Is it possible to switch the teams around on Attack/Defense?

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Simski, Aug 13, 2010.

  1. Simski

    Simski L2: Junior Member

    Messages:
    57
    Positive Ratings:
    11
    I am sadly know very little of mapping myself, but I'm asking because I have a very talented mapping friend that thought that this might not be possible.

    Basically, I'm wondering if the attack/defend gamemode for maps like dustbowl, gravelpit, and gorge... can have the teams switched around so that Red will be the attacking team, and Blue will be defending.
    I'm not asking for those maps particularly, but could the gamemode in general be switched around when making a map?


    I would also like to ask...
    If this can be done, do you think it would be considered a major gameplay change if done in the artpass contest?
    He's afraid that Valve would not like him doing this, if it was possible.
     
  2. Ginger

    Ginger L4: Comfortable Member

    Messages:
    151
    Positive Ratings:
    44
    Traditionally, it's always Blu attacking, so i don't know how much people would be against it, :/ Imo, it could be interesting to try, but tbh, it's best to keep it how it is ;D
     
  3. HeaH

    HeaH L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

    Messages:
    553
    Positive Ratings:
    102
    You could, but it would only confuse players, so don't

    And it would definitely ruin all your chances in the artpass contest
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  4. Simski

    Simski L2: Junior Member

    Messages:
    57
    Positive Ratings:
    11
    Well then I know it's possible... but then again it being "confusing" might be considered a gameplay change for the worse :(

    Darn... his map would look so much better with the teams turned around.
     
  5. Mick-a-nator

    aa Mick-a-nator

    Messages:
    640
    Positive Ratings:
    314
    Yeah it is perfectly possible, but could very easily confuse players. The most effective but time consuming method of fixing this is to create a set of textures and models that fit the desired theme of the map. But hey, his map, ultimately up to him what to do.

    EDIT: 500 posts ^_^ where's the party? :p
     
  6. Nimelrian

    Nimelrian L2: Junior Member

    Messages:
    64
    Positive Ratings:
    6
    Imagine you would swap the teams roles on dustbowl.

    The attacking team (if the spawns would remain the same) would cap the endpoint of a stage in a couple of seconds OR the defending team would block the attacking one's spawn.
     
  7. Huckle

    Huckle L4: Comfortable Member

    Messages:
    150
    Positive Ratings:
    87
    What surprises me is how many just go "it could confuse players". Sure, red is usually the defender on attack/defend and payload maps but what about all of the others? People don't seem to be confused when they attack as red on arena, ctf, 5 point cp or plr maps.

    While I agree that making custom maps for a game is a lot about making the maps themselves similar to what already exists in the game, I also think that playing a new map in itself is more confusing than suddenly being on one team or the other. Story-wise it also makes sense that both teams would attack equally. In my mind, I have a high enough opinion of the players of custom maps that I say "go for it". I'm not sure whether it is because I'm trying to defend my own look of the art pass which I think is excellent or if it's actually a valid opinion though.

    That is unless it is hard-coded, giving a message of "you are now defending" while picking red on a map where you're actually attacking and auto-balancing teams as if one team was the defenders.
     
  8. Loc_n_lol

    Loc_n_lol L10: Glamorous Member

    Messages:
    726
    Positive Ratings:
    273
    Meh. First thing I look for when playing an unknown map is the hud. that generally tells you what the map is about. If I'm red and see 2 BLU CPs, 1 locked on my hud, I'll just assume I have to take them in order while BLU defends...
     
  9. Dr. Spud

    aa Dr. Spud Grossly Incandescent

    Messages:
    879
    Positive Ratings:
    803
    Every couple months someone posts about this.

    Spoilers:
    Can you do it: yes. Do you want to: no.

    Can't we just put this discussion to bed already?
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2010
  10. Mick-a-nator

    aa Mick-a-nator

    Messages:
    640
    Positive Ratings:
    314
    Yeah, it seems weird that people get confused by a simple switch of team criteria, but its psychology. You can give someone as many indications that Blu are defending, but unless they are rehearsed in looking for such indications, then they wont actually take note of them. Every time I've been in a test of a map with the teams switched, people always mention how odd it is to attack as Blu.

    Ok, so in short, and please please let this end the discussion, if he really thinks that making Red attack and Blu defend is the best solution, then there is nothing stopping. I mean, people might even get used to it if his entry wins and get official, so don't stress too much over it.

    Now stop talking, everyone. :p
     
  11. Nineaxis

    aa Nineaxis Quack Doctor

    Messages:
    1,767
    Positive Ratings:
    1,404
    Switching teams goes completely and entirely against the base design of the entire game.

    Don't do it.