How important is TF2 "feel" on custom maps

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by wylker, Jun 15, 2009.

  1. wylker

    wylker L1: Registered

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    I'm making a new map based on castle revelstone from the Stephen R. Donaldson books.

    Being a castle, it doesn't seem as "Cartoony" as most of the TF2 textures and maps are.

    How important is this to you? Are you less inclined to play a map if it falls outside the normal "feel" of TF2? Also, do you like cool map features that you don't generally see on maps? Or are straightforward maps more important?
     
  2. drp

    aa drp

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    overall, i think gameplay is king. if it plays GREAT who cares what it looks like. ofcourse, this is my opinion only. some people will ABSOLUTELY not play customs that dont look 'tf2-ish'.

    tf2 has a very distinct art style and many players expect whatever environment they are fighting in to have the tf2 feel.
     
  3. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

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    "less inclined"? Yes.
    That's not to say I won't play a map that doesn't fit in the style, but I'm likely to tire of playing it much sooner than one that is in style.

    But then if it is its own style, and is extremely well done, then it isn't quite as important.
     
  4. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

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    I think keeping a TF2 feel is important. You start mixing in stuff like realistic halflife textures with all the props/characters of TF2 and it just doesn't look good imo. If done right I think you can do any location/setting.

    It's a suspension of disbelief thing. Sure TF2 doesn't look realistic but when you're in game you feel like it is, everything fits together cohesively. Throw in a few halflife textures and it gives you that WTF feeling.

    cp_desperados is a great example of this. Pretty fun map, cool setting and layout. But it uses textures that are just too realistic. If it was done in more TF2 textures it would really be awesome. As it is it just pretty cool. But I still play it quite a bit on Cc and everyone enjoys it.

    But drpepper is right, the most important aspect of a map is gameplay.
     
  5. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    so long as it uses TF2 textures or custom textures that are TF2 style im 100% ok with it.
     
  6. eerieone

    aa eerieone

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    I tend to quickly turn away form maps that don´t have a tf2-style, it just hurts in mah eyes :)
    i understand that gameplay should be king, but when it feels like playing 2 games at the same time, that´s just unacceptable for me
    even if it might fit the tf2-style colorwise, if the location is too extravagant, i don´t like it. e.g cp_castle
     
  7. Icarus

    aa Icarus

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    I won't deduct any points or have any negative thoughts if you decide to stray from he style, but you will impress me if you manage to keep it.
     
  8. jpr

    aa jpr

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    This may sound a little harsh, but no matter how good the gameplay is, if the map doesn't fit the game's style it's not a tf2 map. I mean, you could convert a Css map into tf2 but that doesn't make it a tf2 map.
     
  9. MrAlBobo

    MrAlBobo L13: Stunning Member

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  10. wylker

    wylker L1: Registered

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    great links :)
     
  11. brick

    brick L3: Member

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    Interesting discussion. Since I made my map pretty much not look like tf2 I have some things to say about the tf2 style. In my map I mostly used tf2 props and textures. It seems with this community though since I have several hl2 props and textures they instantly hate it. With other communities and random gamers I find people welcome the change. I really dont care what the map looks like as long as it looks good. Mixing hl2 and tf2 props and textures doesn't look bad, its just how you do it, it could. How could people be instantly turned off to a map just because there is hl2 stuff in it, even though it plays good and looks good?
     
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  12. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    It doesnt look good though, thats the reason.

    Its like playing crysis with pokemon graphics for an example.

    HL2 textures in tf2 stick out so very bad. To "me" its a person who likes to map and doesn't give a shit for what game they map for therefor do not care for fitting the theme.

    Odd enough people who tend to do this ... tend to ..

    make said map in 5 or less days
    go from alpha to final in 4 days
    love orange, achievements and/or surf maps.

    a very select few HL2 textures can work with TF2 but not most. I'm not against trying something new, but for godsake people should at least try to remember you are mapping for TF2...make the theme work.
     
