Engy upgrade (thoughts)?

Discussion in 'Team Fortress 2 Talk' started by TheDarkerSideofYourShadow, Sep 1, 2008.

  1. TheDarkerSideofYourShadow

    TheDarkerSideofYourShadow L10: Glamorous Member

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    So, I through this idea out to my regular server yesterday, after wrenching to death 5 or so spies.

    If you kill a spy who had sapped your SG, your SG crits for the next five seconds (after becoming unsapped). Requires more metal to build/upgrade.

    Or, another spy related idea is:

    Wrench upgrade. If you kill someone with the wrench, your next building builds faster/for less metal (not sure which it should be). However, you repair your structures for less damage with each hit (ie, swing slower).
     
  2. Hawk

    Hawk L7: Fancy Member

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    I've always liked the idea of the Engineer being able to build two level one sentries. They would never be able to go to level 2 (or maybe one could) but you could set them up in different places.
     
  3. Arhurt

    Arhurt L6: Sharp Member

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    I'd like to see:

    Belt dispenser: You build a dispenser that you carry around in your belt, so you become a mobile dispenser and have unlimited metal/ammo, but from then on you move like a Heavy (slow)

    Armored mannable sentry: A sentry immune to sapping and already lvl 3, with thick armor from the front. It must be manned, as in someone must stand behind it and aim with it (also very likely to be backstabbed).

    Two-way teleporter: A teleporter that works both ways, the trick is that your enemy can use it as well.

    But then, these are updates on the engies buildables, and so far Valve has onlu upgraded the character's weapons, so that would mean a new wrench/shotty and pistol.

    In this manner, I think the engy could get the old EMP pistol that kills equipment really fast, a shotty that does critical damage to cloacked spies and a wrench that builds/repairs faster but deals no damage.
     
  4. Shmitz

    aa Shmitz Old Hat

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    Anything that puts the spy/engy dichotomy back on an even level, instead of being grossly in favor of spies, would make me a happy engy.
     
  5. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    I've always thought about this, though you would still need to upgrade it in my idea, it would be susceptable to attack whilst you upgrade it as it is unable to defend itself. The only draw back would be that how would the engineer heal the sg whilst under attack? Would the dispenser heal it if near by? A gradual hp regeneration seemed logical but then it wouldn't be strong enough to withstand an assualt on it.

    I've liked this idea because then the sg has the ability (due to the player manning the turret) to anticipate and counter assaults on it from corners etc.

    I suppose one way to resolve this would be be for it to take significantly less damage from the front, say 50% less. A player is susceptable to backstabbing whilst mounted and the sg has extremely limited turning speed. Enough to keep up with players attempting to flank it after a frontal assault, but not enough that he can wip it around and defend his backside from a deliberate flanking manouver.

    Zappers disable it but also deal damage 50% less. To allow neighbouring engineers time to help bring the sg back. Whilst this sounds overpowered the gun is technically out of action untill its owner returns, making it incredibly vulnerable to assault.

    The armour might also only be activated whilst manned, so it is easy to take out whilst being built or user out of action.

    Pro's: Anticipation of enemy anti sg tactics, choice of multiple targets by user, strong frontal defences.

    Con's: More susceptable to attack whilst unmanned, more susceptable to flanking manouvers due to slow turn speed.

    The player weighs up it's weakness whilst being built, as well as attacks from behind and inability for sg to defend itself. With human intelligence applied to the moment. The gun is quite a strong static defence when it gets to it's final state, but is just as easy to take out if the enemy team plays their cards right.

    Only engineers should be able to man these. (don't want to have other players neglecting their roles) they would sit in it like an anti air emplacement.

    Theoretically there is no maximum range as the player has natural site.

    Secondly. I want the engineers railgun back. It was great for bouncing around snipers with it's pin point accuracy. Alternatively, the pistol could send out a shock round with a small area of effect around the shot that detonates projectiles in mid flight, effectively negating rockets and grenades. I'm not sure whether it is worth doing return damage like the pyro's airblast as this may overpower the engineer.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2008
  6. Shmitz

    aa Shmitz Old Hat

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    How about a pistol replacement that deactivates sticky bombs? I'd personally consider it overpowered, but considering how much people cry about demomen, it might be something to think about.
     
