need some ideas

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Sean of the Dead, Jan 26, 2008.

  1. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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    i'm gonna try and make a jump map. but, i'm fresh out of ideas. so for ppl who have played on a jump map, what do u think i should do?

    oh, and youme, u better not say that jump maps suck and will ruin TF2.
     
  2. Keir

    Keir Guest

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    wtf is a jump map, and why have I never seen one in TF2?
     
  3. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=jump+map&search=Search
    ^^ because they are not any bit good.

    I think we are all going to give up on trying to tell you all jump/surf maps are *shakes head* Just... *shakes head*

    Urgh...
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2008
  4. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2008
  5. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    stupid opinions..... I think you'll find those "stupid opinions" are the opinions of the masses, so carefull what you say
     
  6. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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    if everyone hates surf and jump maps, then why do so many ppl play them???
     
  7. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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  8. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    First a warning, please watch personal attacks and language.

    I never said they were tf2 maps man, Kier wanted to know what a jump map was, so i linked him.

    as far as a real reason i dont know... It just feels like a horrible idea for TF2 type of gameplay
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2008
  9. Shmitz

    aa Shmitz Old Hat

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    Why would anyone make something like that for a multiplayer game? Square peg, round hole. If you want to make something with jumping puzzles, do it for HL2.
     
  10. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    ^^ or Portal =)
     
  11. DrHaphazard

    DrHaphazard L5: Dapper Member

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    Oh come on guys theres no need to be asses about it. Clearly its not your style, and its frankly not mine either, but if he wants to do it then let him do it. If people really dont want to play the map then they wont play it, he'll realize it and move on to something else. Yall certainly dont need to be helpful, but ya dont need to do anything but ignore him either.

    Again this is not my style, but I think its totally unfair to complain about some of the limitations in TF2 mapping and then try to impose limitations on how others can make their TF2 maps. There's few enough people who are willing to put in effort and time to learn how to map and even if you dont feel they should be encouraged, I don't understand why you would feel compelled to discourage them either.

    In any case...map idea:

    I kinda liked the idea i saw on another thread of having two courses set right next to eachother with a glass wall in between, so the two sides can see eachothers progress.

    I also liked the idea of trying to force people to play as different classes. For example the first jump has a low ceiling so that only a scout can make it because soldiers and demos would hit their heads and fall. Then have the next jump require heigth so the player needs to switch to demo (would need to put a spawnroom brush there so they can change and some kinda prompt.)

    I dunno how you would incorporate other types of jumps though. If we could filter different weapon damage you could have items that only certains weapons can break so taht youd have to change to that class beforehand. So you could one for the engineer that requires the wrench to break.

    The only thing similar right now is to use the OnIgnite thing to force people to be a pyro.

    Anyways the basic idea would be to have cap points a long the way. Capping the point opens the next stage up. The more people from each team reach the point the faster it opens and the faster you can advance. That way just having one really good person isnt enough for a team, you need several people to make hte jump with you or youll lose time.
     
  12. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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    horrible idea? valve put in rocket and sticky jumps in for a reason, so people could get higher than normal. then, mappers noticed this, and designed maps that the principle idea is to use rocket and sticky jumps, to get to higher places.
     
  13. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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    although the first paragraph is questionable, thank you for actually sticking on topic! :thumbup: i like the idea of cap points on the way up, instead of just at the top. i could do something like when u cap a point, the ceiling above u (which could be like a func_door that never returns after opened) would move to the side so u could get thru and on to the next cp.
     
  14. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    what would be the point on caps half way up? one team can take them once they get up there but they have zero chance of defending it once the enemy team beat them off the center CP.
    If you HAVE to make a jump map make it more pyramidal than vertical. make a normalTF2 map layout and then raise it every few meters so that you have to rocket/demo jump up. so It's a shallow incline rather than a vertical column. This will make cap points more defendable and will make sure that n00bs(your average player who plays every now and then for fun but isn't terrible at the game) and expert jumpers(spotty geeks with no lives or lovelife) can play together and have a balanced game

    now, back to my rant:

    I've played on a few jump maps on TF2 and they are all horrible, no lights, repeated HL2 textures, awefull pain in my fingers, especially my little finger which presses ctrl for crouch jumps.
    IF you can texture it nicely
    IF you can add nice lighting
    IF you can add detailed brushwork
    IF you can add props and style it so it looks like it could exist IRL (like CP_well actually feels like a trainstation, not just a room with trains going through it)
    IF you can make a balanced game that can be won after pushing back from the brink of defeat
    IF you can make it so that all the jumps don't require crouches
    IF you can pass it off as a normal map (add a really long alternative route for other classes)
    THEN I might be nice to you
    UNTIL THEN read mine and snipergen's sigs for more info.
     
  15. DrHaphazard

    DrHaphazard L5: Dapper Member

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    I am the king of questionable comments.

    Sorry I guess I should be more clear. My map idea, to add to the awfulness of it, would be a race instead of a fight. As I stated capping the cp would also open a door or whatever to allow you into the next area, so you would pretty much have to take it. Also you would make it a long cap for only 1 or 2 people, but a fast cap when you got more, so that it rewards entire teams that do well instead of having just one guy who can blaze thru the course.

    I just wanted to add that you could also have penalties for failing to make a jump, like death or a long run back. Then you could also have the control points be like check points, so that as soon as it is capped your spawn moves forward.

    I am not sure how you would add a fighting element to such a map though, which is why I personally dislike these maps. They are a good way to master jumping skills however.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2008
  16. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    pfft no penalties for falling exclude novices which makes the map much less enjoyable. but having CPs as a checkpoint is a good idea, maybe you should have a one way layer every few jumps so you can't fall all the way down? (obviously these would only apply to the team who's side it is otherwise the other team can't cap their CPs
     
  17. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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    i like that, and it would be cool to put in. just if u could tell me how to enable and disable a respawn room. xD
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2008
  18. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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    OMGWTFBBQ!!! youme actually helped! that is a good idea though, but i dont know how to do one way brushes. care to enlighten me? but the problem w/ that is that jump maps are all about skill. if u have no skill, u fall a lot, but if u have good aiming and jumping skills, u can make it all the way up without falling once. the fun part is getting better at it :p
     
  19. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    sorry? is that not help?

    If you wan't a one way brush, make a trigger_push and then set the flags to clients and the filter to one specific team, simple. If you listened to the dev commentaries in TF2 you will know that skill differences is something that they tried to remove from the game, so that newbies and vets could play together and enjoy the game.
    A new commer to jump maps probably isnt going to find them amazingly fun because it requires so much skill in something you don't really need for the normal game
    (I just gotta balance out my helpful/hateful ratio some how!)
     
  20. Sean of the Dead

    Sean of the Dead L3: Member

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    :p i changed my post after i read that xD

    it took me only a couple hours to finally get to the top of a map, and i never even thought of giving up, even after falling a million times in a row (not really a million, more like 5 or 10, but w/e xD) after u learn how to play jump maps, it gets a lot more fun :D