  13. brick

    brick L3: Member

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    Funny thing. I do care about what game I am mapping for and I actually spent over a year doing this map. It seems like you and other people just have a bias because you map one way and its my way or the highway. I guess it isnt a bad thing, but sometime you need to open up. I use hl2 that looks good with tf2 textures. So your saying and it seems like other people are saying it also is. If you see a hl2 prop/texture you think the person who did the map is a horrible mapper and put no time into the map? Im sorry, but thats just stupid. Their are maps that do this and look bad, but there are maps that do use hl2 textures and look good. It is very easy to blend in hl2 textures with tf2.

    Anyways, we can go around in a circle all day with this. I dont think I will ever change your view or anyone elses here that is set in their ways of, tf2 or bad.
     
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  14. MaGicBush

    MaGicBush L2: Junior Member

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    I honestly don't care if the "cartoony" style is lost on some maps it's a nice change to me, but then again I never really liked TF2's art style to begin with. I mean don't get me wrong, I obviously like TF2's gameplay as I am mapping for it. I just do not like the art style.
     
  15. Sgt Frag

    Sgt Frag L14: Epic Member

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    Another reason to consider what props/tex you use.

    Maybe you have tf2 and hl2, or orangebox. In which case it's fine.

    But if someone has tf2 and plays your map and you have a bunch of hl2 content they will get missing textures, missing objects, etc... So it will make the map uplayable to some people.

    There are a few hl2 textures and models that probably work alright in tf2 if they are general enough and kindof plain. Otherwise they do stick out like a sore thumb.
     
  16. Forthex

    Forthex L2: Junior Member

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    Back on track, concerning the OP, I think keeping the visual style of TF2 is both easy and compulsary for a map to do well. One could say that the style of TF2 is creatively stifling and has been well established: either desert or alpine. But the meta style of each is that both use textures that look/are hand drawn. The TF2 style can look good and be applied on any setting or location. So, in order to keep the TF2 style, one could just take realistic textures for any given eetting and run them through a few photoshop filters (or actually hand draw them, which would be so badass)
     
  17. fubarFX

    aa fubarFX The "raw" in "nodraw"

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    actually, I don't care if it not looking tf2ish but for christ sake don't use hl2 textures. you might try to edit the colors on egypt's textures. that'd make some nice brick wall. most will tell you egypt is not in the tf2 style but hey, at least you're not using hl2 textures.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2009
  18. UKCS-Alias

    aa UKCS-Alias Mann vs Machine... or... Mapper vs Meta?

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    Well, to me the egypt textures are tf2 stylish. they arent the style of the normal maps but is that realy needed? TF2 is all about having a look like it has been drawn/painted... this means that any textures that have that style can be used. Further, if some non tf2 like textures are used it doesnt allways make them out of place. the hazardstrip is one of them.

    And that some people say 'if valve didnt make it as a tf2 texture then its not suitable for tf2' then they havent understood that egypt didnt have valve made textures and its even added in an update. Custom textures are fine as long as they got the tf2 style, valve even likes new styles more!

    (cp_castle4 does have a nice tf2 look to me - its a bit basic but its tf2ish)
     
  19. DJive

    aa DJive Cake or Death?

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    Hardly.

    If you've looked at the two maps I've worked on you'd say differently about how i map. I do not map "this way or that way" and expect people to follow... hell I map how YOU are saying, not your traditional mapping style

    but what bothers me IS the full use of HL2 textures. Like i said, some very few textures of HL2 you can get away with *i used HL2 grass above*, but most simply will never fit in. I'd not be lying to say that ive seen an exceptional HL2 textured TF2 map.

    I'm not against "new" I'm against poorly done.
     
  20. jpr

    aa jpr

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    Sigh. Hl2 textures in tf2 maps are fine, as long as you don't notice them, but a tf2 map that looks like a hl2 map DOES NOT mean originality, it means... Stupidity. In case you haven't noticed, tf2's and hl2's art styles are quite different, and a tf2 map with hl2 textures/models just looks bad. When you say you've seen tf2 maps with hl2 textures that look good, you lie. They DON'T look good, not in tf2, in hl2 maybe, but not in tf2. Don't get me wrong, you can make your map as original as you want, but you can do so while maintaining tf2's art style, as you can see from DJive's screenshots. Using hl2 content in tf2 maps is not "new and fresh", it just shows that you don't understand that these two are different games with different art styles that shouldn't be mixed together.

    End of rant.