  7. MrAlBobo

    MrAlBobo L13: Stunning Member

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    as awesome as it would be to see buildable upgrades...arhurt is probably right valve just upgrading the weapons...

    oh and grazr...you quoted arhurt and referenced TheDarkerSideofYourShadow...just pointing it out...
     
  8. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    woops.. ^^

    edit: Perhaps an emp device with an area of effect. Replacing the pistol the engineer can place a circular "pad" (like the original emp grenade in appearence) onto a surface (wall, floor, ceiling). The engineer has a single emp device that can be retrieved after placement (right click) or from a locker if it is destroyed. After being placed the engineer brings up a remote with a single button on it (rather than the emp device itself). He can activate it an infinite amount of times, when activated, it "deletes" stuck sticky bombs in a defined radius (say 5 metres). The pad has to be placed at point blank range, it cannot be thrown.

    This can be used to cunningly faulter defended positions, protect an sg or spam hot spot.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2008
  9. l3eeron

    l3eeron L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

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    rail gun and upgradeable TPs
     
  10. Hawk

    Hawk L7: Fancy Member

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    Wow, I didn't think about that. Sticky bombs are the Engineer's other weakness, and it would be nice to see that addressed. and I dont' see it as being unbalanced, really. You have VERY little time to shoot away sticky bombs before they detonate.

    I would have thought that too, except I remember hearing somewhere (in an interview after the Pyro update, I believe) that they have actually already played around with a different kind of teleporter.

    I hope they upgrade at least one of the Engineer's buildings. I'd prefer that it wasn't the teleporters, though. I don't feel like they need to be messed with.
     
  11. Shmitz

    aa Shmitz Old Hat

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    It could also make engineers marginally more useful in arena, where they are pretty weak compared to other gametypes.
     
  12. A Boojum Snark

    aa A Boojum Snark Toraipoddodezain Mazahabado

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    Since this topic was brought up, I'll tell paste over the idea I had which I emailed to Robin a couple weeks ago.
    As you can see, I thought this out quite a bit :p
     
  13. Snipergen

    Snipergen L13: Stunning Member

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    Mortar gun + lazer on your pistol that shows mortar where to fire (right click with pistol)
    Only works when mortar is build outside in a reasonable distance that it can fire (building at spawn won't cover the entire map)
    Timing between shots and impact needs balancing.
     
  14. joshman

    joshman L5: Dapper Member

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    take a look at the loadout

    All he's gonna get is a new wrench a new pistol and a new shotgun.

    Nothing New, Sentry Wise!
     
  15. Dox

    Dox L8: Fancy Shmancy Member

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    You cant be sure of that. I strongly doubt valve would pass over the buildables.
     
  16. luxatile

    aa luxatile deer

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    I love that idea! I'm already getting a bit excited, hoping that they'll include it. :p

    Snipergen: I'm not sure if a mortar gun would be physically possible. It would have to fire through all kinds of weird map component stuff up there in the sky, probably even going out of bounds, in order to get to a location, at least if it were to fire reasonably far.
     
  17. Dan2025

    Dan2025 L2: Junior Member

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    Actually, couldn't Valve technically upgrade the tool which the engineer uses to build his buildings? You know, that little palm-pilot thingy? The result would be new buildings available for the engineer to build, while what was technically upgraded was the device he uses to build them.

    Wouldn't that work?
     
  18. luxatile

    aa luxatile deer

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    Yeah, I'm sure they could. It's their game, there should be no problem editing the loadout menu slightly to make space for building upgrades. After all, what they have now is just placeholder.
     
  19. grazr

    aa grazr Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle

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    Unless it didn't arc. Say for instance that a round goes up into the sky from the mortar (end) then a round falls from the sky on the location targeted. The round wouldn't technically pass through any geometry but fire up into air, then the round would "appear" above the target and fall from the skybox.
     
  20. luxatile

    aa luxatile deer

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    Ahh, well, that's possible I guess. :D