Difference between Skip and Nodraw

Dragonic

L1: Registered
Dec 30, 2011
34
3
From what I understand of the Skip and Nodraw textures (which is not much), both can be used to make brush faces invisible to players.
So what are the differences and usages of these two textures?
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
aa
Mar 4, 2008
5,441
3,814
nodraw blocks vvis, can be used to seal the map and has physics, skip is a faux texture that does what it says on the tin, it gets skipped by the compiler.
 

Dragonic

L1: Registered
Dec 30, 2011
34
3
So what you're saying is that nodraw can be used to create an invisible, solid wall but skip by itself cannot?
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
aa
Mar 4, 2008
5,441
3,814
So what you're saying is that nodraw can be used to create an invisible, solid wall but skip by itself cannot?

Yes. Though i should add that nodraw also blocks light radiosity and thus casts shadows. IIRC it also has 0 reflectivity. I should also add that because it blocks vvis you'll be able to see sections of the world get culled from behind it so it doesn't make a very effective wall.

If you want an actual invisible wall, use playerclip, or an invisible func_brush so that it blocks bullets or a func_detail blockbullet brush (its physics collisions also block players).
 
Last edited:

Vincent

&#128296 Grandmaster Lizard Wizard Jedi &#128296
aa
Sep 5, 2009
912
684
To add on to grazr, I use a normal brush with the block bullets texture if I ever need to block projectiles. I dont know the pros and cons vs using an invisible func brush but both ways work.

EDIT: Wait a func detail block bullets brush? Doesnt that block light?
 
Last edited:

Dragonic

L1: Registered
Dec 30, 2011
34
3
What do you mean by a func_detail blockbullet brush?
I thought func_detail was only used to omit a brush from being calculated by vvis? This would create an object that would be visible yet penetrable by bullet and players, right?

Thanks EArkham for the VDC links. I read through them but sometimes they aren't that clear nor helpful.

@Vincent: Silly question, what's a normal brush?
 

Vincent

&#128296 Grandmaster Lizard Wizard Jedi &#128296
aa
Sep 5, 2009
912
684
No. A func detailed brush with the block bullets texture would block all weapon fire and players. Also it would be invisible.

When I refer to a normal brush I simply mean a brush created with the brush tool. The brush tool is the blank white cube on the left in the toolbar.
 
Last edited:

Seba

DR. BIG FUCKER, PHD
aa
Jun 9, 2009
2,364
2,728
A func_detail textured in blockbullets shouldn't cast shadows.
 
Oct 6, 2008
1,947
445

Dragonic

L1: Registered
Dec 30, 2011
34
3
While reading this, I came across Area Portals (or func_areaportal). Other than windowless doors, what else can it be used for? Water?

func_areaportalwindow is interesting as well...
 
Last edited:

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
aa
Mar 4, 2008
5,441
3,814
blockbullets cuts vvis, this is why you should func_detail it. Check out badlands spire for an example. They've forgone a physics mesh for the spire prop for manually building a blockbullets brush structure for it. Not sure on the benefits for this personally, perhaps it was overtly difficult to create a physics mesh shaped like that.

areaportal windows don't get used in TF2 and for a number of subtle reasons. There's plenty of information on that on the web, no need to reiterate it here.
 

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
aa
Mar 4, 2008
5,441
3,814
I mean in a general sense, you could probably find a unique situation to utilise one so long as the "closed" sate of the portal doesn't stick out like a saw thumb (which they usually do because of TF2's art style and how levels are designed around its game mechanics to be small and simple).
 

Pocket

Half a Lambert is better than one.
aa
Nov 14, 2009
4,694
2,579
isnt there an apw in pipeline?

I don't know about Pipeline, but there's definitely one in Thunder Mountain. I think in the third stage.
 

tyler

aa
Sep 11, 2013
5,102
4,621
What? There are plenty of apw all over TF2. They don't decompile nicely afaik, but I've seen them. Wish I could remember where, but I have seen them. I want to say Foundry has a couple for some reason.

I guess the reason grazr is putting forth is that you want to see people behind windows (that is usually why we put windows in our maps) but they are used in places that aren't windows a little.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

grazr

Old Man Mutant Ninja Turtle
aa
Mar 4, 2008
5,441
3,814
What? There are plenty of apw all over TF2.

TF2 maps:

2Fort
DoubleCross
Sawmill
Turbine
Well
5gorge
Gorge
Badlands
Coldfront
Fastlane
Freight1
Foundry
Gullywash
Granary
Yukon
Degroot Keep
Dustbowl
Egypt
Gravel Pit
Junction
Mann manor
Mountain Lab
Steel
Hydro
Badwater Basin
Barnblitz
Goldrush
Hoodoo
Thunder Mountain
Upward
Frontier
Pipeline
Hightower
Nightfall
Lumberyard
Nucleus
Offblast
Ravine
Watchtower
Harvest
Viaduct
Lakeside
Eyeaduct

TF2maps that might have APW's:

Thunder Mountain
Pipeline

Regardless of that my point stands, a well optimised TF2 map has little use for APW's and they should be a last resort in minimum/insignificant gameplay areas.

APW's are used to close off parts of the map such as buildings with a ton of windows and huge amounts of high poly objects in it. You can use them in TF2 but they look like arse, often interefere with gameplay and aren't always necassery. If there are alternatives, use them. They are not advised for multiplayer maps.
 
Last edited: