Downward spiral payload concept

Discussion in 'Mapping Questions & Discussion' started by Manta_firefly, Apr 25, 2010.

  1. Manta_firefly

    Manta_firefly L1: Registered

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    First of all, hi there to those who don't know me (I've only really been active in the showcase forum). But I thought I'd come here to talk about a map layout concept I've been thinking about and have yet to see done (as far as I can search):

    Basically, it's a payload map where Blu must move the bomb down a spiral shaped quarry to destroy red's base in the middle:

    for those who aren't following what I mean by this, here's a pair of diagrams:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Obviously these are just illustrative, as a plain spiral like that would be about as exciting as a straight line and a sniper-fest to boot. Buildings, walkways out from red's spire and a generous amount of cover would be needed, but thinking about it, there's a few unique elements to this layout:

    • There would be no need to make more than one spawnroom for each team, since gravity and shortcuts can make the journey to the bomb quick.
    • Blu won't always be following the tracks in the same direction the bomb travels, sometimes Red will be inbetween Blu and Where the bomb is
    • It's a payload map where scouts might actually have a strong purpose

    Since I have no experience of SDK beyond opening the program and being bewildered by it, I have no idea how easy this sort of thing would be to make. But I'd like to discuss the idea anyway.
     
  2. RedO

    RedO L1: Registered

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    A payload map such as this would strongly encourage Demo spam.

    No thanks.
     
  3. Nutomic

    Nutomic L11: Posh Member

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    If it would be done in a big enough scale, that wouldnt allow blu to fire at enemies below them, and enough buildings for cover and alternative paths, this might actually work out pretty well i think.

    Also, i dont think it would be harder to make than any other kind of tf2 map, just somehow different.
     
  4. YM

    aa YM LVL100 YM

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    Seeing the entire map at once would make optimisation next to impossible, it would have to be an arena/small koth sized map or else there would simply be too much stuff for the engine to render.

    Not to mention it would end up being a big pit of death as its mighty easy to fall or get blasted down, but hard and time consuming to walk back up.

    So my vote is a strong against anything like this.
     
  5. Manta_firefly

    Manta_firefly L1: Registered

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    Optimisation would be a bit of an issue now that you mention it. Unless there was some way of dividing the entire pit into quarters with aesthetically pleasing walls (The old standby of a large rocket base springs to mind). The way back up needn't be long though, simply add some stairs/ramps that go from one level to the next that both teams can use.
     
  6. Psy

    aa Psy The Imp Queen

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    I've seen heavily vertical payload maps before and the gameplay is horrid for reasons that Youme has already explained.
     
  7. Manta_firefly

    Manta_firefly L1: Registered

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    Hmmm, I see. Is it because of the spam that vertical ones fail?
     
  8. Waster

    Waster L1: Registered

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    Look at the most regular maps. Blue and red are always at the same height. Even with heavy adjusted respawn times i dont see this work. Or blue or red is on top. And its very uncomfortable for one team to play against another team that always are unreachable high and spam rockets and stickies to you.

    There is a koth map, garbage day. A sort of spiral to a cappoint. One team stands on top and spam the other team below. So its very hard to take, but when its taken back, the other team just stands there and is spamming the other team. Really boring if you ask me.

    This will only work if you make it a part of your map and not your major theme. For example the spire in badlands.
     
  9. Manta_firefly

    Manta_firefly L1: Registered

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    With that in mind, would a flattened spiral not therefore be viable? simply place walls to border the sides of the spiral and have gates open as checkpoints are taken. Would solve the issue with optimisation too.
     
  10. Randdalf

    aa Randdalf

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    Downward spiral payload: the map that gets worse and worse!

    /pun
     
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  11. Hawk

    Hawk L7: Fancy Member

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    I don't think optimization would be as big a deal if it were smaller, like it was short single round. But if you make it smaller, the demo spam comes into play. Plus, you'd need increasingly sharper turns in the cart tracks, or a certain amount straight portions getting shorter as the spiral continues. I don't think laying that track would be fun.
     
  12. Mick-a-nator

    aa Mick-a-nator

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    People get the idea of "vertical play" wrong quite frequently. Look at Half-Life 2: Lost coast and they talk about it in the commentary. Vertical play is still actually pretty linear, maybe even more so, but the path winds back and forth. THAT makes people shoot up and down. That sketch as-is would just promote spam across the pit. Sorry, that sounds harsher than intended... Anyway, this could easily work (and make optimisation easier) if the spiral was not a perfect spiral. Make the path wind about, make it go back and forth, make it undulate occasionally, and go around or through walls and stuff. This adds diversity, a fresh battle scenario in every section of track, and makes optimisation a whole load easier.
     
  13. Manta_firefly

    Manta_firefly L1: Registered

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    The idea was never to have the whole spiral open plan, the diagram being purely illustrative. If it was completely open like that, it wouldn't be the demomen you'd be worred about, more so the 8 snipers. So long as there are bits where blu team needs to pull teh bomb nearer to them as well as bits where they need to push it away, it should be interesting enough from that.
     
  14. Prestige

    aa Prestige im not gay anymore

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    [nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8palgXO3yw4&feature=related"]YouTube- TF2 pl_donkeykong_final[/nomedia]

    that in reverse?
     
  15. Manta_firefly

    Manta_firefly L1: Registered

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    Sort of, only not quite so ridiculous.
     
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