change up from Dustbowl is the goal changes with the stage.

    Players are NOT being asked to pursue multiple goals at the same time. That's just a confusion headache waiting to happen. Instead they have one goal per stage, and more than one stage.

    Is this clear now??
     
  8. Yacan1

    aa Yacan1 D I G I T A L I N F L U E N C E R

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    well, most video games these days, with campaign mode are single player, story line and plot are more effective when they are directed to one person. Single player gives more of an importance to the game's mission than having multiple people. I would think that with multiplayer, some people would be able to finish a task more quick than others on a team.
     
  9. jpr

    aa jpr

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    Why have one giant map with many different objectives when you could have several smaller maps?

    AKA what we have now
     
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  10. Ravidge

    aa Ravidge Grand Vizier

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    The game hud can not be changed dynamically.

    If you start with a CTF hud, it will remain a CTF hud. Even if you're pushing a cart or capping control points.
    You get 1 hud choice per map, you can not switch it between stages.
     
  11. Aki

    Aki L4: Comfortable Member

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    Ok, this I can understand. The question then becomes, how difficult would it be for valve to change this limitation to allow each stage to have it's own HUD?
     
  12. Icarus

    aa Icarus

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    I think a better question would be, how difficult would it be to convince valve to change this limitation for you?

    Answer: Good Luck!

    The idea itself is fine, though. If you want an example, Brink does this for all of their maps and it works well. You'll just need a way to show players what the new Objective is aside from a change in HUD.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2011
  13. Aki

    Aki L4: Comfortable Member

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    The map can be built without a HUD. That would be a requirement - I don't see them putting any effort into it before that occurs.

    The second issue then becomes, how difficult would that change to the code be? The difficulty of the change will be the primary determinant on whether they will make the change. They've made changes to the game at the request of the community before (Neutral flags for example).
     
  14. Kill_the_Bug

    Kill_the_Bug L14: Epic Member

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    I like the idea of you map but again the coding is hard and not sure if it will work.

    On my map - about to be tested/released - I have combined a PL with a CTF but the trainwatcher stays on the display although you are now playing a CTF map style of game - once the item is captured the game returns to the pl mode.

    I think what might work best for you is a sven co-op stlye of gameplay.

    I don't know if you've ever played it but it's a mod for half-life.

    Basically you play the game and do certain levels to the map to find out puzzles, kill certain monsters, when you've done everything you need to do the next stage of the map loads automatically.

    You might be able to code the game to do an automatic loading of the next map in the cycle but each map in the cycle would have it's destinct game play style and then at the last stage you would code it on map win switch teams. Defenders would start as defenders and attackers as attackers all through the 3 map.
     
  15. gamemaster1996

    gamemaster1996 L13: Stunning Member

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    I like the idea but it's going to be very difficult to make it work.

    Also, just a idea ill throw out there, intro cutscenes?
     
  16. Lancey

    aa Lancey Currently On: ?????

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    I'd like to point out that this isn't actually possible. You can't just decide to change gamemodes whenever you want.
     
  17. Aliensoldier

    Aliensoldier L1: Registered

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    Sounds pretty nice for me :)
    But as the others already said, it could be a bit difficult to bring something like that on 1 map...
    But, don't ya think it could work when you enable the other entities first when another round starts?
    For example:
    1st round is CTF, when that round is done kill all CTF items and then enable all CP items (maybe with a point_template)
     
  18. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    Pretty much this. Your limitation is that you have to assign a game master entity. That entity cannot be changed, even between rounds. A CTF map will remain a CTF map, a CP map will remain CP and PL, PL.

    The largest problem people have with TF2 with regards to customisation is the fact that Valve have hard coded large portions of the game which results in fixed game modes. Any significant changes to game modes requires cooperation on Valve's part to code in additional parameters. Such as when we introduced the old school A/D-CTF game mode during an official contest and they allowed us to implement a custom HUD.

    If you want this kind of thing you'll need to cooperate with Valve and get them to code in these features, but it's highly unlikely that'll be the case.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2011
  19. Tarry H Sruman

    Tarry H Sruman Large Orphanage Proprietor

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    So essentially what they tried to do with Brink?