First areas of my MvM map

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Snowbat, Jan 19, 2014.

  1. Snowbat

    Snowbat L4: Comfortable Member

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    So I'm working on my MvM map and these are the first two areas, from Hammer.
    There are no trees, plants and details yet. It's just the raw layout (albeit textured because I have never been able to map efficiently by making dev-textured brushes first)
    I obviously intent to place fences, broken ruin-walls and more cover for the players. But I think it's better to simply test the map and see where people instinctively go for holdout.

    Any advise? Alias has already advised me to place rocks or something to make sure players don't have the feeling they're just fighting in a big square.

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/kh2qwqtta3nmbwp/mvm_inca1.jpg
    and the next area:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/markb63i1l9ne2b/mvm_inca2.jpg
     
  2. Garuda112

    Garuda112 L1: Registered

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    Alias makes a good point with the props, but it would be more important than just making the area look better. Much of the map looks very open, and it would give snipers (of both bots and players) a huge advantage. Plus, cover would allow slower classes to be safe while on the move. I heard a recommendation that there should be a piece of cover every 1000-ish units. I'd personally prefer more than that.

    Beyond that I would recommend converting some of those open spaces into corridors to not only funnel bots better but also give pyros a good chance to work their magic. That, and maybe some height variation for players to get the drop on bots.
     
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  3. SnowBall

    SnowBall L1: Registered

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    Looks like a Mvm map where you are attacked by all sides.

    Pretty nice idea continue like that.
     
  4. LeSwordfish

    aa LeSwordfish semi-trained quasi-professional

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    Whilst i like the idea of placing cover once you see where players go naturally, that doesn't really work. Naturally, players go where cover is. You need to add cover, and if players don't like it move it elsewhere.
     
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  5. Snowbat

    Snowbat L4: Comfortable Member

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    Hmmm. Interesting feedback.
    I've also decided to add a few more elevated areas. There is actually a third area that forces the bots to funnel more into narrower lanes, giving Pyro a good opportunity since there will also be a reset-pit there.
    But the first areas will indeed need more cover, even if I don't want to make it too easy on the players.

    Alias also gave me the idea of placing an underground route that doesn't go all the way to the bomb-hatch, but at least covers a part of the map to force players to watch that area too.
    However I'm not 100% sure how this will work and if it will work at all. There are some things I need to think of:
    - Can giants walk in there too? Might be OP
    - I have to add grates and openings in the surface so that players can at least see what going on down there
    - I have to make sure players can easily access the subterrainean route
    Stuff like that.

    By the way, Leswordfish, we've been playing some more of Alias' crazy yet enjoyable waves on Sundown. Once you finish that map, combined with the waves of Alias, it's gonna be awesome!
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2014
  6. henke37

    aa henke37

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    It is easy to keep the giants from taking a route. Just func_nav_avoid it. It would be a little silly if the giants were alone, so remember to give them a little company.
     
  7. UKCS-Alias

    aa UKCS-Alias Mann vs Machine... or... Mapper vs Meta?

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    Giants shouldnt be avoided by hardcoding unless it breaks the map (they get stuck). This for example would only apply to areas that arent high enough to let them pass.

    The underground tunnel should be designed to let them walk though (see the mannhattan top bridge for scaling - if im right you only need to have it either 192 or 256 units high - which in mvm is common for a tunnel)

    I would even recommend to allow the giants to use that path, its ideal to let them flank in later waves (in mannhattan you see alot of those giants coming from the bridge to force you to spread forces). However, they should only get in there with a nav_prefer. And if that path is longer for them to take it automaticly avoids most classes from getting in. Note that sentry busters also need to be able to pass that path, if you block it for giants you also need to block the busters. And that can give potential balance problems.